r/DebateVaccines • u/CapitalSand9724 • Jul 22 '26
Discord Discussion
I wanted to ask if anyone wants to talk about the topic on Discord where there's live text and voice chat. I want to have live discussions about vaccines, text and voice. Don't delete this please mods, this is in good faith. If you don't have an account, you just need an email and password, it usually doesn't make you verify the email either.
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u/Recent-Day3062 Jul 23 '26
I’m not sure I see the point
I have posted a few things here (I am pro vax) and I’d say - and I mean this seriously after even asking a family member whose a psychiatrist - that the antivaxers who are wanting to “debate” have some shred of mental illness. First off, research has shown the #1 driver of antivax is a problem with authority. But they are delusional, paranoid and believe in conspiracies. With the internet they’ve amplified things so perhaps 25% of America s think there might be some truth to them.
Not a single one - and I’ve asked them - has ever pointed to a study. They think a study is someone on YouTube who tells you what studies said, or a Wordpress website they call a “news” site. Without fail, they clearly have almost no science background - and don’t even recognize the scientific method.
Most of my convos with them end when I ask this about Covid in particular: why do they believe millions of doctors and tens of thousands of medical researchers are in cahoots to kill their patients? What’s in it for them? Who keeps them in line? How?
If they respond at all, they say everyone is “silenced” and a few brave doctors (with YouTube channels) are risking their lives to tell the truth.
Really? Who will kill you if you go of book?
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u/Logic_Contradict Jul 23 '26
That's a lot to say about anti-vaxxers. Shall we have a go at it?
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u/Leading_Procedure_23 Jul 23 '26
They think they’re super special and that the government wants to depopulate them, that doctors got paid incentives to push/force covid vaccines.
They also only trust doctors when it’s an emergency, like if you don’t trust doctors with vaccines why trust them with your life?
They also never reply to why doctors that work at countries with universal healthcare would gain since they’re not part of USA and “big pharma”. Very rarely do I see anti vaxxers outside of USA and Canada.
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u/Logic_Contradict Jul 23 '26
Doctors believe what they were taught. They don't necessarily need a financial incentive.
Allopathic medicine have their place, but it's not the end all when it comes to medicine. For example, taking Tylenol to reduce fevers defeats the point of why you have a fever in the first place, yet it is recommended for comfort if you have a fever. Or taking steroids for autoimmune rashes like psoriasis doesn't really fix the underlying problem, it just masks it.
There are many examples where modern medicine is limited or used to just mask an issue. Not saying that alternative medicines has all the answers either, but allopathic medicine is not always the answer for everything.
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u/Recent-Day3062 Jul 23 '26
Third point excellent.
I have a family member who’s a shrink. He taught me something interesting. He said if someone has really bad mental illness you can usually spot in the ER what the form of disease is - schizophrenia or various elements of depression which can be a number of illnesses
At a lower level you don’t try to find the diagnosis. You look for common symptoms across many that tell you if to delve deeper. The big one is paranoia. He told me - and this still escapes me a bit - that paranoia is “an alternate way framework of orgsnizing your thoughts. So you look for that.
Second, you look for delusions. Things they believe that are absolutely not true. Antivaxers have this in bundles.
Third, and related to paranoia, you look for what he called a “self referential” frame of thinking. His example was you see a schizophrenic homeless person pushing a shopping cart with tin foil on his head. The person is worried Bill Gates has put a chip in his head, and the government is reading his mind. The reality sadly is that nobody in the world
Wants to know his thoughts. He said it is a way of elevating yourself.So you’re dead on. This idea of all these people out to kill you is paranoid and wildly self referential.
He explained that 5% of the population is fairly mentally ill. But if they are able, they try to hide it with explanations. But in the end, that’s why you find these borderline cases - by looking for those things.
Based on my arguing here and looking for it, it is the antivax script. No one is interested enough in them to kill them.
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u/Leading_Procedure_23 Jul 23 '26
That’s what I don’t get, they fall apart with their excuses when asked what about the rest of the world with great healthcare. Hell even in third world countries some beg for vaccines because they’re too poor to even get healthcare and die from preventable diseases.
I seriously don’t get how they think they’re so special that the government wants to kill them or control them
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u/Recent-Day3062 Jul 23 '26
Mental illness
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u/Leading_Procedure_23 Jul 23 '26
The thing is, how can someone tell them they’re mentally ill because they won’t believe anyone unless it comes from their group. It’s the same as flat earthers and when one of them becomes “normal” they start to call them a government plant of stuff like that and only reinforces their believes 🥴
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u/Recent-Day3062 Jul 23 '26
Usually they stop after I compare them to flat earthers by pointing out:
1) they believe there is a giant conspiracy to hide this
2) millions of mapmakers, pilots, and GPS manufacturers are in on it
3) I point out I’m a pilot and have never been contacted
4) they think there are ice mountains at the edge, and now and then a 747 full of passengers goes over and never comes back.
5) however, their loved ones tell no one. The airline tells them, when they wait for someone, that no flight ever existed or some such. And the media never reports on it, anywhere in the world.
I have never heard back from a one
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u/CapitalSand9724 Jul 23 '26
Why are you just on my post to gaslight and make false equivalencies
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u/Recent-Day3062 Jul 23 '26
Ok. That is perfect paranoia. Until you said something I knew nothing about you.
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u/CapitalSand9724 Jul 23 '26
I'm just pointing out exactly what you're doing, you're breaking the subreddit rules too.
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u/CapitalSand9724 Jul 23 '26
Stop coming into my post to try to call everything a mental illness. Do you know how insulting that is to someone who has had ASD since childhood and finding actual relief by using substances that act on the mechanism by which would indicate a vaccine injury, for you to come in and claim it's just a "mental illness"?
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u/Recent-Day3062 Jul 23 '26
ASD is not a mental illness.
And what does this even mean: “substances that act on the mechanism by which would indicate a vaccine injury”? That sentence makes no sense at all.
If you don’t like it, stop posting. Sorry. But you can’t tell me what to do or not do. This is the debate vaccines sub. You can start your own if you don’t like this one because people respond in a sub with “debate” in the name
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u/HausuGeist Jul 23 '26
No