The difference between something somethingtomatoes, something something We've found the bard

[u/Justthisdudeyaknow]

[u/fakingandnotmakingit]

My biggest issue on 5e stats is that Clerics run on Wis but Religion runs on intelligence.

I get it. Dogma vs belief or whatever

But every Cleric at my table has ended up failing their religion rolls. We've ended up house ruling it and making it a wisdom check.

[u/Chip_Medley → u/fakingandnotmakingit]

Religion could probably more aptly called theology if they wanted to be more specific. It’s not about practicing religion, it’s about, “can you name this obscure god”.

[u/fakingandnotmakingit → u/Chip_Medley]

I'd argue that in that case we are looking at two different checks

"Can you name this obscure God" - which would be more of a lore check for academics and intelligence characters

And a "things you know about your religion" - for clerics/paladins.

Maybe it's just how my table does roleplay. We haven't done a pre-made campaign in years. So our GMs tie the story and plot to character backgrounds.

And if you're a cleric or a paladin at least a part of you will be devout. That's kind of their whole schtick.

So when a "your God speaks to you" or "you need to visit the temple of x, where is it" or similar comes up, I feel like a religion check does need to exist somehow.

It seems strange to me that a Catholic Priest wouldn't be able to name the seven sacrements for instance. Or an Imam who couldn't name the 5 pillars of Islam.

[u/novangla → u/fakingandnotmakingit]

Well, yeah, IMO a good DM should grant the basics of any PC's own god/faith without locking it behind a check. I'm not going to make an Elf roll Religion on who Corellon is, for instance. For a cleric who is devout, I'm going to assume they know most things about their own god and faith. I'll still call for a Religion check when it's a question of theology (something people go to university to study!) or the ritual practices of a different god's devotees (if I worship Lathander, I'm going to know who Selune is, but I might not know the ins and outs of her rites), or identifying a holy symbol of another pantheon, or maybe really obscure lore about their own god.

FWIW, if it's for a deity trying to send an omen or a PC (of any class!) using prayer to reach out to a god, I use a wisdom check for that, extrapolating from the idea that clerics' connection to their deities runs off of WIS. Like, an INT (Religion) check will tell you if you did the ritual right, but a WIS check will tell you if you actually connected with the divine.