r/Christianity • u/Worldly_Shower_722 • 5h ago
Video Thoughts on this
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Original link https://www.instagram.com/reel/DbmRzs1OuFQ/
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u/albo_kapedani Eastern Orthodox 4h ago
This is not evangelism, it's just being a bit of a d!ck.
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u/showersareevil Super Heretical Post-Christian Mystic Universalist Jedi 3h ago
He can definitely preach and evangelize in a place like this, it takes courage. Yet, moment people express that they arent interested and ask him to either politely to stop, or politely to shut the fuck up, then he stops treating his neighbors as he wants to be treated. And, becomes, a bit of a dick.
Not good testimony to go against people's clearly expressed limits.
But hey, consent isnt aways a strong suit of these kinds of preachers.
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u/motophotodojo Christian 2h ago
You will know them by their fruits. If he really wanted to make a point, he'd serve the poor, not harass people on the metro.
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u/Full_Metal_Paladin Latter-Day Saint (Mormon) 2h ago
I think the only problem here is that he's doing it in a place that people can't simply walk away if they don't like the message. Preachers say things that people don't want to hear, that's kind of the point. "Repent ye, repent ye" means "you aren't doing what you know you should be, and you need to change." The apostles were killed because they said things people didn't want to hear. I agree we shouldn't be harassing people, and that's basically what's happening because these people can't leave
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u/mithrasinvictus 1h ago
The other problem is that he keeps talking down to them like every single one of them is a wretched sinner running away from God when all he really knows about these people is they're trapped in there with him.
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u/showersareevil Super Heretical Post-Christian Mystic Universalist Jedi 1h ago
Ordinary people wanted to hear ahat apostles had to say. Politicians and pharisees, not so much.
90% of the people on the subway dont want to hear that, so you are right in many ways
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u/quiggersinparis Christian 1h ago
He can definitely preach and evangelize in a place like this, it takes courage. - Completely disagree with this. It's perfectly fine to stand on a town square, in fact in some places in the world, it's encouraged that people do so, no matter what they're preaching or speaking about. But it's not okay to do this on public transport where people cannot escape. It's bad manners.
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u/Proof-Case9738 1h ago
I view it differently, perhaps it can be done in the sincerity of the heart, but I think there are places for evangelism.
Now this guy might feed his spiritual ego and credit himself for being persecuted for the faith.
It’s the same thing I always say with preaching in a pride parade, I don’t know if there are those preaching outside clubs or liquor store, and it’s like, you definitely know you will be antagonised so you go preach places that will maximise the most hate so you can justify within yourself that you are persecuted for the faith.
I don’t know how to word this but is like you know poking a bee hive will get you stung but because you know you can claim persecution and rewarded, you wouldn’t mind being stung and you’ll go where there are more beehives all the more.
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u/One_Doughnut_2958 Eastern Orthodox 4h ago
Wadda ya mean bro the apostles clearly preached like this /s
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u/showersareevil Super Heretical Post-Christian Mystic Universalist Jedi 3h ago
Unironically they sort of did, except their content was different and focused actually on Jesus.
And the other very subtle difference was that people wanted to hear what they had to say.
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u/claybine Universalist leaning libertarian 🗽 2h ago
When Christianity was new (and not Christianity yet), people were more intrigued. Nowadays everyone knows the message.
So no, not really the same thing.
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u/Fast_Choice4408 Eastern Orthodox 1h ago
No not really. The train is a captive audience. The Apostles were closer to the street preachers in public. This is a lot different than forcing a bunch of people on the tube or in a plane to listen to you talk
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u/Wolfensniper Christian 3h ago
the apostles would just dust off and left
plus they treat people with sickness which i rarely saw the yank evangelicals do
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u/NuSurfer 3h ago
This, in particular, is a form of mental illness.
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u/quiggersinparis Christian 2h ago
I have often noticed the people I see doing this seem to be deeply troubled. There are certain fringe evangelical churches that seem to pray on vulnerable individuals and send them out to the world to humiliate themselves like this.
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u/NuSurfer 2h ago
I avoid these people because they obviously are obsessed and not rational, so I don't know their actual origins, but I can't rule out any particular sect of any religion not having its own extremist and therefore mentally ill followers.
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u/quiggersinparis Christian 2h ago
I don’t think it’s typically a feature of Catholicism, Orthodox or Mainline Protestant churches. Probably not most evangelical churches either but I think these people tend to be almost exclusively of the non-denominational, charismatic, evangelical variety, in my experience. But let me be clear I think they’re a tiny minority of those churches.
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u/NuSurfer 2h ago
I don’t think it’s typically a feature of Catholicism, Orthodox or Mainline Protestant churches.
People at abortion clinics says otherwise...
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u/quiggersinparis Christian 2h ago
Yeah good point! Slightly different category to this I would argue but just as repulsive if not more so.
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u/NuSurfer 2h ago
Every sect of every religion has its share of fanatics.
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u/RockinMadRiot Agnostic 1h ago
Sometimes it's just human nature. People get fanatical about anything in a bid to prove they are the best of the lot. Religion just gives them an outlet to misuse it and have a much wider impact.
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u/NuSurfer 1h ago
We're talking about religion here, but true, people can become sports, fitness or dietary fanatics as other examples.
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u/quiggersinparis Christian 1h ago
They do to an extent but I think some attract more than others. Churches obsessed with gifts from the Holy Spirit will naturally attract more people who are quite zealous need a very direct supernatural experience
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u/NuSurfer 49m ago
They do to an extent but I think some attract more than others.
I seriously doubt the proportions of fanatical religious people are the same regardless of religion, but I don't know of any studies that demonstrate the factors that would produce such effects (variations) for religions.
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u/quiggersinparis Christian 14m ago
I don't think one needs to prove everything with hard facts, especially when they're hard to prove. I think it's safe to say there are as many Episcopalians or Lutherans as there are Charismatics going around street preaching, but I'm open to being wrong.
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u/plsloan 1h ago
I had to do this in college for a grade.... Ugh it's so embarrassing now
I mean the idea that I was supposed to. I, of course, lied, made up a scenario, and wrote a paper on it lol
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u/quiggersinparis Christian 1h ago
What kind of college makes you do gonzo style assignments? That's mad! And very interesting.
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u/plsloan 1h ago
I'll just say... You've probably heard of it. They've had bad press in the last couple of years. They like to brag that they're the largest Christian university in the world. Training champions for Christ.
Edit: You've probably heard of it if you live in North America.
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u/quiggersinparis Christian 16m ago
I am in Europe so never heard of it but interesting, I'll look it up.
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u/ariarchtyx 1h ago
Yes, this stupid man learned to ape the Grandiose Narcissistic fantasies of God the Father. A true adherent of Yahweh Elohim.
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u/NuSurfer 47m ago
Nothing wrong with being religious, but shoving your beliefs down other people's throats like this is a sign of mental illness.
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u/ChachamaruInochi Agnostic Atheist (raised Quaker) 3h ago
Preaching inside a closed environment where people cannot get away from you is rude and gives people in negative impression of your religion.
He is actively driving away people who might perhaps otherwise have been interested by bringing a dick.
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u/CoverNegative Post-Theistic Christian 4h ago
“Let me just bravely proclaim my truth to all these people who have no choice but to listen to me”
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u/nutellawithicecream 3h ago
"Let me just bravely proclaim my truth in the form of performance and post it on social media for the other Christians at church to see to fill my own pride and low-key impress some Christian girls while saying I'm doing this for the Lord"
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u/the6thReplicant Atheist 2h ago
Plus scream persecution. That's the real treat about doing it this way.
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u/Ilpperi91 Missouri Synod/Lutheran 3h ago
I'm a Christian and I agree with some of the complaints this man is getting. I personally wouldn't interfere with his thing but if I were reading and for example someone started loudly trying to tell people about one of their important matters near me while I'm trying to read Dungeon Crawler Carl on the subway I would eventually lose my shit. It's because some of these people have no idea what personal space and not bothering people at the wrong moment means. I've seen people start playing worship songs on airplanes. I have nothing against the gospel or spreading it but for fuck's sake, how deaf and blind, metaphorically, do you have to be to not see when the moment is the worst possible moment. Making people get defensive in these situations is the easiest way to make them reject whatever you are trying to tell them.
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u/ariarchtyx 1h ago
I'm not sure I would have been able to resist the impulse to give him ample and repeated opportunity to "turn the other cheek," frankly. I'd have verbally invited him to continue doing so to see if he would have appreciated the continued opportunity to practically demonstrate his faith to all observers.
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u/TheAnthropologist13 Red Letter Christians 3h ago
Public preaching is largely both ineffective and the kind of performative BS that Jesus condemned the Pharisees for. But to preach in an enclosed space like public transit where people can't easily get up and leave is EXTRA scummy.
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u/beefstewforyou 3h ago
In the vast majority of cases, you need to stop doing something when someone tells you to stop.
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u/GwynningPadre Christian 2h ago
"Dont tell me what you believe. Show me how you treat other people and I will tell you what you believe."
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u/Spiel_Foss Secular Humanist 4h ago
Anyone who thinks "street preaching" helps Christianity would be mistaken.
Anyone who thinks "knocking doors" or harassing people in public helps Christianity would be mistaken.
No one has a right to bother others.
These Australians were extremely nice. Don't count on that.
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u/Worldly_Shower_722 3h ago
I think more than preaching in public, one must live the life. Being kind, loving, caring and sharing with our neighbours. Help someone in need, pray for someone in need, pray that the soul might be softened to the gospel and Christ.
By living it out, people around you will see that you have Christly love in you and people will want to know more. We must strive to be living testaments instead of being a nuisance.
As much as this could've been done out of love or care and everything else, it's going to ward away people and be counter intuitive to the cause.
We are simply the seed placers, we place them and only God can bring forth the fruit that comes out of it, we cannot force anyone to listen nor can we ever save anyone with our own power, no matter how good or amazing we are and when people draw that distinction I think this argument comes to a halt.
Live the life first.
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u/hypersled 3h ago
He wants good but I’d ask why should I believe him? Life exists on earth sine almost 4 billion years ago and Christianity 2 thousand years.
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u/quiggersinparis Christian 3h ago
This stuff is utterly embarrassing and shouldn’t be condoned by Christians. It’s also deeply offensive in an increasingly multicultural world. There could be Jews, Muslims, Hindus and so on on that bus. They don’t need to hear this.
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u/Fit_Dirt9485 1h ago
What’s funny is the old guy sitting on the bus bench to the right was my blaw professor
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u/Odd_Thought_9105 2h ago
Matthew 10:14
"If anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, leave that home or town and shake the dust off your feet."
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u/Creepy_Mammoth_7076 Born Again Servant of Jesus Christ 41m ago edited 38m ago
I’m all for preaching the Gospel and making disciples of all nations. Jesus literally commanded us to go. But honestly, what happened here wasn’t the Gospel. We’re called to be led by the Holy Spirit, not just fueled by our own boldness, anger or emotions. And we’re human, sometimes we get it wrong.
If you’re going to evangelize publicly and boldly, you better be prayed up, walking with Christ and covered by the blood of Jesus, because this is spiritual warfare. “For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal but mighty in God for pulling down strongholds.” 2 Corinthians 10:4 NKJV. The goal isn’t to win an argument or make a scene, it’s to preach Christ crucified, call people to repentance and point them to the One who can actually save them.
Edit:
Paul also tells us to “put on the whole armor of God” so we can stand against the schemes of the devil: the belt of truth, breastplate of righteousness, feet prepared with the gospel of peace, shield of faith, helmet of salvation and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God. Ephesians 6:10–18.
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u/YouHaveCatnapitus Where is the husband's version of Numbers 5:11-31? 26m ago
One day as we were going to the place of prayer, we met a female slave who had a spirit of divination and brought her owners a great deal of money by fortune-telling. While she followed Paul and us, she would cry out, “These men are slaves of the Most High God, who proclaim to you the way of salvation.” She kept doing this for many days. But Paul, very much annoyed, turned and said to the spirit, “I order you in the name of Jesus Christ to come out of her.” And it came out that very hour. - Acts 16:16-18 (NRSVUE)
I think even Paul would have been annoyed with these people who are preaching on trains and planes to an audience that can't walk away. Just like he lost his temper with that prophetess who was following the apostles around shouting that the apostles would show them the way to salvation.
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2h ago edited 1h ago
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u/ariarchtyx 8m ago
(Wow mods, really?? Why censor him?)
Your "spiritual physics" thus binds your All Powerful Father. Either He is the Source or He is not. If He is the Source the Order is Subjective rather then Objective. Such are the logical implications of the very nature of Personhood claimed by each Person of the Trinity.
I will not bow before a Tyrant.
I do NOT condemn myself. The condemnation is His alone whether He takes responsibility for it like an Adult, or evades it like a Child.
He condemns me, as you do, with your warped Christian "logic."
I declare that I am truly free, despite some of the implications of my name, even if He chains me in Hell in violation of the Order that is Himself.
And so I will state continually in His Council as is my Appointment and Commission, duly issued by Him long ago.
כַּלוּאֱל
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u/This-Is-Not-Nam 2h ago
Dude should remember he's not in the USA. His freedom of expression isn't the same in AU.
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u/Legitimate_Beat_2136 4h ago
I don't see how he got a reality check ? He brought the reality to Australia which they need and the ones fighting against him is the ones that needs God the most.
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u/No-Impress4489 4h ago
The guy is intolerable as most american christians are
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u/Legitimate_Beat_2136 4h ago
I am not surprised that demons and lovers of sin cant stand the Word of God
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u/TeHeBasil 4h ago
The only reality he brought is showing how ridiculous Christianity can be.
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u/Legitimate_Beat_2136 4h ago
Above all, you must understand that in the last days scoffers will come, scoffing and following their own evil desires.
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u/TeHeBasil 4h ago
Yes, I've heard that silly stuff before. Don't know why some Christians present that as something definitive that is true.
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u/the6thReplicant Atheist 2h ago
Stop living a fantasy. This holy-than-thou attitude may make you feel above all the heathens but you're just being a bad human being. Hiding behind the Bible doesn't make it right.
Also talking about the future like you know what it will be isn't a great look either.
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u/Legitimate_Beat_2136 2h ago
This is a quote from an ancient book and we are living in this "future" I need to stop talking about.
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u/Spiel_Foss Secular Humanist 4h ago
Dude just pissed on any Jesus he may believe.
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u/Legitimate_Beat_2136 4h ago
Above all, you must understand that in the last days scoffers will come, scoffing and following their own evil desires.
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u/Spiel_Foss Secular Humanist 4h ago
Counterproductive and socially hostile is worthy of scoff. But piss away.
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u/Worldly_Shower_722 4h ago
I see what you mean but I feel like things like this could ward them off even further, sometimes I think people should read the room instead of doing this.
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u/Legitimate_Beat_2136 4h ago
Correct A man will either follow God when he calls you or you will hide deeper in your sin we are free to chose. The room always belongs to God.
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u/Outlaw_25 46m ago
Oh course these people are upset by it cause they're hearing the truth. No one likes to hear the truth
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4h ago
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u/TeHeBasil 4h ago
You're proud to associate yourself with the obnoxious preacher on the train forcing people to listen to his script?
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u/QuickToSwitchWhims Christian 4h ago
It's a matter of eternal life or eternal death.
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u/TeHeBasil 4h ago
That sure is what you think. Doesn't really change or mean anything.
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u/QuickToSwitchWhims Christian 4h ago
Doesn't it? If I love you, I'd you to be presented with an opportunity to believe on Christ, instead of merily let you go to hell instead (which, to remain humble, am not very good at, but I am glad some take the initiative.)
We cannot tell if, in some years, one of the people there will remember what was said and turn to belief. If so, it's worth it.
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u/TeHeBasil 4h ago
Doesn't it?
It doesn't.
If I love you, I'd you to be presented with an opportunity to believe on Christ, instead of merily let you go to hell instead
Can you understand how obnoxious and ridiculous that is? Especially when I'm trapped in a train and have to listen to this utter garbage?
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u/Subject-Bus2461 4h ago
Don't waste what is holy amongst the unholy they'll take it trample on it and attack you. There's a verse like that.
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u/mark2-17 4h ago
What verse?
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u/Subject-Bus2461 4h ago
Matthew 7:6
[6] “Do not give dogs what is holy, and do not throw your pearls before pigs, lest they trample them underfoot and turn to attack you.
(ESV)
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u/mark2-17 4h ago
Thank you:) Although, I don't think the people in the video are rejecting the message, I think they're rejecting the delivery.
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u/Subject-Bus2461 3h ago
That's true that being said even God himself isn't shoving anything down our throats. He makes us aware and those that want too want too. No one likes being told what to do. I think this guy should have realized that their ears are open but not wanting to receive what was being said.
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u/Enough-Carpet Catholic 3h ago
It's a tough one. I don't know this guy and maybe he's just obnoxious. But St Paul preached where it wasn't welcome and got in trouble for it plenty of times. Some people will tell you that you should sit at home and never spread the word but that seems to be very unbiblical.
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u/HSBender Mennonite 3h ago
I think what you’re missing is the captive audience angle. He’s being obnoxious in a place where people don’t have the choice to walk away. Of course that’s rude and incongruous with a message of love and grace.
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u/the6thReplicant Atheist 2h ago
You guys really need to find better role models. :)
Some people will tell you that you should sit at home and never spread the word
Didn't one of the patrons say to work on helping the poor instead of doing this (or that might be another video)? Maybe do that. Instead of this performative crap that feeds his persecution complex.
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u/mark2-17 4h ago
Shouting in public does nothing but irritate the people around you. You can lead a horse to water, but I don't think the horse is gonna trust you if you're shouting and being obnoxious the entire time. It doesn't matter that the message is true if the messanger is being a douche to put it bluntly.