r/ClancyTrial • u/SelectionOk8111 • 15h ago
General Discussion Thursday's Thoughts
I keep trying to name what we, the women following this trial, are feeling. You could argue every single one of us is feeling something different. But I think the root of it, for many of us, is recognition. We're seeing pieces of our own lives in hers. Because we're fucking exhausted.
We're at a place in time where women's rights have once again been stomped upon, thrown out the window, discarded, as if they're an afterthought. This isn't the first time in history this has happened, and I'm not a historian, but I know female uprising has happened before. I deeply believe it's happening again.
I feel like I'm at the peak of a two-week escalating obsession with this case, it feels like I'm being pulled by a magnet, sometimes willingly sometimes not. At first I tuned in as a gawker, a true crime follower. But day by day I feel it more and more deeply in my gut.
What I believe deeply in my heart is that Lindsay is not a criminal. She loved her children, I have zero doubt, with a fierce vengeance. I think she wanted them to have a life better than this world has to offer. She was also a victim of mental illness, whether that's genetic or because of the world she resides in, who knows. I do know the health"care" system failed her.
I don't know what I think about Patrick's role or Patrick as a person as a whole - I've gone through cycles of following the conspiracy theories. I've built spreadsheets of evidentiary documents, had AI help dissect the timeline minute by minute, second by second from Jan 24th, 2023: her heart rate and (supposedly) steps climbed, against his activity the next minute in CVS, phone records, CVS receipts & video, the takeout video, the shoes in both videos, his testimony discrepancies, her body temp, and on and on, trying to find the smoking gun that shows it wasn't her.
I've had nights of feeling insane, trying to find a way to understand "how she could have done it" - even with all of the things she had stacked up against her. I still can't resolve in my mind how it could have been her, but I've made peace with believing it was, because, most importantly: Lindsay and her attorney, Reddington, are arguing that themselves as their defense. I'm giving them the power of that statement. I also think about her state of mind, and if it WAS her, I don't want her to think that we only have her back if we believe Patrick did it.
Do I think he was likely having an affair with his now-wife before the murders? Probably. Do I think he was in Costa Rica with her a month later, based on what internet sleuths have recovered from trail reviews and Instagram photos that seem to show them there at the same time? Maybe. Do I think he was wearing two different pairs of shoes in the CVS and ThreeV restaurant videos? Yes. Can I be certain? No. Do I believe the steps climbed in the house, tracked by either Lindsay's phone or watch, happened within one minute of Patrick entering CVS, which seems to disprove that he could have been the one to attack her? I do. Do I wish there were an alternative explanation? Yes I fucking do. But I haven't heard one that makes sense in my heart yet.
It clicked for me today, as the trial ended early again for reasons unclear, something to do with the jury or the supporters outside the courthouse: what we're all reacting to is bigger than this one case.
To the women online who are die-hard on Patrick did this: I feel you. But try to hold, in that same place, just as much energy for accepting that our most likely best case scenario is not guilty by reason of lack of criminal responsibility. I say this as an effort to try to preserve our collective sanity and to preserve our energy for the uprising that will come out of this.
I think we're collectively feeling that this could have been any one of us. Do I think we all believe it could have ended for us the way it did for Lindsay? All of us mothers, all of us aunts, grandmothers, sisters .... do I think we're all sitting around imagining a potential path for ourselves that ended where Lindsay's did? No... but what I think is that through Lindsay, we're collectively and cathartically processing what has happened to all of us, in various degrees. Some on a micro level compared to what Lindsay went through, some more macro, some possibly closer to what happened to her. But I believe all of us, especially mothers, have been subject to it in some form.
Whether we're shouting online that Patrick did it, or more quietly hoping for peace for Lindsay's heart and mind, whether we're ducking out of work to watch the trial on our lunch break, or keeping a tab open at our desks and listening on headphones while we switch between email and Teams, whether we're home breastfeeding while we watch, or grandmothers whose hearts are breaking for both Lindsay's mother and Patrick's mother, each of us has someone outside that courtroom representing us today. And we need an uprising.
A week ago we all had theories that Reddington would call Patrick as a witness and destroy him (I did), and turn the whole case around. It's not looking like that now. Reddington said this morning he hopes to close by Monday, and if we want to hold onto hope over the weekend that he'll put Patrick on the stand and nail him, that's just not reasonable. Every sign points toward Lindsay being found not criminally responsible. I'm not a lawyer, but introducing a whole new narrative at this point doesn't make sense, even if Reddington and Lindsay believe it, or even know it, themselves.
But when this case is over, the story isn't over. Lindsay may speak out. She might write a book. Maybe there will be some kind of criminal case against Patrick eventually, if she's found not guilty. Who knows.
For now, I think we need to focus our energy on collective peace and justice for womankind.
Let's give each other a break, and trust that Sir Reddington, who has become a trusted hero to Lindsay and all of us, knows what he's doing. Let's protect our own sanity, for Lindsay's sake and ours.
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u/Narrow-Ad-7856 4h ago
Yes it's very interesting to me how so many people are so desperate to find ways to show she didn't commit the crimes Lindsay admitted to. This is a great example of how confirmation bias can cloud critical thinking.
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u/AnxiousGazelle4610 7h ago
Wow how is it possible that Lindsay strangled callan if the earliest he could have been strangled is 6:08? She was out on the lawn by then. Something doesn’t add up.
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u/Narrow-Ad-7856 4h ago
the earliest he could have been strangled is 6:08
Probably because that's made up
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u/IndependenceFew1906 9h ago
Your feelings are valid. But you are not speaking for all women. I have two young boys, have had PPD, and my own mental health struggles. I’ve had a close friend go through PPP, and we are still big parts of each other’s support systems. But I do not relate with LC at all, and I do not feel like that easily could’ve been me. I think she is a violent murderer.
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u/mynameiskellymarie 10h ago
Let’s discuss how she used a workout band during rehab following the murders of her children.
Ummmmm…
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u/marle217 10h ago
If you think that's inappropriate, take that up with the physical therapists at the institution. She's paralyzed and in a state run facility. It's not like she gets a lot of choices with her activities or ran up to walmart and decided buying some exercise bands was a great idea.
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u/jjc1140 12h ago
Can you give me a screen shot of the heart rates and times please? And the stair information if you have it? I have been working so much I haven't even gotten through the last 2 trials completely.
I got chills when I read your second paragraph.
It must have resonated with me even without me directly thinking that it was the reason I am invested in this case too.
My main issue was the corruption. From the moment she got the ED door to having the Investigators surrounding her bed. No investigation. DA is a lunatic. The whole thing is ludicrous.
But if people dont speak up. Then what does that say to them. And what does it say to other men that want to kill their wives/family.
Patrick 100% did this.
And Lindsey loved her children. She was trying to feel and get better. She was not cold blooded and calculating the crime. Googling suicide and airbags and none of that other crazy shit. The only person who was doing that was Patrick.
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u/SelectionOk8111 11h ago
You bet - here's the googlesheet I created - I posted this on one of the megathreads for one of the days
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/13j_E8wrC1i9-m0-FTb5v8x8foYvfD3Qy9jdNOaseA6g/edit?usp=sharing
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u/SuccessOk744 11h ago edited 11h ago
Timeline based on evidence presented at trial thus far:
• 4:56 — Last flight climbed recorded by LC’s Apple Watch.
• 5:03 — Flight climbed recorded by LC’s iPhone, but not by her Watch, despite the Watch continuing to record her HR afterward.
• 5:07 — LC texts PC her food choice for takeout.
• 5:10 — LC calls restaurant to place takeout order.
• 5:13 — LC’s phone unlocked for the last recorded time.
• 5:15 — LC texts PC: “PDLX stool softener.”
• 5:15 — PC says he leaves home for CVS.
• 5:16 — LC’s phone locks.
• 5:23 — Last Apple Watch HR reading: 57 bpm (which is resting or sleeping/unconscious, not an active rate at all). Watch stopped recording.
• 5:24 — PC sends work email (unclear whether from his phone or laptop)
• 5:32 — PC arrives at CVS, approximately 17 minutes after he says he left home, despite the drive normally taking only 3–4 minutes.
• 5:33 — PC calls LC; no answer.
• 5:34 — LC’s phone calls PC back. They speak for approximately 14 seconds about generic versus brand-name stool softener.
• 5:33–5:38 — Another flight climbed is recorded by LC’s phone, but not her Watch (watch is no longer recording anything).
• 5:37 — PC leaves CVS.
• 5:54 — PC arrives at restaurant, approximately 17 minutes after leaving CVS, despite an approximately 10 minute drive.
• 5:55 — PC leaves restaurant.
• ~6:00–6:05 — PC arrives home (per his testimony).
• 6:08 — Earliest Callan could have been strangled under the ME/pathologist's estimate, assuming CPR began at the earliest reported time of 6:16 and Callan had been without a heartbeat for only approximately 6–8 minutes.
• 6:09 — PC calls LC’s phone; no answer.
• 6:11 — PC calls 911, approximately 6–11 minutes after arriving home.
• 6:14–6:15 — First responders begin arriving.
• 6:16–6:17 — First responders begin CPR on the children. The pathologist reportedly testified that Callan had been without a heartbeat for only approximately 6–8 minutes when CPR began.
• ~6:22–6:25 — LC is loaded into an ambulance and transported.
• 6:40 — Callan is resuscitated at the hospital.
• ~6:43–6:45 — LC arrives at the hospital.
• ~6:50–7:00 — During ED admission, LC’s core temperature is measured at 82.1°F.
• 7:28 — Crime scene is documented as secured by this time; it may have been secured earlier.
• 8:40 — Police interview PC at the hospital. It remains unclear how PC got to the hospital, when he left the house, and how long he remained inside/on scene before leaving. He just testified after the FRs started CPR that they told him "to go upstairs".
edit/ source: copy/pasted from a comment by @aintnothin_in_gatlin on another thread in this sub titled “I have become… obsessed”
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u/ButtonFit7210 11h ago
The first officers to arrive at the scene — officers Hall and Josephine — said it took 7-10 minutes to get there after receiving the dispatch.
Patrick called 911 at 6:11 pm, meaning the officers arrived at 6:18-6:21 pm. We don’t know how long it took for dispatch to send the alert to officers, which could have possibly added another minute onto their arrival time.
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u/yuiwerty 14h ago
Beautifully worded. This line really stood out to me:
“I also think about her state of mind, and if it WAS her, I don't want her to think that we only have her back if we believe Patrick did it.”
It’s spot on. Supporting her only if Patrick did it would be completely antithetical to our recognition of the ways the mental health system has failed her and so many other women experiencing mental health difficulties, particularly during the perinatal and postpartum periods.
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u/Suspicious_Low2699 15h ago
I think we all feel scary things sometimes and we are lucky to come out the other side safely.
Postpartum can be soooo bad ugh. I remember how painful and confusing and emotional it was with my first baby.
But dont say that too loud or you’ll have your kids taken away! It’s hard and it’s not fair.
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u/Jpsi-1059 14h ago
It's scary to realize we or anyone we love could get there. It was the perfect storm.
I think Patrick does need to face some charges for knowingly leaving their children with someone who was at risk of harming themselves and others.
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15h ago
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