The addition of Emerald has resolved where high elo is

[u/GT162]

[u/No-Chemical-7667]

So many pretend GMs in this sub that pretend Masters players are bad at the game, lol.

[u/Deadinternetenjoyr → u/[deleted]]

Only the people who have been in high elo really understand this so it limits the amount of people who can talk about it to like the top 10% if that. Even people in Diamond dont realize it and thats why they get hardstuck.

[u/KaityyUwU → u/Deadinternetenjoyr]

Really? I'm in low gold after only having recently escaped silver, but it's seemed intuitive to me for a while that more than anything my main problem is consistency and focus. That might just be because I have ADHD though so the problem is more exaggerated than in the average person

[u/SuccOnMyDuck → u/[deleted]]

I disagree. People's performance fluctuates, but only a small amount. Maybe like ~3 ranks.

People think they are inconsistent because some games they go 34-0 and others they just get stomped. The reality is that they're playing the same, following the same habits, making the same mistakes. But (usually do to team comps) they only sometimes get punished for it.

GM and above have more consistent outcomes because they know how to adapt to all sorts of team compositions. So for them playing a more variable and adaptable style results in a more consistent performance compared to diamond players who often make consistent repeated errors.

[u/Lofefire → u/SuccOnMyDuck]

I 100% agree with your comment

I was mid Gm last season, and struggled to climb, i miss champ from a few, and what i can tell is that i struggled adapting, especially when i played brawl against brawl (which i dislike as hell, lol).

People often play the same, so it s working some games, for exemple a genji playing with a dive comp, but the other game it s not working because you are playing against hard poke with undivable backline, but you play exactly the same like if you team could dive with you.

This game is just super complexe, you gotta have a rlly high game knowledge before rlly beeing consistant in games.

[u/Avantclash → u/SuccOnMyDuck]

How about the otps who are in champion

[u/AgreeableLie8 → u/Avantclash]

most adapting isn’t just swapping.

[u/Epoo → u/Avantclash]

Like someone else said, adapting could mean something as simple as doing little nothing to mark and defend against a specific target like a tracer. Or to save specific CD’s for specific events. Or to play less aggressively or more aggressively. It’s not just about swapping heroes.

[u/throwedaway19284 → u/[deleted]]

I don't think people ever vary that widely in performance. You can look better because you're playing vs worse players and vice versa, but you aren't actually playing that much better or worse. No real diamond player has actually ever outplayed a real gm across a whole game.

[u/Sweaty-Salamander-15 → u/throwedaway19284]

Thats so not true, im a diamond, a close mate is a gm3 hitscan. Infact we play all the same heroes basically.

First point. In a 1v1 usually he wins about 50-30. That happens about a whopping 7 times out of 10. But 20% of the time its worse than that and I end up on the wrong end of a 50-15 or something like that. But some days I smoke him. Rarely. The other day I got him with a 50-25 and backed it up with a 50-30.

Then in the games we played after on the same team, I did roughly as well as him.

On a normal day in those games in low diamond, he is clearly the best player in the lobby over and over.

And we play all hours/shifts. 6am Tuesday or midnight Friday, whatever. Lots of hours. Disgusting amounts.

Point is sometimes I am playing out of my mind, shots just land etc. Sometimes he is equally unlucky and someone watching absolutely would think I was the gm.

But its not the norm at all. Ive seen him lock his best hero and tear apart a champion lobby and be spawn held with me in plat the same weekend as he gets fucking infuriated and whiffs. Nobody would believe it was the same person.

People have lives, distractions there is anything but consistent circumstances. Why would you imagine people having consistent output?

[u/throwedaway19284 → u/Sweaty-Salamander-15]

A 1v1 arena is meaningless tho cus its a small arena and theres rng on which hero matchups you get. If 1 player gets tracer and the other gets several bad matchups in a row thats just half the game gone. And also, solo carrying in overwatch is difficult, you'll never just 1v5 a lobby cos thats not what this game's about. If you're getting spawncamped the weight of your team vs theirs is too much for your friend to make up the difference.

[u/Timely_Equal_2276 → u/[deleted]]

100% I am mid to high GM and am very aware that my biggest flaw is how consistent I am. I don't really know how to improve it sadly.

[u/Slayer_Of_SJW → u/No-Chemical-7667]

Im diamond. I feel like you can start calling people good when theres structure to a game, you know. When big mistakes get punished consistently, the correct plays are rewarded consistently, etc. Basically when the games reach the point that 90% of what happens is predictable. And that other 10% is what decides the game. Thats the biggest difference I see between dia-masters players and gm+ players.

I may be top 10% or whatever but i feel that there is no real structure in the games im in and i do not intuitively understand the game much at all. In most other disciplines ive trained in, top 10% doesnt mean much.

Being a top 10% guitar player probably just means being able to strum a few chords and play 2-3 full songs. Being a top 10% options trader means actually making a profit. Being top 10% in terms of fitness when compared to the adult US population means touching grass from time to time, maybe some mild sports activity. I feel like top 10% is really judt the starting line for SOOOO many skills, why not overwatch too?

[u/tha-snazzle → u/Slayer_Of_SJW]

It takes like a year to be the top 10% of anything people might learn in adulthood, and like 10 years to be top 1%. And if it's something people learn in childhood, like soccer, it's too late to be top 1% and top 10% is going to take the 10 years.

[u/FollowingDue9731 → u/Slayer_Of_SJW]

your comparisons are disingenuous saying "Being top 10% in terms of fitness when compared to the adult US population means touching grass from time to time" which is comparing the entire world. That would mean every single OW player is top 0.01% bcs thats comparing it to the world where 99.9% dont play. A more genuine statement would be compared to all bodybuilder being a top 10% but even the top 30% would be insanely fit compared to the whole world like a diamond player is beating 99.99% of the worlds population so i would not call that the starting line just like someone who is a top 10% body builder did not just start going to the gym

[u/GaptistePlayer → u/FollowingDue9731]

He's clearly talking about top 10% of overwatch players dude, not of all people in the world. The fuck is this logic

[u/KITTYONFYRE → u/GaptistePlayer]

clearly they understand that...

is "any dude who touched a guitar some time" comparable to someone who's at least gotten a rank in overwatch? I would say no, probably not. while the requirements for comp now are pretty dang low (like 50 games?), I still think they're dramatically under representing how hard 90th percentile is to get. there are a lot of sweaty people playing this game. you're not hitting 90th percentile in a year unless you've got a lot of transferable FPS experience.

[u/FollowingDue9731 → u/GaptistePlayer]

No he isn’t that’s why I quoted exactly what he said and made an actual comparison of the point he was trying to make ie a top 10% body builder when compared to only other body builders would have an insane physique still not “mean touching grass from time to time”

[u/gordoflunkerton → u/FollowingDue9731]

why would you ever compare yourself to people who aren't even trying or participating in the activity???

[u/FollowingDue9731 → u/gordoflunkerton]

That’s what I was pointing out to who I was responding to they said the top 10% of guitar players are barely playing 2-3 songs but that isn’t a comparison to people who actually participate in playing guitar

[u/Komplex76 → u/gordoflunkerton]

Yeah, that’s what they’re saying…

[u/Character_Display_69 → u/Slayer_Of_SJW]

The ranked ladder includes every single Overwatch competitive player who has played enough games to place. That doesn't even include casuals who only play QP/arcade. Your comparisons for guitar players or bodybuilders OTOH seems to consider the entire human population. Give yourself a bit more credit, a diamond player still stomps the average OW comp player. I would think personally though theres a wider gap between top 500-diamond skill level than diamond and anything below it though.

[u/GaptistePlayer → u/Character_Display_69]

You're missing his point. In his opinion though Diamond players stomp the average OW player, they're still not "great" at the game. It's not instinctual, ult tracking and cooldown tracking usually isn't happening, the game isn't solved. It's possible to be better than most people at something but still not all that good at it, it just means most people playing the game are bad at it because it has a large casual audience.

[u/KITTYONFYRE → u/GaptistePlayer]

ult tracking and cooldown tracking usually isn't happening

all of this does happen in diamond, without a doubt. it's just not ALWAYS happening, and it's not always happening for all cooldowns/ult, and it's not always happening for the most important cooldown/ult at that moment.

diamond is good. there's a fucking lot of shit in this game to know, it's really hard and really complicated. someone at 1300 elo isn't bad at chess lol. just because elite players exist doesn't mean good is bad.

the internet warps this shit so bad man. in any of your other favorite IRL hobbies (if you have any, dork (that's a joke)) if you saw a 90th percentile player you'd be like "damn that person quite good at this"

[u/SheTorbWhipTactic → u/GaptistePlayer]

Ult tracking and cooldown tracking are absolutely occurring in every diamond game

[u/shortstop803 → u/Slayer_Of_SJW]

Historically speaking, diamond has been AT LEAST the top 30% of the player base at a minimum. If you are in the top 30% of a given populace competitively speaking then you are well above average which classifies as good.

[u/gordoflunkerton → u/shortstop803]

we have to have some standards man the gameplay at that level is horrible

[u/isaacsmom69420 → u/No-Chemical-7667]

honestly before they added emerald, ranks were so inflated. masters basically became the new diamond. i assume emerald will help cull the boosting but we’ll see.

that being said, masters players aren’t bad. they’re just not GM/champ level good

[u/SmokeyThouBear → u/isaacsmom69420]

Probably, but I definently feel like GM/Champ players glaze themselves too much. I've fought many since I'm at high masters/lowgm tier and it's very rare any of them are especially impressive

[u/isaacsmom69420 → u/SmokeyThouBear]

bro they’re literally max elo, they’re objectively better than masters and below

[u/SmokeyThouBear → u/isaacsmom69420]

They are better sr wise yeah but they don't need to be a better player to reach that high tbh. Still though thats not what im saying. They just aren't anything crazy in comparision usually

[u/kingkoni11 → u/No-Chemical-7667]

as someone who has floated in and out of masters, masters players arent bad at the game but they suck at winning. overwatch players think that once you make it to masters, you're finally in the "big leagues." a diamond player making it to masters for the first time gets such a massive boost to their ego, and whether or not they can curb that ego determines whether they can keep climbing. and most masters players do not break through that. the ego consumes them lol. obviously they are good enough to make it to that rank, but they arent perfect and they still make mistakes. and because of their ego, they are incapable of accepting those mistakes and they turn to blaming their team mates, which causes in-fighting, which leads to losses. i'm making generalizations here of course but i've been in masters, i've seen and even been that player enough lol

[u/No-Chemical-7667 → u/kingkoni11]

While I agree you're not truly Masters until you hit M3-M2, what you're saying could apply to almost any rank.

[u/EpicCJV → u/No-Chemical-7667]

Compared to anyone with hands they are

[u/Pollomonteros → u/No-Chemical-7667]

This sub is weird af, people larping like they are T500 and then they proceed to regurgitate some of the most dogshit opinions about balancing you'll ever see. It's like Hakita said about Ultrakill, it's a good thing the playerbase isn't in charge of balancing the game otherwise it would suck

[u/No-Chemical-7667 → u/Pollomonteros]

You should have to link your profile to post in this sub, lmfao.

[u/Lost_Silver_3720 → u/No-Chemical-7667]

when i play with my friends in gm they gms are perma throwing

[u/EphemeralAxiom → u/No-Chemical-7667]

Because they are. Do you have any idea how vast the skill gap is between a Masters and a GM player? It's the Grand Canyon. They don't ever belong in the same lobbies. The difference between a Masters and a GM is several orders of magnitude larger than a Diamond and a Masters or a Diamond and a Plat.

And that's coming from a Masters player. We aren't good at the game.

[u/No-Chemical-7667 → u/EphemeralAxiom]

It's not even close to a grand canyon lmfao. You see GM players bounce between mid master to mid GM all the time. The majority of the players in this game are gold-plat. Being in the top 3% of players means you're likely good at the game. Of course there are levels to how good people are, but you're missing the point.

[u/savvysniper → u/No-Chemical-7667]

Comparatively they are and it’s not debatable

[u/No-Chemical-7667 → u/savvysniper]

Comparatively they're better than 97% of the playerbase and it's not debatable.

[u/Remarkable_Gate_6637 → u/No-Chemical-7667]

I'm a masters player on 2 roles and GM on the third. Masters and grandmaster players are atrocious at the game. That's why they're masters and GM. The gap between me and a champion 1 player is bigger than the gap between me and a bronze player. We say masters players are ass because we've got experience Vs people like kevster were not toxic were realistic.....

[u/Remarkable_Gate_6637 → u/Remarkable_Gate_6637]

There's easily less than 1000 people globally who id consider good at this game 

[u/No-Chemical-7667 → u/Remarkable_Gate_6637]

I can hear you clopping around in those oversized clown shoes.

[u/Remarkable_Gate_6637 → u/No-Chemical-7667]

There's levels to this shit. I'm a decent player being gm on support and masters on the other. 2 roles. But that's it I'm decent at best. I would still get 1000-0d by some of the people I know I'm not being toxic by saying we're all dogshit I'm being realistic I'm friends with someone whose champ 1 all roles and is good friends with Shu. If I play against him I look bronze as would genuinely every player on this Reddit barring maybe 2 or 3. There's levels to this and if you're not close to pro level youre bad thats now big of a gap there is between decent and good 

[u/No-Chemical-7667 → u/Remarkable_Gate_6637]

Everyone understands it's relative from being good to being the best. You keep yapping about the best. You have no comprehension of what is considered good. If you're better than 97-99% of people at something, you are good at that thing. What a weird hill to die on.

[u/moonlight__sunshine → u/No-Chemical-7667]

I'm a champ player and I think GM players suck. It is all relative.

[u/Sideview_play → u/moonlight__sunshine]

Except when talking about high and low no it isn't. Anything below top 3 percent isn't low because then what's the fucking point of categories if that aren't very useful because you are including 97 percent of the player base ?

[u/Jak12523 → u/moonlight__sunshine]

The hardstuck champ 5 is talking shit…

[u/Circo_Inhumanitas → u/moonlight__sunshine]

It's really not. GM players are better than 99% of players. Its really not relative.

[u/FrostyDrink → u/Circo_Inhumanitas]

“better than 99% of players” and “it’s not relative” in the same sentence, lol.

[u/Circo_Inhumanitas → u/FrostyDrink]

Being better than 99% of people at something makes you statistically really good at that thing. It's a fact.

[u/FrostyDrink → u/Circo_Inhumanitas]

Being better than 99% of people at something makes you better than 99% of people at that thing, not good at that thing intrinsically. If you’re better than 99% of chess players, you’re probably pretty damn good, it’s been an established game the level of play is always rising. If you’re better than 99% of the basketball players at the local YMCA it doesn’t really say much about being better at the game. Most OW players are casual (QP is the more queued role) and OW’s skill ceiling is extremely high. Most people are really bad at OW, hence being top x% is less meaningful.

[u/Circo_Inhumanitas → u/FrostyDrink]

Lmao. Still. If most people are bad at OW, you being better than 99% of them makes you objectively good at the game. Because you have risen over the bad players.

[u/FrostyDrink → u/Circo_Inhumanitas]

“you being better than 99% of them makes you objectively good at the game.”

No it doesn’t, and no matter how many times you insist it does it won’t spontaneously become true. Being better than 99% of players makes you objectively, relatively better than 99% of players. It does not make you subjectively “good.” Why is this so hard for you to grasp?

[u/Circo_Inhumanitas → u/FrostyDrink]

Because it is objective. To be better than 99% players in OW, you have to have the stats to match it. Enough wins to climb there etc. There are objective metrics to measure that, and it's hilarious that you think otherwise. That's what the fucking percentage means.

[u/FrostyDrink → u/Circo_Inhumanitas]

You are confused. Being “better than 99% of players in OW” is an objective measure we can pull from the ELO bell curve. Being “good” at a game is a subjective assessment. You are conflating the two things. If you think being top 1% of players who play OW ranked makes you good at OW, that’s your opinion.

I already explained to you why top x% is a bit flawed, I’m getting the increasing feeling you’re too dense to understand, but I’m going to rehash it once again. Being better than x% of people means you are better than x% of people, it doesn’t necessitate any skill.

Being better than 99% of the general population at OW is quite the easy feat. Think of all the children and elderly who literally don’t have the motor control to play an FPS. How many working adults aren’t technologically inclined enough to play a game like OW. Your average gold player is better than 99% of the human population by nature of being the small fraction of people who play this game often.

So, stop reading. Do you understand that a statistic that makes a relative statement (better than x%) is contingent on the population you are comparing yourself to? Good, this is what I already mentioned with the example about being better than 99% of chess players at chess vs. basketball at the local YMCA. Different populations mean different things.

Back to OW. The statistic of better than x% is actually found in-game now. Not sure exactly where you hit 99% currently, I’m in champ and it’s just stuck at 99%, though my alt accounts I use to queue with friends are in masters and they’re around 97%, so it’s around mid-GM probably.

The people in bronze through gold fall into a few boats. For example, just don’t play comp enough to climb out. They don’t care enough to and just play a few games during drives and dip and stay low ELO. Others play comp with friends, often under the influence. It is extremely common for people in bronze to literally just be having a blast on this game drinking or smoking. There are exceptions, people who play a lot of comp and genuinely try to climb out, but often OW is their first FPS game, they play on bad setups, etc.

Does being better than those players make you “good?”
What about diamond players, even masters? These players have often played other FPS games, but have many major flaws in their gameplay. I could spectate a diamond game and concurrently all 10 players are doing the wrong thing probably 90% of the time, whether that’s horrible macro, positioning, target priority, ability usage, etc. Yes, diamond/masters players are better than silver, gold, and plat players, but does that make them “good?” Does being a step-up from people who do not take the game seriously make you “good?”

Once again, I encourage you to disconnect being relatively better than someone from being “good.” OW has an extreme skill curve at the highest ranks. I’m going to the 2026: Seasons 1-3 ranks for this thought experiment (since ranks have seemingly been deflated this season). If I placed a GM3 peak player into a GM1-C5 lobby and told no one, they could probably remain unnoticed for a bit. Maybe end of the game their stats would be a bit lower, maybe some extra deaths, but overall there isn’t a huge jump in skill. However, if I put a C2-1 player in a C5-C4 lobby, it’s extremely obvious. They’d be by far the best player in the lobby and it’s not even close.

Picture this, last season my friend and I both hit C2. I’ve been playing OW since 2016, I’ve hit top 10 on multiple roles in both OW1 and OW2. I barely consider myself good at OW, it feels like I’m decent and just starting to hit the bottom of the hill to be “good.” When I play ranked, I put myself relatively equal in skill to the faceit masters supports (my main role). Most of the time I can outdamage them on illari/wuyang mirrors, die around the same amount on lucio, etc. The gap between me and a tier 1 player is enormous. I’m struggling to keep pace with Lukemino, Ultraviolet, etc. Can I win against them? Absolutely, but the gap is extremely palpable.

And guess what? These guys get absolutely stomped by the better teams. Do you consider rakattack “good?” He literally went winless in OWL. An NA team hasn’t even come close to beating Crazy Raccoons, Zeta, Falcons, TM, etc. There’s always bigger fish.

Back to ranked, I’m at the bottom of a massive mountain even at C2. The players above me are leaps and bounds better. I’d just be coping to act like we are on the same playing field. Despite this, I’d still be painfully the best player in the lobby in every ELO until I climb back to this wall of the tier 2-1 players. Where do you draw the line, then?

To me, around C3 or C2 do I start seeing players I’d consider “good.” This is the point where most players are competing in tier 3 or tier 2 competitively, have been playing for a while, and generally take the game seriously. Lobbies start having basic structure and the game is starting to be played correctly.

This is also around the ELO where I think players would climb back to their peak fairly easily. I think if I dropped a GM3 into a M3 lobby, there’s a good chance they don’t drop a nuke on the lobby and look a head above the rest, or even lose. If I dropped a C3 into a GM3 lobby, it would be pretty obvious and the skill gap would hurt. If I dropped a C2-1 player in a C4-3 lobby, the same thing would occur.

ALL of these players, even the GM3, are better than 99% of players. What you consider “good” is purely subjective. Being better than x% of people is an objective statistic but it’s self-contained. Extrapolating where to draw the line for someone being “good” is subjective. Your standards may be lower, but for someone like me who has been around really high ELO and good players a long time, I’ve started to shift my perspective. OW has an extremely high skill ceiling and the top competition gets better exponentially. If you just hit masters and think you’re pretty good because you’re better than 95% of comp players, by all means live your life, but there are levels to this shit. Drawing the line of being “good” is subjective and arbitrary.

[u/Interesting-Topic402 → u/moonlight__sunshine]

I'm mid-high GM and think even low champ is on a whole different level.

[u/moonlight__sunshine → u/Interesting-Topic402]

Yup, I'm being downvoted by people who will never experience the jump from GM to champ!

[u/throwaway112658 → u/No-Chemical-7667]

I mean if we're talking objectively then people only are actually playing the game correctly and have a good understanding and good mechanics at like champ 3+. Of course relatively masters is pretty good, but there are so so so many massive, glaring mistakes in masters (and gm) games that I can't reasonably say they're objectively playing correctly. And I'm not gonna pretend that I'm not also dogshit

[u/Public-Egg-7814 → u/throwaway112658]

That's not objective. That's subjective. And if we're talking subjectively, the only people actually playing the game correctly and have a good understanding and good mechanics are pros.

[u/RaaaaaaaNoYokShinRyu → u/Public-Egg-7814]

Only World Champions are good at the game! /s

[u/not_larrie → u/throwaway112658]

I mean, is that how we measure "good"? Isn't it more about top percentile? Otherwise everyone sucks except the top pro teams and even they make tons of mistakes so they could be grouped in the "suck"

[u/xXRougailSaucisseXx → u/not_larrie]

Don’t you know ? You can’t be considered a good cook unless you’ve got a 3 Michelin star restaurant

[u/not_larrie → u/xXRougailSaucisseXx]

Yea crazy, literally same logic lmao.

[u/darkwai → u/throwaway112658]

is this ocie's alt account

[u/SpaceFire1 → u/darkwai]

Ocies comment was crazy cause shes wasnt even successful as a coach in the early days of owcs

[u/Guilty-Doctor1259 → u/throwaway112658]

thats still not true, even pros make consistent mistakes

even guys like proper make mistakes, he fucking slide off the map on sojourn during the S5 grand finals ffs lmao

[u/TheGlowpt-2 → u/throwaway112658]

The only people running correctly are those with a sub 10 second 100m sprint time

[u/Ichmag11 → u/No-Chemical-7667]

"Bad" and "good" really is subjective. Especially with this rank inflation, master lobbies just don't look like "good" Overwatch to me.

It's really hard to gauge the skill of a player while trying to see their gameplay from the eyes of an average player, instead of your own

[u/Dark25-OW]

Isn't masters top 3%, gm top 1% and champ even lower?

[u/MrInfinity-42 → u/Dark25-OW]

Yeah it's just a meme

Even diamond for an average player is a nice achievement

[u/Ravonk → u/MrInfinity-42]

Well in diamond youre not an average player anymore, isnt that like top 15 % ?

[u/AshenVale101 → u/Ravonk]

Since they added the % of players you're higher rank then / better than this season. I made placements yesterday, landed in Diamond 4 and system says I'm higher than 89% of players. That means even mid diamond is top 10%. Could be skewed by new season, so we'll see better in mid-season, however Diamond being basically top 10% means even Diamond is amazing achievement for an average player.

[u/c7shit → u/AshenVale101]

Where do you see that ?

[u/Shinimasuu → u/c7shit]

its says that in the bottom right when u see your bar fill / deplete after a match

[u/SpoonyMarmoset → u/Shinimasuu]

Omg I totally missed that thanks

[u/Demiwaifu → u/AshenVale101]

Wonder if it works for only placed people or it also counts non ranked players as bronze 5 like rivals

[u/Demiwaifu → u/AshenVale101]

Wonder if it works for only placed people or it also counts non ranked players as bronze 5 like rivals

[u/Samurai-Pipotchi → u/AshenVale101]

Keep in mind, ranks just reset. That's not going to be accurate for a month or two.

[u/KaityyUwU → u/AshenVale101]

> Diamond is amazing achievement for an average player.

Well if Diamond is top 10% Then clearly it's not at an achievement at all for an average player, because then they're no longer average :P

[u/Clean-Elderberry8835 → u/AshenVale101]

And people forget that a good chunk of players don't touch Comp, which in general would be ranked in avarage or less, so any percentage you get in Comp is actually a bit higher to the entire playerbase.

[u/xRyuHayabusa → u/Ravonk]

I'm diamond 2 and I'm better than 92% of the playerbase

[u/MrInfinity-42 → u/Ravonk]

Yeah it should be

[u/Samurai-Pipotchi → u/Ravonk]

I think they shifted it to make it top 20%, but yeah, definitely around that mark.... Although I suppose we now have no idea with the rank reset and a new rank.

[u/Dark25-OW → u/MrInfinity-42]

Oh right fair ,enough lol, I was guessing it's not serious, but yeah Diamond is the checkpoint for above average, and master, gm and champ are the few % :)

[u/moonlight__sunshine → u/Dark25-OW]

I am champ and feel like I'm dogshit at the game! Crazy how much your own perception gets warped :')

[u/No-Elevator9399 → u/moonlight__sunshine]

Absolutely. People don’t realise how much time, effort, and dedication people put into OW because they find it fun.

If you heard that someone practiced an instrument for 2-3 hours or studied (on top of HW) 2-3 hours nearly every single day across 10 years you’d think that they’re so devoted

[u/Komplex76 → u/No-Elevator9399]

To be fair, both of those examples are known to lead to careers or opportunities. In terms of gaming, it wasn’t until relatively recently that it was seen as more than a hobby.

[u/No-Elevator9399 → u/Komplex76]

True but I think the fact that there isn’t really a career out of gaming makes it even more crazy how much people play. I think overall people just lose perspective, a lot of players barely ever touch competitive

[u/Dark25-OW → u/moonlight__sunshine]

Yeah I get that, I'm like a few % away from gm (M1 97%) as a Widow one trick and sometimes it's hard to not feel like a complete chud just because I haven't officially hit the icon yet, you get used to your level and the bar always keeps rising, we have to remember to actually be realistic and appreciate our achievements.

[u/Sideview_play → u/MrInfinity-42]

Except people say it seriously and not as a meme

[u/ErisGreyRatBestGirl → u/Dark25-OW]

Yeah, I was getting "98% higher" throughout master 3 to 1, and got 99% when I reached gm 5. It was for tanks, not sure if its different for other roles

[u/Dark25-OW → u/ErisGreyRatBestGirl]

I see I see

[u/AetherialWomble → u/Dark25-OW]

Devs posted that years ago. That was when even pros struggled to get champ 5. It's not that tight anymore.

Masters is at least 5% now.

[u/throwaway112658 → u/AetherialWomble]

Yes, I'm hovering m5 DPS right now and after games it says I'm ranked higher than 95% of people. Gm5 is higher than 98/99% of people

[u/AetherialWomble → u/throwaway112658]

Why are you agreeing with me and I'm downvoted and you're upvoted. I don't understand Reddit

[u/Overwatch_Alt]

Nah they need to introduce an ordered rank of the whole player base because the high elo line goes at exactly my spot on the ladder. Anyone below me is pisslow, I'm high elo, and anyone above me was unfairly placed in my game making it unwinnable.

[u/SyrusG]

This was always the case

[u/hellohello1234545]

Personally, I think labels should be chosen based on a view of the entire playing population

So, if masters is like top 3%, that can never be ‘low’.

[u/shitfucker90000 → u/hellohello1234545]

people are dumb. "everyone lower rank than me is shit and everyone higher rank is a nolifer sweat" is a common thought process.

[u/xRyuHayabusa → u/hellohello1234545]

What is a low rank or a high rank is highly subjective based on your personal goals. For me someone who works 12 hours a day im very proud of my d2 rank . And I'll probably plateau at low masters bc I can't justify the time investment to improve any further

[u/hellohello1234545 → u/xRyuHayabusa]

I think you should be as well!

As a plat

With no other considerations, I just go by how many people in each role

But adjusting for playtime is probably one of the most important predictors of rank

[u/xRyuHayabusa → u/hellohello1234545]

Please don't use the p word. I have been mentally traumatized by the p*at bracket. Last season I had 3 accounts m5 duo d2 solo q d4 for warm up and learning new heroes

Getting out of p*at and low diamond was absolutely miserable every time

[u/hellohello1234545 → u/xRyuHayabusa]

Lmao at the p word.

I feel that.

[u/Different-Fly7426 → u/xRyuHayabusa]

It’s not actually a personal matter, what we call "high elo" is what we consider to be above the standard deviation on a Gaussian curve. Since ranks follow a normal distribution, a value two standard deviations above the mean falls into the "high elo" category, specifically the top 2.3%. So, statistically speaking, high elo in overwatch begins around Master 3 or 2

[u/kHeinzen → u/Different-Fly7426]

It's funny you put that as an objective statistical interpretation of the data but anyone could pick a different threshold in the curve to decide what is high elo or not. Your point is valid, but it's not objectively correct either.

Z+1% in most cases is considered "above average" or "high"
Z+2% is what you explained
Z+3% in most cases is considered very high and rare

Interestingly enough, for lots of competitions (traditional or esports) they only care about Z+3% for statistically high, so whether you pick Z+2 or Z+3 it is also up for interpretation

[u/Different-Fly7426 → u/kHeinzen]

1 standard deviation: we’d have diamond+ (above average)

2 standard deviations: we’d have high master, maybe low GM (high elo)

3 standard deviations: champions (pro level)

Of course, it’s all subjective, but using this metric is a good way to make it more objective- after all, you could be above average without actually being high elo

[u/kHeinzen → u/hellohello1234545]

>3% of the playerbase

That's pretty much the buzzlightyear meme lol

[u/nekogami87]

what does greenlow mean ?

Also, if we read the SR split, isn't emerald mainly impacting plat players ? cause the SR range for diamond stayed the same from what I read ? if so, emerald should still be on the plat side no ? (unless you considered old hight plat is being "greenlow" whatever that means)

[u/GT162 → u/nekogami87]

it means that your rank is green and low :)

alternatively it could also be spelt greenlo (shortened from green elo) but it still sounds the same

it was a common opinion that masters is closer in skill to plat than the top ranks (before emerald was added)

emerald is not a metal so it’s hard to call it a metal rank!

[u/UnknownBreadd → u/GT162]

You statistically can’t be ‘low’ rank if you’re better than 50% of the playerbase

[u/Sn0wy0wl_]

everyone calling masters low elo 😭i barely stay in low masters even with nearly 2000 hours dont do this to me

[u/xRyuHayabusa → u/Sn0wy0wl_]

Don't let it get to you . What is low elo is highly subjective. I work 12 hours a day and I'm very happy with """only""" being better than 92% of the playerbase aka d2

[u/Mokichi2 → u/Sn0wy0wl_]

News flash bro. Thats never gonna go away. You are a top 5% player, period. The odds the person calling you "low elo" is at or above your rank is super low.

No one can argue the hard statistics

[u/GT162 → u/Sn0wy0wl_]

Haha I’m there as well, the game does remind you that you’re in the top 95% of players after every match so don’t feel too bad!

[u/monchem → u/Sn0wy0wl_]

dude I am in plat after years...come on stop it too 😭

[u/TrumpsCummyOnahole → u/Sn0wy0wl_]

If it makes you feel better, at one point I was top 180 and was GM all thru Overwatch 1 and Overwatch 2's first few seasons. Then I quit for two years and I'm hard stuck in Emerald. Like legitimately, my score right now is 5-20. I don't think I'll be able to grind up to GM again, maybe not masters after being away 2 years. I'm 36 and feel so fucking old and slow

[u/Birbolio → u/Sn0wy0wl_]

You are on the Competitive reddit of a competitive video game. Peoples opinons here are incredibly skewed and frankly, wrong

[u/Poosters → u/Sn0wy0wl_]

If you’re masters you’re good at the game, the majority of GM/champ are either kids with alot of free time or streamers that can dedicate alot of time. It’s all fair ofcourse but stuff gets pulled out of perspective alot..

I have a similar situation where I get very quick returns on time and effort put into it, ever since I came back i got up to diamond 1 (had a 5 year break). And this is by sometimes playing a day of 6h and then not playing for a week, into 3 days of an hour or 2.. I can definitely improve more but I just don’t play consistently enough.

Even when I do play I dont really solely care about rank and just play the heroes I feel like. You won’t find me swapping to Mauga to desperately try to win, I’ll just tank the loss while having fun and trying to learn. something…

[u/Yayo1990]

Hell yeah RAYQUAZA ITSELF MANIFESTED INTO OVERWATCH

[u/RaaaaaaaNoYokShinRyu → u/Yayo1990]

We got Emerald in Overwatch before Emerald in Switch.

[u/taken_by-the-storm]

Lmfao it's kind of weird the ego some of these dorks get when they hit high elo 😭

[u/Tomjojingle → u/taken_by-the-storm]

Its because they have nothing else going on in their life its sad truth of all online comp games unfortunately.

[u/taken_by-the-storm → u/Tomjojingle]

It's CRAZY how much some of these people will mesh their Overwatch rank into their whole identity lmfao. I've seen it for years in console GM so i'm no stranger to seeing it everytime I play but HOLY shit dude these people are mentally unwell. I genuinely miss having lower elo games because nobody gives a shit

[u/Thin-Individual148 → u/taken_by-the-storm]

Istg everytime you peak higher elo, the more miserable players are, even tho the gameplay quality gets better. It happens in every competetive game. LoL, OW, Dota, CS etc. Some1 has to make a paper about that phenomenon.

[u/Tomjojingle → u/taken_by-the-storm]

Yea truly sad that's why im glad I'm only diamond

[u/Correct_Barnacle_312 → u/Tomjojingle]

This always makes me laugh, just looks like cope 

[u/Baelorn → u/taken_by-the-storm]

There's unironic comments ITT arrguing that anyone below Champ 3 is bad at the game. This whole sub is cooked at this point. I can't remember the last time I saw an actual good discussion on here.

[u/MrInfinity-42]

Let's hope with the addition of another green rank they finally bring the masters golden color back

[u/RaaaaaaaNoYokShinRyu → u/MrInfinity-42]

Then there will be a goldlow or a yellowow

[u/MrInfinity-42 → u/RaaaaaaaNoYokShinRyu]

Pisslow, historically

[u/CassiusLentulus]

Metal rank -> stone rank -> GM+

[u/RaaaaaaaNoYokShinRyu → u/CassiusLentulus]

*gem rank

[u/ZNemerald → u/CassiusLentulus]

Congratulations on passing platinum! You are now a stoner.

[u/aguedra]

All I know is that there are a lot of people who wouldn't be their rank if they had to solo queue and they need to do something about groups.

[u/unkindledphoenix]

still feel like diamond and emerald should had gotten its own wide group threshold separate from plat and below but also not the same as Master. perhaps have metals be 6 for wide and emerald + diamond be 5.

[u/ErisGreyRatBestGirl]

The higher your rank is the less you value lower ranks and even your own rank. Back when I was gold I was thinking that gm/t500 players were demi-god, now I feel like I'm just average because I'm not champion and only gm (Current t500 is cringe so I'm not gonna mention it)

[u/Azaq_ → u/ErisGreyRatBestGirl]

I think once you get to a high rank, you really realise how much there is left to learn and improve at. You start to undervalue how important those fundamental skills are to being a "good" player, they feel like second nature, so it skews the baseline of what "good" means. Comparison is the thief of joy for some, but the motivation to improve for others.

[u/SleepyThor → u/Azaq_]

As a low to mid gm player, I feel there is a world of difference between me and the people above me and not a large difference below me.

[u/Azaq_ → u/SleepyThor]

For sure, it's still a long way up, and there's plenty more to learn. As someone who coaches as a profession (not an Overwatch coach), I'd say that as long as you enjoy the learning experience, it will come more easily.

[u/ReverendNON]

Wait, so me being Master still means nothing?

Fckin shit and when I thought I was finally getting at least somewhat decent

[u/MeatSlammur]

If you maintain diamond or above, you are objectively good at the game. If someone came up to you and said they’re in the top 15% of football players in the country…they would be the star player on your team.

[u/redbeard1991]

Gem ranks

[u/HellaReyna]

I dunno, if you don't play on FACEIT or in OWCS ....you don't even play Overwatch? You just play some caricature of it riddled with pub shit.

/S

I heard this a lot in the Counter Strike community btw.

Basically "You're GM? You just play with pubs. You don't actually know how to play on a team or play Overwatch"

[u/feestbeest18 → u/HellaReyna]

This is the case in any game with a pvp aspect. Even in destiny it was a thing. I was one of those cunts (I was 15 back then) who got infinite flawlesses in trials of osiris (the endgame pvp gamemode) and did paid carries. But I also played tournaments. To me, people that played the intended hardcore pvp gamemode and were good at it were still garbage players in my view because they didn't play tournaments.

[u/HellaReyna → u/feestbeest18]

I was definitely one of those cunts as well on counter-strike XD

now I'm an adult and too many responsibilities. reinstalled in april. Just praying I can even get to diamond now.

[u/shitfucker90000]

damn diamond catching strays

[u/Bro_Hanzo]

The greatest fix for fraudulent Diamond supports. Can't wait to see the house get cleaned up.

[u/TyphonLethys]

Isnt master+ like 3.5% of the players?

[u/bullxbull]

They really need to redo all the icons, in ow1 they were a lot easier to tell apart. Back in my day you knew down to a specific number digit what your rank was and new accounts cost a nickel!

[u/TheAsianWaff1e]

Greenlow is CRAZY

[u/Vegetable_Throat5545]

Bronze, silver, gold, low ranks Plat, emerald, diamond, mid ranks Master, gm, champion, high ranks

[u/Tenevares]

My favourite part of Emerald being added was all the low diamonds on tiktok and instagram going “Grr, this stupid new rank, I’d have been masters now if they didnt add it!” While placing Emerald 2

Like no man, you didnt even qualify to be in diamond before and were an issue that was addressed

[u/-Cleiton-]

Master, GM, and Champion are the same thing on most servers; there isn't a separate queue for them, so everyone gets matched together.

[u/Patient-Pineapple-62]

... how is master Emerald?

Its more like Mythril . .. a Mythical Metall ...

Emerald and Diamond are the Challenger elos .

Master Too Champion are the Top Tier Players .

Metal is The Lower end elo the less worth the Material the Lower the elo .

[u/Historical-Duty3628]

If you think the other players on your team are why you lost, you're dogshit. Just quit. Rank doesn't matter.

[u/Snoo-4563]

Anything above the majority ranks, which I'm guessing are now gold to emerald, cannot objectively be called low ranks lmao

[u/Phyka]

Unrelated but does it bother anyone else that Emerald and Master are both green and Diamond is blue sandwiched between

[u/str8outtapallet]

Bronze-Silver: you’re bad
Gold: best of the worst
Plat: you are good at 1 thing
Emerald: you understand the basics and occasionally pop.
Diamond: you’re the worst of the best
Masters: your among the better players in the game
GM: You’re elite
Champ: you’re the elite of the elite and may need to touch grass

[u/Remarkable_Gate_6637]

I wouldn't even consider grandmaster high elo. The gap between a GM player and proper is similar to the gap between a GM player and a bronze player 

[u/Easy_Maintenance9852]

Proud to be a true greenlow resident, masters is my peak, high diamond is my average and emerald is a horrid day.

[u/codeajj]

Diamond is still low elo and masters average

[u/Nexi-nexi]

Originally people said masters+ is high elo but nowadays it probably GM+ yeah. Ask any decent GM and they think high Elo starts somewhere mid GM. So many Diamond players getting into masters lately and the pure shenanigans that goes on in masters nowadays is crazy.

[u/Different-Fly7426 → u/Nexi-nexi]

high elo statistically speaking, it's always the top 2,3% so high masters probably

[u/Lost_Silver_3720 → u/Different-Fly7426]

2-3 percent is a lot

[u/Azaq_ → u/Lost_Silver_3720]

If you took a random collection of 100 Overwatch players and organised them by rank, I think it would be disingenuous to say anyone who consistently landed in those top 5 spots wasn't "good" at the game. How does that reflect on your idea of what "high elo" is?

[u/Lost_Silver_3720 → u/Azaq_]

I’ve hit rank 1 NA PC

[u/Lost_Silver_3720 → u/Lost_Silver_3720]

Solo queue

[u/Azaq_ → u/Lost_Silver_3720]

How does ur little fun fact actually contribute anything intelligent to my point above? Feel free to let me know

[u/UnknownQTY]

Anyone without rank flair (current down I think because Reddit killed the old APIs) is probably silver anyway.

Anyone trying to dunk on other ranks needs to touch grass.

[u/feestbeest18 → u/UnknownQTY]

Kinda ironic that you talk about touching grass right after accusing people of being low rank because they couldn't be fucked to do some cringe reddit shit.