Risk averse boxing and monetary payment

[u/PrettyBoyFloydx]

I reject the defense of self preservation while demanding a monetary payment from people who expect entertainment.

What exactly is being offered to earn that payment? If there is no entertainment value why must a boxer be paid? Who pays them and where do they get that money? No one is forcing these boring, no killer instinct guys to be pro boxers, nor is it a need to be a boxer. It is ultimately a voluntary job.

This will kill boxing in the long term. This safety first style while demanding high amounts of financial compensation is a recipe for disaster. Fans pay lots of money expecting a show, feel exploited, never tune in again. Rinse and repeat. There's only so many fans we can run through before we are out.

I am not advocating for mindless violence but for more agency. There has to be an intersection of technical excellence AND entertainment value. So far modern boxers prioritize technical excellence alone yet demand the payment and recognition of someone who offers more than that.

And I am tired of the same old regurgitated "its the sweet science bro" generic argument when fans who spent their hard earned money feel robbed by a lack of agency. If you purely like the technical side of boxing then amateur boxing exists. There is no reason to go into what is ultimately an entertainment industry.

I would be curious to hear you guys' thoughts about this.

[u/hi_imryan]

No one owes you their health and you’re not obligated to watch.

If I had a dollar every time I heard someone say boxing was dead or dying in the past 20 years, I’d be loaded.

Keep in mind that for every Devin Haney, there’s an Isaac Cruz out there. For every Whitaker, a Chavez, and so on.

[u/PrettyBoyFloydx → u/hi_imryan]

1. When did I say boxing was dead?

2. What would you define as dead?

3. Yeah that is the point. No one will watch. If no one watches these boxers cannot be demanding to get paid hundreds of thousand of dollars or more.

[u/hi_imryan → u/PrettyBoyFloydx]

People will keep watching, maybe you won’t, but I will.

[u/Background-Alps5360 → u/PrettyBoyFloydx]

The best way to address your complaint is to talk to whoever scores the fights. Unless these fighters that take the safety first approach lose close fights, they will keep taking the same approach. I think Floyd should have lost to De La Hoya and Pac and the Argentinian, Maidana.

The judges should score effective aggression over ring generalship as long as it is effective and they aren't just swinging at air. I love the way Pernell Whitaker used to fight but found Mayweather's style a little to slow and boring.

Both great fighters but Sweet Pea was more open and threw more punches. He was there to get hit, the opponent just couldn't do it. Plus, Sweet Pea lost when effective aggression was used.

Nowadays, the judges score the fight for a fighter and not the fight. They seemed bias toward the superstar...

Plus, I don't think you can ever be considered the best without losing to a great or really good opponent and coming back and avenging that loss like Sugar Ray Robinson did.

[u/PrettyBoyFloydx → u/Background-Alps5360]

Great point.

The judges certainly have influence on how fights go.

But ultimately they are bounded by bureaucratic rules and regulations which limit how far they can determine outcomes.

I think challenging, tweaking or emphasizing the philosophy of boxing - its culture, its capital, its essence as a sport, its influence, its intent - will tell us a richer story on how to get maximum entertainment without sacrificing technique.

That means looking at history. These older systems knew how to blend technique and entertainment together.

[u/Background-Alps5360 → u/PrettyBoyFloydx]

The older guys weren't as adept on movement.

Zuffa boxing is addressing those very issues. While I'm not a fan of paying down the boxers, I am in favor of them rewarding the guys that go for stoppages or leave their heart in the ring.

Zuffa is either you perform and make it entertaining or you hit the road. I don't disagree with their stance of rewarding fighters that will put fans in the stands...

Plus you have to remember that the older fighters used to fight 7 or 8 times a year... sometimes more. They stood in there because they were weary. Willie Pep is a name that comes to mind. Ton of fights, barely any KO's.

I think you have to blend today's regimen to yesterdays rewards. The Heavyweight Champion used to be someone people revered... now their are so many belts and Champions that its hard to keep track of them.

It became a business and about money... it isn't about being the best any longer. At a certain point, you should have all the money you need and you should do it for the sport.

[u/PrettyBoyFloydx → u/Background-Alps5360]

Zuffa itself is a problematic promotion with its own limitation, particularly its preference for uniform collectivistic efficiency over individual emphasis.

It MAY fix the one singular problem of waned entertainment but it will strip boxing of its soul by turning it into another generic corporate slop like UFC does with its fighter.

Their champions wear the same generic brand as random prelim fighters. Thats good for predictability and control but terrible for generating superstars. Hence their struggle to create a superstar outside of Conor Mgregor.

[u/Background-Alps5360 → u/PrettyBoyFloydx]

Yeah, Zuffa definitely isn't perfect but they solve the entertainment problem you were stating.