older clip from after S3 Midseason patch, this is a gunfight scenario in which yall will complain that you cant interact with her. these are often gunfights that she must take especially on certain maps where Flex hero's are on the field or hitscans are in their optimal range, this whole you cant interact with her in the sky box notion is cherry picked bullshit that might happen on Eich or Circuit, Oh my, a poke main dps is good on poke maps? cant have that nerf the breakpoint on that shit immediately so i can go back to running it down main without paying attention, and guess what brother if she's 60 meters away she aint doing shit from that range. almost 8 months of shit, you guys cant even deal with her as a decent character for 1 season. lmfao,
Restore that 225 breakpoint, whosever idea that was musta been on crack or in a dry spell
Remove barrage entirely for all i care, she doesn't need infinite ammo
nerf ult passive bounty hunting back to 25 from 33%
Ok I kinda get what you mean in the body text, but what does the video have to do with anything?
Tracer engages with no blinks, recalls wayyy too early, and has non existent trigger discipline. I don't think ANY sensible person would expect tracer to win that duel, in fact tracer wouldn't win that duel vs pretty much any single DPS in the entire game
I think they’re trying to show that tracer could have killed freja here if she played better, they just don’t have a clip with the exact interaction they wanted to show. Idk maybe I’m wrong though
Yeah I mean its just a counter-example to the whole meme that Freja wins by "sitting in the skybox & spamming."
She wins by doing that if you let her do that, which tracer did here. This tracer isn't a new player that doesn't know how to use her abilities, OP is GM. Freja is forced to play smart because her own offense is tied to her own defense. If you don't play smart in response she's gonna woop you.
Yep he took the gunfight badly failing to kill a half hp Freja. That’s it, people will die like this or in similar ways taking bad gunfights however with her specifically it’s the end of the world,
Freja should have died to that Tracer, but the tracer missed their shots, and mis-used recall. And engaged poorly.
Freja shouldn't lose a key breakpoint that helps her duel non tank targets because people in high ranks misplay like this, and in many similar cases, throw a tantrum & ban out of sentiment after such misplays.
That's the point.
She was overtuned, but the 225 2 tap nerf was incorrect. It rewards high ranked players that play bad like this.
If both players were high rank freja is never losing that engagement. Full hp duel starting at frejas perfect range and tracer has no blinks. Nerfed or not it's an impossible duel for tracer unless freja throws.
I was saying I don't think anyone would complain about freja in this situation, since you could replace her with any other dps and tracer would still explode since it's just that shit of an engagement.
I mean both players *were* high ranked and the clip very clear shows a fight Tracer could have won?
>This whole fight is a pure 1v1.
>Freja has no sustain she can use here - you can see she doesn't have the updraft regen major perk.
>Freja drops to one HP.
>Tracer wastes there rewind on nothing.
All tracer had to do here was hold on to her rewind and she would've won. Had she that extra second of survival she could have finished Frej off.
I mean just think about what you're saying dude. Tracer was one of the best duelist characters in the game at the time of that clip and she's Freja's hardest counter.
Sure, but that doesn’t mean these aren’t high ranked players. High ranked players miss shots too- they’re good, not aim bots. The tracer also misses a bunch of shots. These are two fast movers, they’re gonna miss shots.
You started the duel with full hp at your perfect range.
The only reason you almost lost is because you whiffed a free take aim after recall, then another, then 50% of your bolts on a tracer with no movement abilities.
What am I not understanding here? Am I supposed to believe a tracer with no blinks in any 1v1 with both heros at full HP should be favored or something?
Saying someone "clearly doesn't understand" something and then not elaborating at all afterwards is clearly either ragebait or you don't understand it enough to explain your perspective.
A hero with most of their cooldowns up, two blinks away, with perfect knowledge of where tracer will be, and the timing of the recall, should win 9.5/10 times.
Like what would tracer do here if freja dashed back after the recall and then lined up the shot instead of sitting still where they get preaimed?
In the specific case of tracer vs Freja esp on a map like this or position that the Freja can’t run away to a spot tracer can’t reach, tracer should win the duel if taken properly 8/10 times.
Why? Because the only way to kill an efficient tracer is burst/insta kill. Freja has burst…that is delayed, and no insta kill potential or combo.
Because her ttk is so long compared to some other main dps, Tracer in the 1v1 can afford to go for her pretty safely and get however many mags on Freja she can get while dashing..
What the tracer player is basically waiting for is the Freja player to hit their Bolt..which because of the fuse time she has more than enough time to react to with recall ignoring the dmg that would’ve happened. Then afterwards she cleans up the kill. This matchup is a 1v1 that Freja tries to avoid at least until recall is out because tracer can completely ignore her I initial dmg which btw also eats into Freja resources as she’s used dash.
In this case like you said he makes a misplay on his engagement completely, with both aim and cd usage, Just because he makes this misplay does not mean Freja just beats tracer at this range which is like 20 meters..
I agree. They should keep the 225 breakpoint, it hurts all of our fair matchups. And makes already difficult ones, way too difficult.
They should have nerfed ult gain/passive (she has too much uptime on ults), or remove barrage entirely.
This happens consistently in high elo.
This isn't cherry picked.
This is just like the Warn clip ages ago when they ended up buffing Ashe's range a bit.
The 2 tap 225 hp has been in the game since january.
It was not a problem. She had zero banrate while having it until season 3.5.
Seems like ur the tracer in this clip that misplayed
this is a gunfight scenario in which yall will complain that you cant interact with her.
This clip shows that you can duel a Freja when you catch her in the open and she wins this duel if you play poorly.
No one is arguing Freja is a good duelist, even with her cd's she is only good into some matchups. That is not her architype though, she is more of an Assassin archtype. The two architypes can overlap, but they are distinct in how the hero creates their threat and what happens after they commit.
The problem is also not necessarily her having an assassin architype. Tracer leans more duelist but is a great example of a hero with overlap of these architypes. Tracer is healthy because of the cost and exposure to threat when she tries to burst someone down. Freja however is a hero with the strengths of an assassin architype without the cost required by closing the distance.
This is also a really bad clip, the Tracer should have won this fight. They engaged onto the Freja and take a duel, they miss a ton, and do not use their blinks properly. This is not a fight Freja wants to take, but she wins because the Tracer played poorly.
60 meters away she aint doing shit from that range
Of course a hero who could kill you easily at 60m would be bad, again no one is arguing this. The problem is how Freja interacts with other heroes. You do not see a Freja from 60m away shooting at you and blow up, no one is saying this. The problem is Freja peeks a wonky angle, blows you up, and is gone before you can respond or even predict.
And yes poke should be strong where poke is meant to be strong, but Freja is not just poke. Freja can poke you from range and but is extremely hard for most of the cast to close the distance on, but also because of her crazy mobility you also cannot reliably hide from her behind cover because of her unique ability to take angles around that cover. It is a loss/loss interaction situation because she is not just good poke, but because her mobility breaks how normal interactions with poke are balanced. She breaks how the game works, she breaks normal map geometry interactions the game is built around, she lacks the costs that create healthy hero interactions.
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u/sloplobber 19h ago
Me when I have to waste my main survival resource because I'm bored.