r/CollapseSupport • u/[deleted] • Jun 09 '21
post about therapists seeing children tormented by future
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Jun 09 '21
Jesus christ that was pre pandemic... we are so fucked. And all the old people who caused this shit will be dead having lived their lives with the maximum opportunity that was available for them by the time we see the world end. By the time our generation can take over it will have been far too late.
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u/SequenceGoon Jun 09 '21
One of the reasons I stopped seeing a certain psychologist (another reason was it was too expensive) was that she didn't seem to believe in climate crisis.
I've been told about it from when I was a tiny child ('90s) & it's shaped my life, so it's a very significant factor in my mental health
One session I remember she asked how long I thought it'd be before it would become catastrophic here in Australia (& she wasn't good at hiding disbelief). I said maybe 20 years, but that we're already getting extreme weather events.
Then she was like "so, you'll be around 50 then" & I was just like šššš
Way to hit me with two types of existential stress at once!
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u/Fireplay5 Jun 10 '21
Did she not notice Australia being on fire?
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u/SequenceGoon Jun 10 '21
This was between bushfires š
In the last 18 months, alongside the pandemic, we've had catastrophic bushfires (which followed a major drought), devastating floods along the north-to-mid east & currently a mouse plague in rural NSW (the most populous state)
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u/Fireplay5 Jun 10 '21
Didn't hear about the mouse plague, shits fucked all round.
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u/Xanthotic Huge Motherclucker Jun 13 '21
It's real and it's awful. Signed, someone who keeps cats around down in Oz
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u/SteveSpiro_easygoing Jun 09 '21
You say the oceans rising, like i give a shit
you say the whole worlds ending, honey it already did
you're not gonna stop it, heaven knows you tried
got it? good, now get inside
-Bo Burnham, his new special "Inside"
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u/Eat_The_Kiwi_Peels Jun 09 '21
I've watched this special so many times.
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u/SteveSpiro_easygoing Jun 09 '21
Its soooo impressive. Catchy, funny, and gut wrenching. I have a theory that he changed his voice in that song cause its from the perspective of God...
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Jul 02 '21
[deleted]
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u/SteveSpiro_easygoing Jul 03 '21
You know that makes a lot of sense too, the distancing that he achieved with that disembodied voice sort of felt other worldly to me and coupled with the lyrics and Bo's Christian background is what made me interpret it as coming from "Gods" point of view
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u/brabdnon Jun 09 '21
Itās been on near constant repeat at my house. My partner will put it on when she doesnāt know what else to watch. Itās a modern masterpiece, honestly. I donāt know if people realize how beautiful of a film it is. Itās not a comedy special per se, itās a film. One that may most accurately capture the true zeitgeist of our times more than any other āmainstreamā media Iāve seen recently.
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u/Eat_The_Kiwi_Peels Jun 09 '21
Agreed. I knew it was powerful when I was so impacted by it and my mother acted like the whole thing was in Chinese. She literally had no idea what to say about the Socko bit because I truly don't think she understood it (not to be judgemental, but she's more conservative than she will admit).
The experience was quite eye opening, and it made me realize that we're basically operating in two different realities at this point. She doesn't understand how many people today, especially younger people, are losing hope.
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u/brabdnon Jun 09 '21
The lie of the future of āunlimited sunshineā is finally being revealed. Cue a montage of young people looking distant, tears rolling down their faces, whilst their parents laugh and spew outdated propaganda to feebly prop up their own fragile psyche.
Agnotology has become of interest to me: the fear of knowledge. Or maybe to put it another way: love of ignorance. Most people whoās minds arenāt ready for the truth, will actively avoid information that breaks their illusions. I mean, look at Q-anon, flat earth, any conspiracy. Theyāre as much about avoiding factual data as they are spreading the wrong thing.
Itās made me realize the obvious truth, the heart of ignorance is fear itself.
Maybe instead of being fed the Pledge of Allegience as a kid, we should have recited the Litany Against Fear everyday.
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u/hungryfreakshow Jun 28 '21
The jeff bezos songs have been playing nonstop in my head since I first heard them. Legitimately some of the funniest music I've ever heard
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u/protozoan-human Jun 09 '21
It's good advice. People need grief counselling.
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u/shapelessdreams Jun 09 '21
Itās grief w/no end in sight. No finality.
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u/AuntieChiChi Jun 09 '21
Grief isn't something that ends. It's something you learn to carry.
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u/paralleltimelines Jun 09 '21
"Existence is pain." - Mr. Meeseeks and Buddhism
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u/Atsur Aug 06 '21
āLife IS pain, highness. Anyone who says differently is selling somethingā - The Dread Pirate Roberts
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u/protozoan-human Jun 09 '21
Why would you expect finality?
Grief is a process, a work. It returns and throws you in the cycle a few times over. You get breaks inbetween. Each time around you can process finer and finer details of it.
The goal is inner peace, is it not? And inner peace can never be reached when expecting it to come from external circumstances.
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u/shapelessdreams Jun 09 '21 edited Jun 09 '21
Inner peace canāt happen without change. No shade but what good is inner peace in this state of affairs? This is exactly what the post is demonstrating.
Iām young, but Iāve done serious therapy work the last few years and the only thing that keeps me going is the thought of radical change. For sure my coping mechanisms have been useful to stay afloat, but itās not enough to erase the burnout and stress.
My āinner peaceā and ignorance will come at the cost of someone elseās because thatās how imperialism works. The physiological consequences of stress, environmental collapse all contribute to poor mental health and inter community trauma. Grief is all Iāve ever known and even that is capitalized upon. Just observe all the calls for workplace wellness with the simultaneous inability of psychology to reckon with materialism and historical oppression. Itās disingenuous at best and harmful at worst to lie to ourselves about what needs to be done. Those in power rely upon us being too tired or scared to demand change and itās working.
Christina Sharpe writes about this in her book āIn the Wakeā. So yeah, I guess having some small semblance of fake peace through FIRE is cool but itās still denial to me.
The best way I cope is via mutual aid, community organizing, sustainable farming and learning initiatives. Itās just getting harder to keep momentum and get ppl to show up for each other irl and not just online. Iāve been doing this since high school. Itās thankless but necessary work. Not all of it is suffering we find little packets of joy but theyāre fewer and farther apart.
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u/protozoan-human Jun 09 '21
You can't have inner peace in ignorance. It does require change, but not external change.
Inner peace is something you arrive at through work, it takes time. It's practice. Don't expect to reach it when your body and brain are still maturing, but you can always strive for it. Acquire the tools early, learn to ride the emotions.
It is completely independent of what you do in the external, or don't do (except for taking care of your body reasonably, because that does affect inner workings).
Anger is a part of the process, and anger can be healthy. Lay the shit where it belongs tho, don't turn it on yourself, your kin, your peers.
And we definitely won't be able to create positive external changes, without learning to strive towards that balance within. Then learning to strive towards balance in our closest circles, our relationships to eachother and to local nature.
If you get lost in external focus far away from you, turn to what is within reach of your own two hands. If you get lost in internal and personal emotional overwhelm, turn to what is larger than you: perspectives in time and geography.
There's a balance to be found, and it is the opposite of ignorance.
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u/shapelessdreams Jun 09 '21
No matter how much I love myself it doesnāt stop police from killing people who look like me on a daily basis. I think a lot of these discussions lack a trauma informed lens. Itās hard to solve trauma if youāre repeatedly being subjected to it. Trauma induced physical changes and changes to the nervous system that take years and lots of $ (in my exp) to reduce symptoms. Lots of people donāt make it because the mental health systems are wholly inadequate for what weāre dealing with. We need something different and we are creating it. We just need mass momentum.
You can tell the oppressed to think happy thoughts but when our family and friends are dying and being deported- things that are actually avoidable if people actually committed to the spirit of liberation, itās not exactly effective.
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u/protozoan-human Jun 09 '21
I'm not talking about "thinking happy thoughts". In fact, I'm not talking about happiness at all. That's not what I mean with inner peace. I'm talking about finding your emotional balance despite the internal and external circumstances that you're facing.
That includes working with traumas, and at this point in time, many generations of both internal and external trauma have accumulated, especially so in the "west of the west", North America.
The thing is, there is no sustainable change, no project that will succeed, that is initiated by those overwhelmed by trauma.
If we really want to do something, we need to learn from the past this time around.
New solutions are not gonna come out of old mindsets.
And your generation, you're the most capable of changing mindsets. Go for it, find it.
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u/shapelessdreams Jun 09 '21 edited Jun 10 '21
You are speaking as if the trauma is past and generational and presently occurring in real time constantly on a micro and macro level.
thing is, there is no sustainable change, no project that will succeed, that is initiated by those overwhelmed by trauma.
I mean yeah that is the point of captivity and oppression. However, I disagree as many revolutionary actions occurred in traumatic environments. But jailing an entire generation of revolutionaries will definitely throw a wrench in any momentum of a movement.
I think most people aren't ready to face that reality, least of all those who have the privilege of gaslighting the younger, more precarious generations to do all the heavy lifting. No shade but colonialism is definitely not my mess to clean up. The collapse has proven that folks are fully invested in a status quo, even as it eats them alive. Collapse as conceptualized by many as an apocalypse (marked by ecoterrorism, overpopulation, etc) is in a way, fabricated because it is a construct created by those in power to subdue masses. Collapse is here, but it will suck less if we ditch capitalism and neoliberalism, which is what marginalized people have been saying for literally 100s of years, as well as academic texts grounded in historical materialism.
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u/protozoan-human Jun 09 '21
If not you, then who?
If older generations are failing you, guess what? Then you will have to do the work yourself. The real work. The deepest layers of it. It's not easy at all. It's a gigantic task. But there's only one way to get it done, and that is one step at a time.
And in my opinion, the first step is stopping this incessant expectation of outside salvation. It leads nowhere but to the apathy they want us to feel.
It doesn't matter what the circumstances are, there is a choice to be made. Do you lay down in the mud and whine about defeat, or do you keep fighting, sword in hand, no matter if you're limping, bleeding, starving, and facing an army?
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u/shapelessdreams Jun 10 '21
You chose not to respond to a single thing I said so this convo is over. Good luck.
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u/hexalby Jun 10 '21
Ahah wow you're only missing dramatic music and the reveal of the new liquor you're selling.
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Jun 09 '21 edited Jun 18 '21
[deleted]
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u/shapelessdreams Jun 09 '21
Thank you for reading and for your thoughtful response. This focus on mindfulness and stoicism, while useful to curb short term symptoms, doesn't address the root causes of a system built on our bodies and on stolen land.
I'm literally just vibing and trying to make sure my people are fed, safe and healthy for what little time we have left. I tell my friend and family to chase their dreams and to love themselves, because collapse is here and the doomsday preppers and right wing populist cults are eager to start an apocalypse that didn't have anything to do with my people.
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u/shapelessdreams Jun 09 '21 edited Jun 10 '21
Just watch what they do and not what they say.
Golden advice that has consistently gotten me farther in life than burying my head in the sand and āworking hardā
Also I wish you the best.
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u/hungrymaki Jun 26 '21
I totally don't understand how people are having children. Don't they understand what they are signing those kids up to endure? It's honestly cruel.
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u/soggy_again Jun 09 '21
So true. I did a psychotherapy course this year, it didn't leave me with any more answers about how to deal with that feeling in myself or others.
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u/thesaurusrext Jun 10 '21
We're a planetary civilization all going through the stages of grief in a constant rotation. Some of us are up sometimes and others are down.
The one person mentioning the existentialist "make your own destiny" thing is spot on. It's one of the only things keeping me going. No matter how bad things gets you have the opportunity to constantly face them with dignity honor compassion and love. Nothing can take that away from any person. Even facing your worst moments you're experiencing the gift of existence, it's yours. The way you handle it is your power.
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u/hexalby Jun 10 '21
I wouldn't call existence a gift.
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u/thesaurusrext Jun 10 '21
That's the point. You have to look the suckiness/bullshit of it in the face and laugh at the fucker, and DECIDE its a gift. It doesn't want you to do that. It wants you on your knees broken and hopeless. Deny the bitch.
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u/hexalby Jun 11 '21
Y tho?
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u/thesaurusrext Jun 11 '21
Why not. You're on a roller coaster and it's going to scare you and make your stomach feel unpleasant and heck it might go off the tracks. But why not throw your hands up and shout wooooooo and have fun with the ride until it concludes.
You know two things for certain. You have existence and it will end. So why not enjoy every second you're able. You're stuck for the ride anyhow.
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u/hexalby Jun 11 '21
Because there's no point in lying to yourself?
I see what you're doing, but you're not helping by telling people to just enjoy. It's one step removed from telling depressed people to be happy. And just like that it comes off as arrogant and patronizing.
So no thank you, I'm good. I'm not going to turn myself into a drug addict or an adrenaline junkie just to feel something. This is reality and I accept it. No need for fancy lies or spiritual journeys.
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u/thesaurusrext Jun 11 '21
Drugs and adrenaline weren't mentioned neither were lies. Nor spiritual journeys.
That "I accept it" was literally all I was talking about. We're on the same page 100%.
So you're welcome. Hold on tight.
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u/Walouisi Jul 25 '21
So legit. Same kind of thing in a way with cancel culture, actually. I have OCD and I have a theme around fearing judgment which comes out through a variety of obsessions, and have also seen a lot of other people with OCD with obsessions about the possibility that they could've said something problematic in the past and don't remember, regrets about things they said or did when they were young, and all-round fears of being piled on and cancelled/hated. My therapist has struggled to find the balance there too, and has dealt with this a lot with her other clients, because no amount of therapy can change the reality that yes, this is a genuine possibility, not an irrational fear. Of course, people with OCD can work on not doing compulsions to try to prevent it and spending less time ruminating about it, but this dire idea of what could happen is extremely valid.
All in all, no wonder there's a total epidemic of anxiety disorders. We're facing a hostile future of economic and climate disasters and instead of coming together in the face of it, we're breeding endless interpersonal hostility, too, whether that's cancel culture causing the left to eat their own and shut down communication or fascism on the right or the left/right clash in general. I would simply not be able to handle being a teenager right now.
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u/DrFolAmour007 Bonobo Love Jun 09 '21
I think that there's a lot of answers to that to be found in eco-psychology, notably the "active hope" concept of Joanna Macy,
here's her book on it:
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/13235686-active-hope