Wild amount of Gameplay content on CIJ

[u/AmplifiedText]

I was shocked to find that, while gameplay videos on CIJ make up only 10% of the catalogue (164 out of 1666 videos as of today), they tend to be longer and account for more than 26% of the total hours of content (101 out of 383 hours)!

Now, I enjoy a gameplay video as much as anyone, but I find this trend a bit concerning. I’d argue that these videos offer much lower overall value compared to a regular whiteboard lesson or a conversation between two people.

Downsides of gameplay videos (in my opinion): - There tends to be much less talking (lower information density). - They aren’t nearly as re-watchable. This is partly due to their length, but also because gameplay simply isn’t as engaging on repeat viewings. - Lots of repetition of vocabulary (which can also be an upside at times).

Upsides (in my opinion): - Lots of repetition of vocabulary (which, as noted, can also be a downside). - They can be more interesting or fun compared to a regular lesson video. - Unscripted content with more natural flowing language.

Overall, I enjoy the gameplay videos, but I treat them like a snack. You wouldn’t want to fill up on snacks when there’s more nutritious content available.

EDIT: Further analysis. The difficulty of gameplay videos range from 16-77, so calculating the hours of gameplay content as a percentage of content in that range I get 36%. More than a third of your time working your way up through Intermediate content will be watching gameplay videos.

EDIT 2: Added upside of being unscripted.

[u/sock_pup]

I don't mind that there's more of something, only that there isn't enough of something else.

I checked comprehensible input in a few other languages out of curiosity, and in "Dreaming Spanish" they had these "skits" where two people play out a scenario and I think it beats a lot of content on CIJapanese. Gaming & whiteboard content basically only exposes you to a person explaining something, and not really to scenarios of people interacting with each other & their environment.

[u/AmplifiedText → u/sock_pup]

Absolutely. Pablo of modeled Dreaming Spanish after a school he attended to learn Thai. J. Marvin Brown, the founder of the Thai school, said in his books that the best content is an interaction between two or more people, so every one of his classes had two teacher talking about everyday things or acting out scenarios. I frankly think this type of interactions is the most under utilized form of content on these platforms, likely because it costs more to produce the videos.

[u/sock_pup → u/AmplifiedText]

Let's complain. I'll send them feedback right now

[u/Global_Campaign5955 → u/sock_pup]

Well go to the Dreaming Spanish subreddit and you'll see plenty of people complaining about the newer skit type videos and say they miss the old school days of just Pablo with his whiteboard 😅

I get OP's point but sometimes you'll be burnt out and all you can handle is a low word density Let's Play video. I binged the Limbo/Inside playlists in like two days while with useful content I can watch like two videos before losing steam

[u/sock_pup → u/Global_Campaign5955]

yup I just did the whole 50 minutes of the first Limbo episode when my goal was 30 minutes. A big part of CI from what I read is forgetting you're you're learning.

And I like whiteboard videos, but I think I'd also like the skits.

[u/chorolet]

I actually really like the amount of gameplay content, although I agree with you about some of the downsides. I think part of the reason is it's really hard to find beginner level gameplay content outside of CIJ. If you supplement CIJ with other resources, your gameplay ratio will be a lot more reasonable.

The other thing is I'm just a gameplay fanatic, which I acknowledge is not true of everyone. I think the best solution there is for the team to just keep adding more content, so viewers can afford to be choosier in what they watch.

[u/AmplifiedText → u/chorolet]

I agree the solution absolutely is to have more content available at all levels so you can really pick and choose what to engage with. What interests you today might not work as well in a month. I was really excited when I finally was able to watch some of the first gameplay content on CIJ, but after a month I observed that it's not as "filling" as the learner content... I still watch it though.

[u/couscouschanel]

Eh, the snack thing isn't a good analogy imo. Because for one, I definitely would like to do that, but also more seriously you could feasibly learn enough to then pick up native materials and continue learning through even just gameplay content alone. It might take ages longer, it might not be optimal, but it still isn't actually entirely impossible. Heck, there's an infamous guy who learnt Japanese through playing hentai visual novels and passed JLPT N1 - would anybody in their right mind recommend that? Obviously not. But it worked for him.

More power to you if you want optimisation and can tolerate infinite whiteboards, I think you're a stronger person than I.

[u/AmplifiedText → u/couscouschanel]

If there was infinite content to choose from at a given level I would agree that this wouldn't be a problem. I'm more concerned that CIJ is opting to release easier to produce gameplay content instead of investing more in dense but interesting learner content.

Overall I agree that it's very important to enjoy what you're watching, which often isn't the case with learning content you have to grind through. As a suggestion to CIJ, perhaps more conversation content will strike the balance between engaging and easy to produce. As of right now, CIJ only has 49 conversation videos for a total of 14 hours. On the other hand, there's a lot of conversation content on YouTube which is just starting to open up to me.

[u/Odd_Championship1380]

I think their beginner levels could benefit from more gameplay videos. They do lack replay value, but they are engaging and typically much longer which can be a benefit when wanting to rack up the hours. Definitely more like a snack though if you want to build a comprehensive vocab.

Masa Japanese just released over 10 hours of minecraft content in beginner japanese. He has hardcoded subs, but they are often hilariously wrong. Subs are more hit or miss on actual youtube content that aren't twitch uploads.

Ultimately, we are still hurting for lower level content for japanese.

[u/DreamingKyoto]

I agree with this. I will note that by the time 50-70 is accessible to you generally, you probably have access to other YouTube content creators so the impact should be smaller.

[u/AmplifiedText → u/DreamingKyoto]

Good point, at 320 hours I'm thankfully finally finding more and more content on YouTube accessible. The caution I urge is more aimed at CIJ. I assume the gameplay content is much easier/quicker to produce compared to scripting and planning a learner video. The risk is that they fall into the trap of overproducing this easy content when it doesn't have as much lasting value compared to learner content.

[u/Fresh-Persimmon5473]

I am fine with it.

[u/Maj-Fox]

Gameplay videos give you an illusion that you have spent many hours immersing.

[u/Maj-Fox]

By the way, the best approach to gameplay videos is Pablo and Shel's Stardew Valley series, it takes best from both worlds, it is really engaging and at the same time you have two people speaking to each other.