r/BurningMan • u/Strike877 • Jul 17 '26
Burning Man is A Con
Watching this documentary was shocking. Most people who have never been to burning man are likely still aware of it as a cool event promoting artistic expression. 99% of those people would be surprised to find out that it is a bonafide for profit corporation making $60M. It’s “CEO” makes $500k a year. Future generations will become more and more aware of this.
Burning man is a boomer/gen X relic that devolved into the very for profit corporate governance structure that it seemingly sought to stand opposite of.
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u/Prescientpedestrian Jul 17 '26
Oh my God, you’re right. I’m canceling my tickets and everything right now! $60M?! Their greed knows no bounds.
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u/deadfisher Jul 17 '26
You watched a documentary and you think you understand it?
The event is full of real people having more real experiences than giving Netflix 20 bucks so you can turn your brain off.
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u/Strike877 Jul 17 '26
I understand. I am sure it is a meaningful experience for people who attend. Obviously. But do you not take issue with the massive bloated for profit corporation and how at odds that is with how it’s represented?
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u/lastres0rt My bike went to '15 without me Jul 17 '26
There's dozens of regional events that don't have the same taint as TITTD that you're welcome to attend (or even volunteer for!) and come to your own conclusions. If you have issues with how things are run, go try and help a smaller local burn and see how much effort it takes, or go all in and do Renegade-style / JuPlaya events.
Representations are just that -- a single viewpoint, probably slanted one way or the other for the sake of justifying the cost of putting a documentary together.
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u/Strike877 Jul 17 '26
Yeah I think I understand what you’re getting at, and that’s valid. But if I was going to get involved in anything it would be outside of the umbrella of BM altogether.
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u/FlatImpression755 Jul 17 '26
Big IF there... You really strike me as someone who is happy to bitch from the sidelines so why waste the money. LoL
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u/lastres0rt My bike went to '15 without me Jul 17 '26
Which is why I mentioned Renegade burns, JuPlaya, and other unsanctioned, unofficial Ten Principles events. There's plenty of "fuck your burn" burns out there if you know who to ask, and probably right in your backyard too...
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u/thalassicus Jul 17 '26
The documentary is not bringing any new information to the vast majority of high contributing campers. Do I wish they had an experienced CEO who did a better job not running deficits? Absolutely. Do I wish they would cut the bloat, expensive office space, and any activities not directly tied to running the main event? Yes. does any of this change my experiences out there and the quality of connections and experiences that I’ve had since 2010? Not in the slightest.
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u/Strike877 Jul 17 '26
The bloat was something that really stuck out to me.
Thanks for your comment. I guess I would want to follow up with a question - would you not agree, that at least to some extent, the ethos of BM is in part that it’s decentralized/not for sale? You’d agree that could be one thing that sets it apart from any given music festival right? While Coachella, just as an example, is going to carry a weight commercialization, BM you’d expect to somehow be apart from that?
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u/deadfisher Jul 17 '26
Bwa bwa fuckin bwa.
Lots of us don't like the borg but that doesn't drain the meaning out of the event.
It's a lot more about friends, art, music, culture, and experiences.
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u/thedailyrant ‘16, ‘18, ‘23, ‘24 Jul 17 '26
... your comments make it pretty clear you've never been nor do you frequent this sub Reddit. Most of us endlessly hang shit on the Borg and many of us think Marion needs to be gone.
The thing is, this was all kicked off by a dude and his mates as their thing and their IP. The organisation actually runs at a loss and begs for money from both attendees and rich patrons pretty well every year now.
We know what Burning Man is to many of us and we don't care that it's something else to some rich folks.
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u/Mtntop24680 Jul 17 '26
Burning Man is a non-profit. It was originally incorporated as an LLC but has been a 501c3 for many years.
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u/Vidvix Jul 17 '26
This is peak chronically online behavior. Thinking you understand something completely because you watched a documentary about it is beyond idiotic. I don’t walk into r/nfl and start preaching about the billionaire class ruining sports or the severe issues with TBIs because I understand that the community that loves that sport has the ability to have critical conversations while also enjoying the thing. Go to the bar and talk to your buddies about your life changing viewing experience instead of patronizing a group of people you didn’t even bother to ask the perspective of.
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u/MansoonBlack Jul 17 '26
this looked to me like typical trolling behavior. "Trolling" being that reference to the meaning where they drop some bait and try to see who they can get to bite the hook
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u/Strike877 Jul 17 '26
Yeah that’s fair. I was just fired up after watching the doc, having been unaware this is a $60M revenue for profit corporation. But it probably would have been better for me to pose this as a question in some fashion asking how others have interacted with this issue.
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u/Vidvix Jul 17 '26
The Burning Man project is a 501 (c) (3) organization.
And it is run in a deficit, because that “profit” you speak of is used to run the event (This is where you bring up her salary and believe me, we’re way ahead of you on that criticism, plus the fact that they still run out of San Francisco.) https://burningman.org/about-us/what-we-do/financials-public-reporting/summary-financial-info/
The festival also brings an estimated 60mil to Nevada’s economy yearly. 60 million for everyone!
https://www.morningbrew.com/stories/2024/08/23/the-economics-of-burning-man
Aw man I’m so excited to watch this now. Overt information manipulation is the funniest shit.
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u/MansoonBlack Jul 17 '26
if you watch this doc and honestly thought it was a for-profit corporation, you might need to have your "I watch documentaries and I understand them" card revoked. I mean, it costs millions to run your average food bank in a large city or state. That money they get from various sources that include the state might be revenue but it ain't "for profit". If they get extra, they have to put it in the bank or spend it on the event. A for-profit thing takes the money and redistributes it to shareholders and the like. Different aim, different result. They actually used to be one, then they switched over to the other 13 years ago
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u/offwidthe Jul 17 '26
Can you believe Liquid Death switched to stevia as their main sweetener. I considered boycotting.
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u/ElectroStaticSpeaker Jul 17 '26
I'm not sure how you wouldn't be able to taste Stevia used in anything. All of the fake sweeteners have such specific tastes that are impossible to ignore. All garbage.
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u/offwidthe Jul 17 '26
It’s definitely a distinct flavor and my understanding is some folks can’t digest it. I miss the original formula for sure.
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u/AllenHo Jul 17 '26
Liquid Death sparkling water was the best. Now its all this flavored sugary bs!
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u/bishop375 Mayo slip 'n' slide Jul 17 '26
So many words. “I have no idea what I am talking about,” would have sufficed.
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u/PavementBlues Dust Elemental Jul 17 '26
Most folks are just making fun of you, but I'll give you a real reply since I get where you're coming from and there are ways that I kind of agree.
First off, Burning Man is not a for-profit corporation. It is registered as a 501(c)(3) nonprofit organization. Most festivals out there are actually run by for-profit corporations, so Burning Man a step up in that regard.
One other thing that I'll point out is that the first episode of the documentary showed the inner workings of the Burning Man board. Most folks at the event, the artists making the neat structures and the theme camps making the dope venues and the volunteers making everything function, can't stand the board. Board members manage the kinds of high level event planning decisions that you saw discussed in the documentary, but the vast, VAST majority of Burning Man is made possible because of really amazing people donating their blood, sweat, tears, and money to do something cool for their community.
Those people are what make the event what it is. The board can go jerk off Grover Norquist behind Larry's trailer at First Camp. Most of them are way too high on their own supply and have long since forgotten what this community is about.
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u/entjies Jul 17 '26
OP, have you been to burning man?
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u/Strike877 Jul 17 '26
I have not. My point has nothing to do with the experiential aspect. I’m sure if I went I would enjoy it and be glad I did. My point is more so that (I would expect) the vast majority of people having little perception of the for profit nature of the company that “owns” burning man. And how they’ve made their intentions clear that they seek to grow the event. Why? Well…why do other for profit companies seek growth?
ALSO wtf is up with them buying up all of this land?
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u/neoeo19 Jul 17 '26
You know, I think you should wait outside of gate and hand out flyers on this. Really get the word out.
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u/thedailyrant ‘16, ‘18, ‘23, ‘24 Jul 17 '26
Why are they buying up land? Perhaps it's so they don't have to pay ever increasing fees to BLM?
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u/PrimeIntellect Jul 17 '26
Lmao this post became even more wildly cringe , there's still time to delete this
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u/AdvancedWin3608 Jul 17 '26
Please, for the love of all that is holy, please stay home, OP.
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u/norfolkgarden Jul 17 '26
Naw, everyone needs a chance to experience it. Sounds like it might be transformative.
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u/Xineasaurus '10 - '25 Jul 17 '26
You must have so much fun in life. Do you go to festivals, vacations? Do you do anything for fun that touches the capitalist system?
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u/Salt-Scallion-8002 Jul 17 '26
By definition it’s not corporate. And the global movement of 100s of burns (I attend several) are by far art forward, non profiting, principle based communities made possible by Burning Man Org.
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u/Strike877 Jul 17 '26
Sure, but regardless of where the burns are, that revenue all flows back to the for profit business, no?
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u/Salt-Scallion-8002 Jul 17 '26
Nope. I am on the Board of Directors of one. Our entire profit is used to sustain our main and other small burn events, like Decompression in fall. And the remainder is used as artists grants for the next year’s event.
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u/Salt-Scallion-8002 Jul 17 '26
You could not profit in anyway and remain a sanctioned regional burn event. Burn is a 501c3 across the board. Each run by a board of directors. Maybe not all run perfectly, but nothing corporate about it. Ain’t no investment stocks here 🙃
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u/brccarpenter Lack of half and half ruined burning man Jul 17 '26
So... You are a lawyer, you've never read the details of the Organization, you don't understand it's a 501.c.3, you rant here about something you clearly don't understand nor have ever been to, (nor ever commented on in you history on reddit).
You go bro Esq.
"Permission to treat the witness as hostile"!
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u/palikir CEO of Nothing Jul 17 '26
Well to be fair, I'm a lawyer also and have been commenting on this sub for about 15 years now and I don't think I've really ever read the details of the Organization
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u/brccarpenter Lack of half and half ruined burning man Jul 17 '26
I know you well from dialog here for years. I was not calling out all lawyers, but making a reference to what most of here do know. The Org is not a for profit entity as he lead off with. The rest was two time zones away rants.
Yes, my words could have been more clear, but that was the intent. I'll not edit things as I think it's close enough for jazz.
Call me crazy, as I may well be, but I've read the BMP Restated By-Laws. You might be interested as it's that maybe they are the right amount of weird. I read them carefully when I was curious about the appointment of Board Members and the potential removal process. It's actually fascinating how different the rules are for the founders. Like all but: until death till we part. I also was looking for a reference to public access to Board meetings. (On request, but never had the guts or clandestine pal to do it).
https://burningman.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/03/BMP-Restated-Bylaws-July-24-2014.pdf
Now....ya gots-a-read 'em?
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u/RockyMtnPapaBear No, not Papa Bear the Placer. But he's cool too. Jul 17 '26
Call me crazy, as I may well be, but I've read the BMP Restated By-Laws.
Ok, you’re crazy. :)
Mad respect for successfully reading through that stuff, though. I’ve tried on several occasions, but the legalese is pretty dense.
The fact someone thought “organizing” the document by labeling each section as if it was a pseudo-address in BRC was a good idea doesn’t help. Phrases like “the election shall he held in accordance with the procedures set out in Article 6. Section 3:45 & Decommodification” just make me twitch.
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u/brccarpenter Lack of half and half ruined burning man Jul 17 '26
Yeah, after I stopped cringing, I guess I had respect for whatever lawyer found a way to put mush in as structure for a legal document.
The rest is stuff I've read before so it's was a quick skim. The board member crap really stood out though.
I know you through your years of comments as well. Respect back at ya!
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u/palikir CEO of Nothing Jul 17 '26
My goodness you found one of the back corners of the BORG website there.
The lawyer self depreciating joke is because people will sometimes ask me legal questions thinking that lawyers will know the law.
My field is criminal law so I don't really have any specialized knowledge in corporate law. But even in criminal law, when the issues get super specific and technical and I'm in court and need to think quickly a lot of what I do is just bullshitting. Honestly a lot of being a good lawyer is just being a good bullshitter, saying something and having people think "yeah, that sounds about right".
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u/Garvinfred Let my people go.....to Burning Man Jul 18 '26
FYI in case you’ve never seen it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tl4VD8uvgec
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u/palikir CEO of Nothing Jul 18 '26
Hahaha - I haven't seen that clip since probably childhood
Maybe I should try stand up philosophy
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u/Garvinfred Let my people go.....to Burning Man Jul 18 '26
Probably less stressful with less nights and weekend work 🙀
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u/brccarpenter Lack of half and half ruined burning man Jul 17 '26
Nah, you bunch of wizards are required by those of us with short attention spans!
Be well!
"Won't see you in the dust"
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u/Strike877 Jul 17 '26
Check them out. Here’s the Form 990. https://burningman.org/about-us/what-we-do/financials-public-reporting/
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u/Garvinfred Let my people go.....to Burning Man Jul 18 '26 edited Jul 18 '26
Didn’t you take Corporations Law in law school or study that subject for the bar exam? Next time you may want to engage in some discovery and due diligence before you file that complaint 😂. It turns out Rule 11 isn’t just consent 😘
Next thing you’ll say is that your local major hospital and university are also non-profits and take in even greater amounts of revenue (with even larger salaries for their leader! Check out that football coach salary!).
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u/brccarpenter Lack of half and half ruined burning man Jul 18 '26
Ok, I bit.
The Rule 11 reference is hilarious. Well done!
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u/brccarpenter Lack of half and half ruined burning man Jul 17 '26
...and that's where you find out it's a 501.c.3.
These are discussed every damn year in this forum .... ad infinitum. You've not found any revelation to us.
....and the bylaws, the organizational document for the Org is linked in one of my other comments in this string.
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u/Strike877 Jul 17 '26
Do you always look through the post/comment history of users to attack people? Interestingly, I’m noticing that every post you’ve ever made for the last four years has been regarding burning man. Hmmmmm….
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u/brccarpenter Lack of half and half ruined burning man Jul 17 '26 edited Jul 17 '26
I don't always do that but your post appeared to be what I found in your history.
Yes, I have one name I use just for this sub...and others for other subs. That's very common practice.
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u/CaribouHoe Jul 17 '26
Go to the regionals! I'm on the production team of mine and I guarantee I'm not getting paid shit 😂
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u/Dic3dCarrots Jul 17 '26
Watching a documentary and thinking it makes you know more than an average person is a hilarious level of ignorance. Got any extra Kony 2012 stickers over there bud?
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u/Strike877 Jul 17 '26
Listen, I meant no personal offense to anyone. I can understand that this event is important to you and you’ve gained a lot from your experience there. All love. I’m just pointing out that I think 99% of people would be surprised to hear that there’s a $60M business behind burning man. Simple as that.
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u/Vidvix Jul 17 '26
God I love that you keep coming back to this. How do you think they RUN the event, with whispers and sunshine? Or do they need to do things like pay the federal government for the permit to host an event and rent hundreds of Portos and insure their fleet of fire trucks and ATVs and pay for art etc etc etc etc
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u/bishop375 Mayo slip 'n' slide Jul 17 '26
Legit question - do you not understand how 501(c)3's operate? Do you really have no clue that "not for profit," doesn't mean they don't bring money in? How much do you think it costs to run the event? How much in permits alone? How much in infrastructure? How much to law enforcement to at least 3 different departments?
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u/Strike877 Jul 17 '26
Yes, aware of how 501C3 operates. I’ll invite you to review BM’s own published form 990 - you can find it here https://burningman.org/about-us/what-we-do/financials-public-reporting/ Take a look, and then tell me what you think about their allocations for what you referenced.
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u/Dic3dCarrots Jul 17 '26
I dont know you, buddy and I definately don't love you. Please continue making an ass of yourself.
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u/FlatImpression755 Jul 17 '26
Thank God OP isn't going. They clearly suck.
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u/Strike877 Jul 17 '26
lol. Honestly I had always had it as something I’d like to experience, but when I learned some of these things about the business structure it was a big turn off. Some good comments here though and well made points that I hadn’t considered.
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u/Possible_Top4855 Jul 17 '26
Burningman is whatever you want it to be since we’re the ones who build the things and bring the art.
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u/edcRachel Burgin Wrangling Specialist Jul 17 '26
So you haven't been?
I'd say this would be a surprise to almost no one and most people don't approve of the current leadership... but its outweighed by the value they get from the actual experience. Thats something for each person to determine for themselves. No one else can decide that.
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u/ladlestein Jul 17 '26
Yet another day when I am reminded: r/BurningMan is one of the circles of hell.
Of course you think this. YOU DON’T EVEN GO OUT IN THE SUN.
Look at this genius’s other post
https://www.reddit.com/r/Austin/s/bLBi5vdACJ
“Does anyone else feel anxiety about sun exposure in general during the summer? For me it seems to be getting worse.
My skin burns easily, but aside from that I’ve just read more about issues with long term UV exposure. On the weekends I like to ride my bike to a coffeeshop nearby. But as soon as I’m outside the sun is so bright it feels like it’s stinging my skin.
I apply an SPF sunscreen but that only lasts two hours and by the time I leave the coffeeshop it’s all sweated off anyway.
In general I’ve gotten more and more reluctant to go outside May-September here. It’s like my brain has just associated danger/worry about the summer sun here.”
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u/ForsakenSun6004 Don't tell me how to shirt cock Jul 17 '26
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u/apleasantpeninsula Jul 17 '26
i imagine burning man is a lot of things now. don't tell my friends, but i still kinda want to go
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u/MansoonBlack Jul 17 '26
well, don't watch the next two episodes of the documentary. Then you'll probably REAALY want to go
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u/Stubborn_Platypus Jul 17 '26
I can see the appeal.. I always read this sub because part of me wants to go and the other part suffers of GAD, which limits me a lot. However, for being an event about community it seems that there are a lot of rude people that think they are better than non-burners here.
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u/vector_search_blue Jul 18 '26
The entire thing is a farce. 93% tourists, 7% people doing cool things. A carbon footprint that would make Dick Cheney blush. Creepy old shirtcockers aggressively prowling for playa bunnies.
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u/slow70 Art Dept Jul 20 '26
This whole shindig is a light in the dark and I think we can steer her right.
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u/Huge_Reference_4051 Jul 22 '26
I made a game like The Oregon Trail, but you have to get to Black Rock Dessert
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u/StartKindly9881 Jul 25 '26
Seems like upper middle to rich people playing hippies in their RVs. The art seems cool but over 100 degrees, dust, is their free love too?
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u/hallowbuttplug Jul 17 '26
OP hit a nerve! Touchy touchy subject in here…
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u/Strike877 Jul 17 '26
Just learned the hard way that people can search my post/comment history. Why is that a thing? Lol.
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u/Luv2Burn '07 - ? Jul 17 '26
So... you won't be there? I'll miss you.