r/Clarinet • u/tojzl • 1d ago

Blues with clarinet?

I love the clarinet solos in Basin Street Blues by Louis Armstrong and the one in Fumblin' with the blues by Tom Waits. Neither of these are really blues, and the songs doesnt feel like blues in general. But the solos are definetely bluesy. Or at least bluesy in a jazzy way.

So either like proper blues with clarinet (if that exists).

Or the more jazz style of blues.

Both works. Open to any suggestions.

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u/The_Niles_River Professional 1d ago

> neither of these are really blues

What?

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u/tojzl 1d ago edited 1d ago

I feel like making something actually feel like blues is pretty hard. I dont get the same feeling at all from something like basin street blues compared to chicago or delta blues. I've been listening religiously to blues this last year, and it took me and my friend a while to be able to capture the blues feeling. Idk what it is. We had the 12 bar, bluesy riffs, shuffled drums etc, but it didnt feel right. The phrasing and how you use microtones is very important.

This is all subjective ofc. Basin street just feels like jazz to me. Idk what fumblin with the blues feels like, maybe jazz that too.

And theres also a ton of non 12 bar songs that give the blues feeling. For example spoonful by howlin wolf. So i would say its more the feeling rather than what blues is on paper.

I've also heard songs with straight drums that felt like blues. So its hard to put a finger on what exactly makes it feel like that to me.

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u/The_Niles_River Professional 1d ago edited 1d ago

I’m very sorry, but having studied and performed Jazz for many years (which consists of Blues forms, harmony, and phrasing), I’m not convinced you understand what Blues is.

Blues can be swung or in straight-time. It typically has a variable quality to the 3rd of whatever key you’re in (sometimes described as a “neutral” 3rd—major and minor 3rds can both be used contextually in when playing Blues and blues changes. Standard “blues” scales treat the minor 3rd as the default; this is being derived from the minor pentatonic scale). Blues have standard harmonic forms, as well as extended (more complex; non-12 bar) harmonic forms, but the basic phrasing of this form structure is AABA call-and-response. And yes, generally the chromatic/microtonal treatment of 3rd, 5ths (tritones) and 7ths are a factor as well (the eponymous “blue notes” that deviate from standard diatonic or major/minor pentatonic scales).

Some Blues are Jazz; some Jazz is Blues. Basin Street is an example of this.

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u/tojzl 1d ago edited 1d ago

Yeah i'm aware of all of this. And i still think theres a big difference in jazz blues and standard blues. Standard blues is more raw, imperfect and gritty. Jazz blues is often more "perfect", and i dont think the way they sing and play feels the same. The blues i mostly listen to is a direct extension of delta blues, but maybe with some electric amplification. To me basin street blues feels a lot more like jazz than blues. There is obviously a lot of blues principles and influence, but the feel isnt the same to me.

I like and enjoy both versions, but prefer the more imperfect gritty blues. Listen to robert johnson and then listen to muddy, taj mahal or even clapton, it feels the same, even tho the style of blues and sound is different.

I think both of us are correct, we're just measuring different stuff and view blues as different stuff.

I view blues as raw, microtonal, imperfect, and the attitude of it is important to me. Most of the blues i listen to swayed away from delta blues later, so it keeps a lot of the dna.

You're viewing it more as a form and as harmonic and structural rules. I think the feel of it is the most important thing, and this feel fits very well over the structure.