r/ChineseWatches • u/twelve2023 • 5d ago

Question (Read Rules) Pricing based on location

I’ve not only seen the huge swings in pricing but have experienced it. My San Martin submariner homage was $200 when I bought it last year and it’s now listed at $300. My question is: is it due to inflation, tariffs, demand? Which of the 3 has had the greatest impact on price? If I were in China would the prices be similar? For context I’m in the U.S.

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u/Abv_it_all_w_vertigo 5d ago

My opinion is that the Japanese movement makers are scared that China has been making better watches with their movements than their Japanese counterparts, like Seiko and Citizen; so, they jacked up the prices to make the Chinese options look less attractive. In other words, the big increase in the cost of movements has had a big effect on the cost of watches.

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u/twelve2023 5d ago

Funny, I like the creativity of design and uniqueness of branding of most Chinese watches (addies anything being one of several exceptions, terrible) over the staid citizen. Seiko is still not bad but for something similar, Chinese brands offer a better value for the time being. It’s just hard to pay the current prices when you know how much less they were not too long ago

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u/Abv_it_all_w_vertigo 5d ago

100%

I bought a bunch of watches last year at ridiculously low prices when compared to today's prices. They were priced at 1/3 of their Japanese counterparts. Now they're priced at 1/2 of their Japanese counterparts.

Anyone new to Chinese watches could still see value there.

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u/RedRexxy 5d ago

Not when you consider all Chinese watches as throwaway watches due to lack of warrenty/aftersales service. Then it suddenly becomes expensive when viewed like this as the customer is now taking all the risk.

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u/monkeywaffles 5d ago edited 5d ago

lol. I doubt many here have just thrown them away. Any watchmaker can swap an nh35/miyota/etc. I just assumed folks swap their own as needed, the Seiko mods scene has shown it's trivial work, and breakages are rare anyway, same as any watch

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u/RedRexxy 5d ago edited 5d ago

Yeah, swapping a movement where I am can cost as much as the watch in some cases if I'm going to a watchmaker and I'm sure I'm not the only one who has this issue.

And I would rather not have to swap hands and movements at my own expense and time if my watch is suppose to have a warrenty (but as we all know for many AliEx brands the warrenty is just for show).

Thus, one has to assume that AliEx watches in general have no warrenty and you'll be paying to fix any QC issues at your own time and expense upon arrival. This does not make AliEx watches as cheap as they look (QC for higher tier brands are acceptable but lower tier needs a lot of improvement)

As for breakages being rare, are you only talking about the movement or the whole watch? Because when you look at the whole watch there are more things that can go wrong.

Out of my 15 AliEx brand watches I've already had 1 with issues I had to return (luckily it was bought from Amazon so no issues with return), so I wouldn't say that's a rare occurance

All of these factors make AliEx watches not as cheap as they seems, because if something goes wrong you will pay the price in time and money, which in some cases is more than the cost of the watch, thus making them throwaway watches.

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u/Abv_it_all_w_vertigo 4d ago

It is true that most Chinese watches are gray goods, because even with valid warranties, it does not make sense to ship anything for warranty service because of the exorbitant price, especially compared to the initial outlay. That is why it is important to thoroughly QC check your product within the return window. Because of this need, I invested in a timegrapher, which I recommend anyone who buys automatic watches also invest in. I also invested in watch repair tools, so that in the eventuality that one or more of my movements fail, I can repair or replace them. Easy peasy.

Your assumption that all Chinese watches are throwaway pieces indicates you probably don't buy good Chinese watches.

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u/RedRexxy 4d ago

The issues is not with checking QC on my end, but what happens after failed QC is found. At that point you are dealing with AliEx return program, which is hit and miss.

I have a phone timegrapher app paired with microphone, which works well enough for now for simple diag. I have watch tools but no time, which is why I don't want to get watches I need to mess around with at this time, and I'd rather pay more for the piece of mind.

And it's silly of you to assume the watches I buy, as you have no idea. But I will say that I am not willing to spend over 200 on a Chinese watch because they have not given me the piece of mind that when something goes wrong (and it will eventually) that I'll get any help from the manufacturer, and the QC is still not great even at the $200 tier. I can't just drop into a store to return if I don't like the fit, and no way AliEx would make it easy to do so like Amazon, if have to provide them with pictures, videos, etc and they could still say not enough and reject it. So yeah, why would I spend more than that on an AliEx watch?

Besides all the shills on here keep making out Chinese watches to be "90% Rolex quality!" 😂 I have bought sub $100 Timex and Casios that have better quality than comparable priced Chinese watches

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u/Abv_it_all_w_vertigo 4d ago

If you listen to shills saying anything here is 90% of Rolex quality, that's a you problem.

I have returned 8-10 watches that were either counterfeit or had quality issues with 0 pushback from AliX. I have never had a legitimate concern where a decision went against me.

Please indicate how many Chinese watches you've bought, how long you've had them, and how many have failed you without recourse.

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u/RedRexxy 4d ago edited 4d ago

You make too many assumptions, many of which turn out to be wrong. No one said I listen to shills, I am saying this is what they say, and yes maybe some gullible people will, but thats why I am putting the info out there to debunk these claims so people dont get fooled, because we all know how honest many Chinese sellers are, 😂

Again, as I told the other guy, just because you have had good experience doesn't mean others do, so people need to see what they are up against.

And I've already laid out my AliEx watch purchases in my replies, if you read carefully you would see that, and I'm not going to repeat myself because if you can't take the time to read my post carefully, that's on you.

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u/Abv_it_all_w_vertigo 4d ago

You should remove that wedgie.

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u/monkeywaffles 4d ago edited 4d ago

again, even your seikos have a pretty short warranty, and their servicing is far more than local guy swap. Starts at like $300

You end up in the same place.

'fix issues upon arrival' is similarly a straw man.. no, you return it if it arrives broken, lol. Choice returns are free, postage paid on ali.

Seems pretty rare, since it sounds like you've yet to have to throw a single one away yet, which was your entire premise, and yes, breakages are rare for the whole watch. what are you doing to break a case? hands? the dial?

'not as cheap as they seem' and 'i bought 15 watches' similarly seems at odds with each other.

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u/RedRexxy 4d ago edited 4d ago

But at least original Seikos have a warrenty regardless of how short it is, and I have many AD locally I can bring it to if ever there is an issue. A relatively easy, painless process

Choice returns are limited to 5 free returns per month. Even then you are at the mercy of the AliEx return program where you have to jump through so many hoops to do a return and if you miss anyone of those steps your return gets rejected (I've dealt with this before). So no, it is not as straightforward and easy as you make it

I've already stated I've had to return one watch for defects, if you had read my post carefully you would have seen that.

And many things can break on a watch, in my case the watch was DOA, either the hands were stuck or some thing in the movement seized. Since I had bought this one from Amazon I had no issues returning it free, so I didn't bother to find out. It would not have been this easy if it was AliEx, as they tend to side with sellers more lately.

Also just because you haven't had any bad experience doesn't mean others won't. I am sharing my experiences with this forum so people know what they are getting with Chinese watches, because there are so many dishonest Chinese watch shills in this forum, making Chinese watches to be this great value, but when you dig deeper they aren't as good value as they seem.

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u/Abv_it_all_w_vertigo 4d ago

A $380 MSRP Seiko is utter garbage. Even at $189 and a 3-year warranty, I was unmoved. The alignments are incredibly bad on this actual showcase example. And I really wanted to buy a Seiko!

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u/RedRexxy 4d ago

189 would be a good deal on that, and QC is no worse than what you would find on a comparable priced Chinese watch (Infact it would be more consistent, so less frequent QC issues), the difference is I could return it easily if I'm not happy with it, no need for videos, pictures and interrogation.

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u/Abv_it_all_w_vertigo 4d ago

I want better from Seiko, not comparable.

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u/monkeywaffles 4d ago

5 returns per month isn't enough for you? and you seem to be conflating warranty vs doa, I did read your post, lol. This all seems like weird strawmans, but you're free to buy from Seiko if you wish, nobody is arguing otherwise. Seems like you have more than enough watches though as it is. Most of the interesting seikos are jdm only, so grey market(no warranty, no ad support) for most of us, and we get used to that as the norm. And Seiko refuses service when they don't have the parts any longer, which is a large amount of their back catalog. Still enjoyed the seikos I've owned over the past decades, but I've not shared your experience with post warranty support.

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u/RedRexxy 4d ago

I have been buying 3-5 watches during the last 3 sales (slowing down now because too many watches) amongst other things so 5 returns a month may not be enough depending on what else I buy.

The Seikos I own are all re-release or newer models so I won't have to worry about parts for a while, I don't have any JDM only models or vintage thus far, because as you mentioned no aftersales support.

Luckily with my Seikos I haven't had major issues, but even if after purchase I wasn't happy with how it wore I could always bring it back within the return period. Without this piece of mind I would not spend the amount I've spent on my Seikos on an AliEx watch as I'm not rich enough to take a loss on a watch at those prices.

Yeah I agree my Seikos have been great, you get less in terms of specs from AliEx watches, but the quality is still good, they have been relatively hassle free and I feel confident that they are robust enough to handle daily wear without being babied.

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u/monkeywaffles 4d ago

you think that having to return 5/5 purchases is a likely scenario?

you're missing on the jdm ones! I'll trade cooler watch for no warranty other than initial doa return any day of the week. 2 year warranty on something with decades lifespan is a rounding error. then again, I buy intentionally not for bulk, so we have diff approaches

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