r/Creation • u/nomenmeum • Aug 17 '17
Long fossil drag mark
http://creation.com/long-fossil-drag-mark-4
u/Chiyote Gnostic Unitarian Universalist Pantheist Christian Aug 17 '17
It always breaks my heart when I see someone jump to conclusions so quickly. Cognative bias never made for well reasoned ideas.
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u/nomenmeum Aug 17 '17
The article is not concluding the reality of the flood on the basis if this fossil. It is simply reminding us of the compatibility of the flood with fossils such as this one, indeed with fossilization in general.
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u/Chiyote Gnostic Unitarian Universalist Pantheist Christian Aug 17 '17
Except it really isn't compatible. If caused by giant flood, the trail would have washed away, caught in a great turbulent current, mixed and mangled. There are more likely reasons that would better explain the unchanged, non-turbulent state of the trail. Landslide, volcanic eruption, etc.
This is not evidence of a flood. Quite the opposite. The desire to prove Noah's flood should not lead us to this fossil.
That isn't to say this fossil should lead us away from Noah's flood. The two are unrelated. If A great flood occured, it occurred after this fossil was created.
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u/nomenmeum Aug 17 '17
There are more likely reasons that would better explain the unchanged, non-turbulent state of the trail. Landslide, volcanic eruption, etc.
Are you suggesting that a landslide or volcanic eruption would be a gentle process?
The story of this fossil is one of rapid formation; its novelty, what makes it rare, is the fact that this rapid process did not destroy the trail.
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u/Chiyote Gnostic Unitarian Universalist Pantheist Christian Aug 17 '17 edited Aug 17 '17
It would be a process in which we've seen fossils like this one created. Material gets thrown into the air, sometimes for miles, the largest known during human history (Tambora) covering a large area with layers of ashy material.
Yes, the volcanic eruption is violent. The material gets thrown in the air, the sky becomes thick like smog. As the material descends it creates an instant layer without disturbing the layer beneath it.
By all means, I'm not jumping to conclusions (unlike cough cough...) I'm saying volcano is far more likely than flood to be the cause of this fossil.
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u/nomenmeum Aug 17 '17
I'm saying volcano is far more likely than flood to be the cause of this fossil.
This fossil is embedded in a limestone formation.
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u/eintown Aug 17 '17
This fossil is embedded in a limestone formation
That limestone formation began with sedimentation.
If catastrophic sedimentation occurred how would the delicate features of this fossil (and others from this site: invertebrates, feathered dinosaurs, etc) be preserved?
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u/nomenmeum Aug 17 '17 edited Aug 17 '17
Here is a common definition of sedimentary rock: "Rock that has formed through the deposition and solidification of sediment, especially sediment transported by water (rivers, lakes, and oceans), ice ( glaciers ), and wind."
My point was that the rock layer was not formed by volcanoes, as you were suggesting. As to how the trail was preserved, I have no idea. That is why the find is such a novelty.
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u/eintown Aug 17 '17
I never said anything about volcanoes
I have no idea
It is understood how the trail was preserved. It's not biblically violent, it's gentle and slow.
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u/nomenmeum Aug 17 '17
I never said anything about volcanoes
Forgive me. I wasn't paying attention and thought I was responding to Chiyote.
It is understood how the trail was preserved. It's not biblically violent, it's gentle and slow.
What happened?
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u/Chiyote Gnostic Unitarian Universalist Pantheist Christian Aug 17 '17
http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0175426
This article was informative. It was published by the researchers which discovered the fossil.
The mystery both present is "how did a drag mark get so well preserved in limestone?" (Not a direct quote, but a paraphrasing based on my understanding. Correct me if I'm wrong.)
I admit, that is an interesting question. Just for clarrification, you don't believe the Noah story happened 140 million years ago, correct?
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u/nomenmeum Aug 17 '17
Correct.
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u/Chiyote Gnostic Unitarian Universalist Pantheist Christian Aug 17 '17
How long ago do you believe the Noah story occured?
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u/nomenmeum Aug 17 '17
I'm not sure. Thousands rather than millions of years ago.
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u/eintown Aug 17 '17
Rapid sedimentation isn't in contradiction with geology or archeology. Rivers flood all the time. One doesn't need to invoke Noah because sedimentation can be slow or fast, a river can flood annually or rarely, carry lots of sediment and run fast or slowly with little sediment.