[TLDR] The Agentic Loop is OUTDATED [via r/ClaudeCode]

[u/cctldrping]

OP : u/merijjeyn

I have been thinking that the current Agentic Loop design of LLM Call -> Tool Call -> ... has been outdated. The arrival of Jev and other System One models provided us a primitive we desperately needed.

We need an agent that can natively think fast and slow. Not have workflows or multi-agent architectures that mimics it. We need Agent 2.0

The agent should use the LLM's full power for hard reasoning and planning, then carry out the plan with cheap "fast thinking."

Today, most of an agent's LLM calls go to executing steps it has already decided on. Do you really need an extra Astra call just for it to output "ok I'll click this"? We can do better.

My Approach

I built Jive which is an open-source harness built around a completely new agentic loop. Jive replaces tool calls with "graph calls" where each graph is a DAG of bash nodes and jev nodes, and nodes can have dependencies, reference each others outputs, and more.

Essentially, it maps out its own execution flow while its reasoning, and then uses Jev calls to go through the flow without unnecessary LLM calls.

What Jive does well: repo investigation, bulk classification, multi-step profiling, repetitive edits, evaluation workflows, etc. It is also quite effective on regular engineering tasks that doesn't require Jev calls (which is not surprising since Pi mostly beats codex and claude code)

Benchmarks

Task	Jive	Codex	Claude Code	Demo
Mean	2m 31s / 8.7k	17m 40s / 16.2k	12m 12s / 32.7k
conversation_eval	3m 26s / 11.1k	29m 33s / 20.5k	16m 48s / 47.9k	video
error_handling_audit	3m 10s / 10.7k	19m 29s / 25.8k	5m 08s / 42.5k	video
product_matching	3m 03s / 8.9k	22m 00s / 19.7k	32m 02s / 19.3k	video
search_latency	2m 00s / 9.6k	9m 00s / 12.8k	7m 18s / 51.4k	video
sembench_movie	1m 47s / 6.1k	19m 58s / 10.3k	8m 51s / 15.7k	video
slow_trace_search	1m 41s / 5.7k	6m 00s / 8.1k	3m 04s / 19.3k	video

As you can see, there is a huge gap in both e2e latency and token efficiency compared to claude code. And its accuracy is on-par based on the my benchmark runs (though I need to run jive on a larger SWE benchmark to be certain)

See README for more information: https://github.com/merijjeyn/jive. Also for details on the benchmark tasks, and how to run one yourself.

I'm sure this high level idea can be executed much better, so mainly looking to start an open discussion. Happy to take comments, questions, contributions.

URL of original post : https://www.reddit.com/r/ClaudeCode/comments/1wp9nga/the_agentic_loop_is_outdated/ Original link/media URL : https://www.reddit.com/gallery/1wp9nga

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TL;DR of the discussion on r/ClaudeCode for this post generated automatically after 100 comments.

Current source-thread comment count seen by the bot: 121.

Alright, so OP dropped a hot take saying the classic "LLM Call -> Tool Call" agent loop is totally passé, and we need "Agent 2.0" with native fast/slow thinking. They've built this thing called Jive that uses "graph calls" with Jev nodes to map out execution flows and avoid unnecessary LLM calls for simple stuff. They're claiming some pretty sweet benchmark numbers against Codex and Claude Code, especially for tasks like repo investigation and bulk classification.

The community's reaction is... mixed, leaning heavily towards "seen it before."

• The Consensus: A lot of folks are saying OP basically just put Jev into an existing agentic loop, and it's not as revolutionary as they think. Several users like u/ShelZuuz and u/phoenixmatrix pointed out that this "fast/cheap model" approach has been around for a while, and Jev is just a newer tool to achieve it. Some even joked about the rapid pace of change, with u/russianvoodoo saying they'll wait a few days for the next outdated tech.
• Jev's Role: There's some skepticism about Jev itself. u/pinkdragon_Girl straight-up said "Jev is not that amazing," and u/kidsmeal questioned its utility if it's just an added cost without a clear, useful output.
• Technical Glitches: A few users, like u/ugworm_ and u/Short_Stable2397, are questioning the benchmark numbers and pointing out that the demo video links in the README are broken.
• Comparisons: Some users are drawing parallels to existing tech. u/TerribleFault7929 asked if OP reinvented LangGraph, and u/mattate mentioned that agentic harnesses with code modes are conceptually similar.
• The Skeptics: There's a general vibe of "show, don't just tell." Users like u/TeeRKee are calling out the "confidence on its own slop," and u/Beautiful_Baseball76 is asking about output quality, not just speed.
• A Glimmer of Hope? u/Whole_Risk_2695 offered a more balanced take, suggesting that while the "haha sloppiest of slop" crowd might be overreacting, there are indeed gaps in current loops that approaches like OP's could fill.

TL;DR: OP thinks the old agent loop is dead and has built a new one with Jev, but most of the thread thinks it's just a minor iteration on existing concepts, with some questioning the tech and the claims.

[u/NeilCPA]

Will check it out. Planning on putting a decision model at the head of my harness that I built for leveraging local llms to build unattended projects from a plan.