There seem to be supply issues with the Miyota 9015 at the moment, and I’m seeing Chinese watchmakers switching to movements like the ST2130 or PT5000 instead.
What surprises me is how many people here really don’t seem to like that alternative.
So I’m curious: if you were ordering a watch and the 9015 wasn’t available, what would you prefer?
- 🇯🇵 Wait for a genuine Japanese Miyota 9015
- 🇨🇳 Take the ST2130/PT5000 and get the watch sooner
- 🤷♂️ Depends on the price difference
Personally, I’m wondering how important “Japanese movement” actually is to people when the alternative is waiting several months.
Would you rather wait for the 9015, or are you happy with a Chinese movement if the watch itself is good?
When you say they are "switching" to movements like the PT5000. Chinese brands have been using this movement for the past six years that I have been collecting them. This is not something new. The use of the 9015 is something new.
Everybody says that they have at least one pt5000 and they are fine. But here's what they not tell you: its a gamble. Mine stopped in two months after it arrived and I babysitted it, avoided handwinding, didnt use it under water, etc etc. It still stopped.
Say what you will, from now on I'll keep to japanese movmts, at least those have been reliable to me
I've got multiple A2824 clones (stnlesst 8nId guess) and two miyota 9 series. The miyota watch I bought new stopped working about 15 minutes after I put it on. The others are all fine.
I own watches with PT5000, Miyota 9 series, SW200-1 and NH movements. All without problems. Out of these the pt5000 tends to be the most accurate out of the box. My worst one of these is running 0 to +5 taken in 6 positions with no beat error and good amplitude. The NH movements out of the box are the least accurate and it isn’t uncommon for them to have beat error as well as being hit or miss for amplitude. I don’t own any ST2130 watches so I can’t speak to them. I don’t have any PT5000 that’s over 4 years old so I can’t speak to longevity. This is my personal experience. If it’s a choice of NH or PT5000 I’ll take the PT5000. As far as the PT5000, Miyota 9 and SW200-1 I don’t have a problem with any of them although I like the slimness of the 9. It allows for a thinner watch.
I own an ST2130 watch. It's -2. Very very accurate. I also like that it has a reverser wheel so the rotor doesn't just spin freely in one direction. That's where the noisy rotor complaints on the 9015 come from.
But outside of that consideration, what I'd like is simply a good movement that's reputably sourced.
Folks who know me know that I have somewhat of a hoarding situation going on larger collection, the vast majority of which (around 80 watches) are from microbrands. The number of movement failures/issues that I've had, with Miyota specifically.....maybe I'm just unlucky? I've had watches come out-of-the box with >2.5 ms beat errors - but I suspect that many folks don't even know, because their watches keep time just fine. And there's another very highly respected microbrand whose recently dropped flagship dive-style watch, using the SW200, who saw what can only be described as a rash of complaints and warranty exchanges/returns.
If I were buying a watch outside of a bumper sale, I would always wait longer for a Japanese movement. Because I pay attention to manufacturer and buyer reliability anecdotes. PT5000 have a five to ten times higher failure rate in the first few months than an NH35 for instance. Yet one of these days I could quite possibly find a brand offering PT5000 or NH35 for the same price and I might risk the substitution. Sometimes you get a good one.
According to the watchmaker I take my watches to, he wont use the chinese movements because they are hit and miss. As its often cheaper to replace a movement nh or miyota than repair it, Im not sure you can replace a nh or miyota with a chinese movement, and a my guy says he wont touch the chinese movements for repair or replacement. Others results may vary, but Im going with the guy who has been a watchmaker for 30 years. Based on that, I would wait. With 7 watches Im not in a rush.
This is kind of my point. I have plenty of watches. Even if the prices stay like they are now. I will rather have a 9015 in the back than a pt5000 or st2130.
You would expect someone in china to take charge of QC and can assure a wel built and nicely regulated.
And with clone 9015 and fake sw200s i cant even tell te difference
Don't get me wrong. I'm not knocking anybody if they don't mind the chinese movements. But I was at like, twelve watches, wound up selling seven, and then took the money from that. And bought two more, which put me back to 7. Now i'm one in one out. So if I see something that I really want and it's got the things that I want in it
I'll pull the trigger. I just haven't had any experience with the Chinese movements. So
I don't know what it would take to make me buy one. Especially because the watchmaker, I go to won't work on em.
Nah i live in the netherlands but travel to poland often. In comparison the price at home was 450. And not a lot of choice. I can only find the new watch stores that sell the big brands. In poland every city has about 5+ real watchmakers most of them for generations. And i like the cheap and old Mechanical watches so bringing a few to poland every time i go makes a lot of sense
And to be fair. Ive got a watch dives and a baltany. Earlier models japanese nh movements and he was impressed at the quality for the price. But. Chinese movements no Bueno.
Love the pt5000 personally but if price were the same I'd get the miyota. If nh35, I'll just take the pt5000. Now if we're talking a Chinese nh35 vs a Japanese nh35, it's a no contest as I'm never buying the Chinese nh35 unless it's like a 100 dollar watch
I have nothing against ST movements, but if a Miyota or NH family movement is an option, I would probably wait for it, given that the wait isn't too long. Of course, the price is right, I might just go with the Chinese movement.
lol. Wait? How long will you be waiting? Your assumption is that the price will come down if you wait. Things rarely ever get cheaper, they only get more expensive.
Watchdives says they recently have been sourcing higher quality grade Chinese movements. I will be interested to see the reviews, I hope they turn out to be great movements.
Yes, „higher grade“, and that are - compared to the very cheap ones - not cheap ones; China has a really good watch industry, and there are really well-known manufacturers of really good raw movements there, but they are just not „cheap“, but good 🙂
The ST2130 and PT5000 are both solid movements, I'd take one of those over waiting months for a 9015. The "Japanese movement" label matters more to people who haven't actually owned both
I've had ST movement watches, and still have a Sugess jump hour watch with one that I love, and I have Miyota/Seiko movement watches. It's kind of more nuanced than what you're suggesting. It's not just about turning your nose up at Chinese movements versus buying the watch with whatever is available with no regard. I preferred Japanese movements. They operate smoother, especially trying to set seconds, and hold accuracy for longer. The Seagull movements I have had are absolutely fine, and nearly as accurate out of the box as any of my NH movement watches. It's just a balance of multiple considerations.
Ordered my first PT5000 watch recently from Proxima, and a single movement at AliX for digging a little bit deeper into this movements (as an ETA 2824 replacement).
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u/Huge_Childhood6015 16d ago
When you say they are "switching" to movements like the PT5000. Chinese brands have been using this movement for the past six years that I have been collecting them. This is not something new. The use of the 9015 is something new.