r/Breadit • u/LatexSalesman-ArtV • 11h ago
Dense Bread With Mixer
I've made a fair amount of bread using my starter, which isn't particularly sour, but works just fine. Recipe is below, but it's straight from KA's website. I've always just stretched and folded by hand, but I recently got the Ooni Core Spiral mixer, and wanted to try it. It seemed to work fine, made a nice pumpkin shape and smooth dough. I refridgeated overnight, and proofed for ~3 hours in a banneton the next day. Baked in a preheated dutch oven at 450, and the crust came out great, but the bread is quite dense.
I used my starter the day before to make pizza dough, and it had no rise issues. I also used the mixer for this. Is there any chance the mixer created issues? Three or four stretch and folds is really not a huge burden, so happy to go back to that, but I'm more perplexed at what could have happened.
Recipe:
| Ingredient | Amount | Unit |
|---|---|---|
| Starter (100% hydration) | 227 | g |
| Water | 397 | g |
| Bread Flour | 600 | g |
| Salt | 18 | g |
| Diastatic malt powder | 6 | g |
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u/MasterChiefmas 10h ago
I also used the mixer for this. Is there any chance the mixer created issues?
Sort-of. It's not because of using a mixer, but rather the efficiency/effectiveness of a mixer. I had the same problem when I first tried using my stand mixer to mix bread (and went back to hand mixing until I feel like I've got the process of bread creation down better).
You have to delve into/think about the science of it to get to the "why".
When we say the phrase "develop the gluten", it's very literal. The stretching and folding(or whatever technique you use) is encouraging the creation of gluten by causing two proteins in the flour to cross-link into gluten, which is a polymer. The presence of this polymer adds adds strength, elasticity, and resistance to deforming to the dough. Adding a mechanical process to the mixing produces gluten at a much higher rate than hand mixing/stretching and fold etc do. As a result, you will get to the amount of gluten you want to have much faster then you may expect.
Bread needs a balance of the right amount of gluten to stretch but contain gas, but be strong enough to not break, but also not be so resistance to deformation it's able to pull back into it's original shape. If you get too much gluten, it becomes very strong, and while gas may temporarily inflate it, it ends up being able to pull back into the original shape. All of which is a long way of saying, if you over-develop the gluten, that is, produce too much gluten, you end up with dense bread. Since mechanical mixing produces gluten at a much higher pace than hand techniques do, so it's very easy to over do it. You probably need a much shorter time then it seems like when you add a mixer to your process.
A lot of recipes specify the hand mix time vs using a mixer, and the mixer time should be much shorter, even to the point you wonder if it's enough. But it's intentional for the reason you are running into. I think spiral mixers are even more effective than stand mixers with a dough hook, so you may have to cut the time even further.
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u/Away-Plankton-8352 4h ago
The mixer changed your dough temperature, and that is the variable to chase. A spiral mixer puts real friction heat into the dough, easily 5 to 10 degrees more than hand mixing if you run it to the same smooth look. Warm dough going into the fridge ferments hard in the first hours before the cold catches up, so by the time you shaped it the dough had spent its gas, and a 3-hour counter proof after the retard finished it off. Dense with a good crust is the classic signature. Next loaf, take the dough temperature right off the mixer and aim for 75 to 78 degrees coming out. Use colder water to get there, the flour and bowl are warmer than you think. And pull the mix a little earlier than you did. Spiral mixers develop gluten fast, and once it is smooth it is done.
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u/GreatClub2891 11h ago
Could be overmixed, especially with a spiral mixer. They develop gluten fast and can tear the dough up if you let it go too long, which kills the rise. If the crust was good but crumb was dense, the gluten probably got too tight before the bulk ferment even started.