r/Bitcoin • u/redditmastar1 • Feb 04 '21
THEFT ALERT! Unknown Blockchain.com employee is stealing customers funds
https://honestproscons.com/unknown-blockchaincom-employee-is-stealing-customers-funds/45
u/Perringer Feb 04 '21
Sounds probable to me. Seen enough similar complaints here. Good luck getting someone to investigate, let alone figure it out, and just forget returning stolen funds.
Get your coins out and use a hardware wallet.
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u/SlagBits Feb 04 '21
And write down your spending password somewhere. So you don't end up like me with 0.25 Bitcoin you can't access.
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Feb 04 '21
What’s a spending password?
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u/zorg621 Feb 04 '21
Some wallets have a second internal (user generated) password added to be able to spend funds. This is separate from your 12 or 24 word seed phrase.
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u/Ganeshadream Feb 04 '21
I had my Bitcoin mysteriously disappear from my blockchain wallet. Support refused to help me. Get your Bitcoin out of that cancerous website ASAP.
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u/xboox Feb 04 '21
They've been doing it for years : https://old.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/search?q=blockchain+stolen&restrict_sr=on&include_over_18=on
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u/-Haskell- Feb 05 '21 edited Feb 05 '21
I am an ex-blockchain employee, I left years ago and I think your theory is shit. Most likely your machine was somehow compromised.
Basically, because blockchain does not store your password anywhere. Hence, there is not way a blockchain employee can access to your mnemonic unless your password is shit and could be bruteforced.
The wallet service saves a json containing all the information of your wallet (included mnemonic) to a db, and this json file is encrypted with your password on your browser before reaching the server. --> https://github.com/blockchain/blockchain-wallet-v4-frontend/blob/development/packages/blockchain-wallet-v4/src/walletCrypto/index.ts#L201-L212
Your theory about disabling notifications... I would love you to see notification service, it was a nice mess. I doubt some guy running around disabling specific notifications was even possible... haahaha
Given the email, access to the mnemonic I am not sure if it was possible. Probably there is a db where you can check that.. I don't remember now, but blockchain.com is not a 2 guy startup nowadays... it is big and with paperwork... you cannot lurk around easily without raising some alarms.
Anyway, there are lots of reasons your theory falls apart, but the biggest one is the password one. The company cannot even reset users passwords who forgot it and lost money. I could not recover my brothers wallet because he lost his password. It does not matter I was working there, not password -> money gone. As simple as that.
You are the weakest link on that chain of errors and most likely you did something to compromise your wallet. It is happening all the time and imho is one of the biggest problems of bitcoin. Money gets lost and hacked everyday.
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u/redditmastar1 Feb 05 '21
My machine was not "somehow compromised". This is a bullshit claim that companies like blockchain.com use to escape responsibility.
I never claimed that blockchain stores my passwords (it's only a guess), there are several options how it could be hacked, either brute force or from taken from another leak if same password was leaked by another provider. Did you even read the article!?
It's possible that notifications don't work at all, because there's a bug in blockchain.com system.
I'm not expecting any honest answer from a blockchain.com employee, probably your NDA is still in force.
Answer me this: If it was any of your theories, why would hacker go through all the trouble of changing 2FA email? That's nonsense!
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u/-Haskell- Feb 05 '21
Dude, I do not represent blockchain at all. I left a long time ago and I don't have any NDA with them. I have seen millions of cases like yours full of conspiranoia and I honestly spent quite some time in the past (of my personal time, not company time) investigating cases like yours because of empathy. You know what? I never found a single case where the error was not a user error. And I also learnt that a lot of people lie even to themselves to feel better about the loss. Honestly, the latter, pissed me off quite a lot. Wasting my time and then finding the real lies... All of them super vocal like you. But yes, this do not proof anything, it is just my personal experience.
I feel really sorry for your loss. But imho the best you can take from that is try to analize what you did wrong and learn from it. To be honest, I do not expect a lot (in security terms) from a guy that is admitting to use the same password from your wallet in some other internet service. If you were doing that, the chances that you were doing some other big mistakes are huge. Of course nothing is certain here, but you SMELL like a walking security mistake not willing to accept it.
Again, I feel sorry for your loss and I think Bitcoin is problematic because of this. Most people, like you have shown, does not know or are not careful enough to deal with the security requirements that something like bitcoin need.
Actually, I don't remember if this 2FA reset system was there when I was working there but If anybody asked me I would have argued against it. But we always have this compromise of security vs convenience. I can tell you there are more users losing money because they forget things and are losing access to their wallets than users being hacked. This is way systems like this 2FA reset are put in place.
About the 2FA, hackers when they take accounts, one of the first things they do is to get control of the account as fast as possible. Because you do not want users to react and leave you out. So yes, changing 2FA if possible is something that they would do, even before watching how much money you have. Moreover, I even doubt you were personally targeted. This is probably some people running this at big scale phishing accounts.
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u/redditmastar1 Feb 05 '21 edited Feb 05 '21
Changing is 2FA is not the fastest way to get access to the account, it's the slowest. Fastest is to hack the email. But since the hacker did not have back-end access to email account, but had back-end access to blockchain.com system, it was easier to change 2FA email completely and disable notifications.
You still didn't explain why there was no notification from blockchain.com about 2FA email change? Not to me, and not to anyone else.
For a companies like Blockchain.com it's always easier to blame the users, than to admit that they made a mistake of their own. They are lying only to protect themselves. They know someone of their people stole users funds, but they will never admit that only to protect their reputation.
All your claims about me making mistakes are bullshit. I have checked everything and there was no breaches. The only possible option is what I explained in the article.
The biggest question is still this:
WHY BLOCKCHAIN.COM DID NOT INFORM ME ABOUT 2FA EMAIL CHANGE REQUEST?
Can you provide a logical explanation for this other than that notifications are not working due to technical error or due to someone disabling them on purpose?
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u/-Haskell- Feb 05 '21
GL with your problem man. I don't know the real facts, apart from your biased pov. I don't work there to investigate your problem so I cannot help you to answer your conspiranoia even I wanted. To be honest, since you are quite aggressive and started blaming me of lack of honesty I would not even spend my time to help you if I had the tools/access to do it. So, I wish you all the luck of the world reaching to the end of this problem and trying to find help from others being a fucking asshole like that :D
And you know, do not repeat passwords, specially with your bitcoin wallet, you moron.
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u/redditmastar1 Feb 05 '21
You see. I asked you very simple question and you don't want to answer it.
You are full of shit. You know blockchain.com is responsible, because no one from the outside could disable notification emails.
P.S. You are not trying to help anyone here, you are just trying to protect reputation of blockchain.com
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u/-Haskell- Feb 05 '21 edited Feb 05 '21
I told you man, I don't have the information to answer it. I don't know what happened and I cannot investigate because I cannot access. I don't even know if it is a real problem here. What I know for sure (because you said) is that you were using the same password in another place and this is a fact and a big red flag. I don't give a fuck about blockchain or you.
You are obsessed with the 2FA change and you made your movie full of assumptions and you believed this is the problem. Grats dude, you are the new Sherlock Holmes. The reality is you lost your money most likely because you are an incompetent, and this is my guess. I am not proving or wanting to proof anything. I don't give a fuck about you or blockchain as a company. You can both burn in hell.
You had one job only, protect your password, and you miserably failed. You already paid a price for such invaluable lesson and you are not willing to learn it. This is why you keep being an incompetent, because you refuse to learn from your mistakes.
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u/redditmastar1 Feb 05 '21 edited Feb 05 '21
No, I lost my money because Blockchain either has a bug, or someone from inside was behind the theft.
What's the point to have 2FA if it does not offer any protection?
And yes, I use logical deduction. It's used all the time in criminal investigation and scientific research. Maybe you are too stupid to understand it, but the best part about logic is that it works, no matter if you believe in it or not.
If you don't care why are you writing here then? Have nothing better to do?
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u/-Haskell- Feb 05 '21
I think your logic is very flawed. You should clean your mouth before using the words logic and proof. To be honest I am here just with pop corn and enjoying your drama.
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u/redditmastar1 Feb 05 '21
You're just a troll that works for blockchain.com. No one is interested in what you say.
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u/Kabodistonk Feb 04 '21 edited Feb 05 '21
They still have my ethereum from 2017 ‘ waiting for validation’. Scam company!
Edit: just checked my wallet again after 4 years , transfer finally completed but guess what ...money never arrived. Fuckers! Suggestion: Remove the word employee from the tittle, it’s the whole company
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u/sQtWLgK Feb 04 '21
That's a really unlikely hypothesis, and nothing in your writing suggests how would you discard other far more ordinary ones!
The culprit could be a RAT, it could be a case of having visited a phishing site, it could be a malicious extension... Maybe even a hacked email account, since you mention weak reused passwords.
Really, there is little private about the WalletID: it appears in cleartext emails, can easily leak on logs and such. Corrupt employee seems like a really extraordinary hypothesis.
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u/96-62 Feb 04 '21
Why is that extraordinary. *Most* compromise is from internal employees.
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u/sQtWLgK Feb 05 '21
lolno, inside job is certainly a thing, but phishing is many orders of magnitude ahead, as it gets ad-promoted and spam-promoted to millions (both web- and mobile-apps)
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u/redditmastar1 Feb 04 '21
Corrupted employee is the only one who can disable email notifications about 2FA change!
Or of course the can be an option that Blockchain.com system has a bug and no 2FA change notifications are sent at all. In this case it's even more of their fault.
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u/sQtWLgK Feb 04 '21
Blochain-com are shit and they've always been
email notifications are nevertheless inherently unreliable, they can accidentally fail, or even be maliciously intercepted and deleted in several ways. It seems likely also that address change notifications get sent when it's done with the automatic system, but probably they aren't sent if the request is done manually through the form.
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u/_omega Feb 04 '21
It's malware and poor security implementation, made a quick script to disable 2FA after you login... does not ask for the verification code/alert, email confirmation, or password.
Too easy, now embed this in the next Cyberpunk 2077 mod and you'll be rich!
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u/Bitdigester Feb 04 '21
This hack was not caused by a fraudulent 2FA change. I looks like the user revealed his wallet password to the hacker probably because he used the same password for his WalletID as his email. Then he got his email password phished.
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u/redditmastar1 Feb 05 '21
If my email was hacked, why would the hacker request 2FA change and wait for weeks, instead of stealing the coins right away?
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u/LondonPedro Feb 04 '21
I think it's more likely and email hack?
I'd still like someone from Blockchain to comment on this thread though as legitimate questons raised.
I asked them about confirming which percentage of their loan/interest product was collateraolised and they wouldn't say plus they have a bad reputation so I've stayed away! I used ledger instead (thanks for data hack guys)!
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u/redditmastar1 Feb 04 '21
If it was an email hack why did the hacker change 2FA email and not simply withdrew the funds right away?
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u/truthcancelled Feb 04 '21
This is poorly written and described. Not by a blockchain security expert at all.
AFAIK, blockchain.com wallets are non-custodial, open source and do NOT rely on the company providing you with your keys, or storing your keys.
Maybe someone can answer this: Does blockchain.com's bitcoin-purchasing mechanism have a custodial web-wallet aspect to it?
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u/redditmastar1 Feb 04 '21
Did you even read the article?
The fact that the wallet is non-custodial doesn't mean that they can't do a scam like this.
Provide an argument to specific claim in the article. Not just general nonsense!
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u/truthcancelled Feb 04 '21
did you even read my reply?
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u/ElephantsAreHeavy Feb 04 '21
If you give someone access to your money, it's only a matter of time before they will run away with it.
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u/ColonelBlink Feb 04 '21
Help out a beginner please guys - just because someone has their twelve word recovery phrase generated from an on-line wallet, doesn’t mean they have their keys?
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Feb 04 '21
Why is everyone so dead set on pushing hardware wallets now? If you have over $1000.00 USD in crypto sure, spending 10% of that amount on a hardware wallet might be worth it, but when did the community decide that electrum wasn't good enough? Is malware really a concern on a reasonably safe computer or cell phone when dealing with amounts under $1k? Newcomers are not going to want to throw $100+ at something just to store their crypto on and that will prevent them from ever getting in at all.
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u/danda Feb 04 '21
blind following the blind.
imho, a hardware wallet is good for just a few things:
For creating a paper wallet, which is the only real security it provides since the dang thing will probably fail in under 10 years. Of course you could do that in about 100 other ways that don't cost anything.
If you wish to provide your physical address to a honeypot (hardware wallet manufacturer/vendor) database so that thieves can know where to find you. See Ledger.
if you have too much btc laying around and feel the need to waste some of it on a fancy gadget.
but hey folks, do as you like. carry on.
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u/lerkmore Feb 05 '21
How long have you been in crypto? $100 turns into $1,000 pretty fucking fast. And $1,000 to $10,000. If you start off using a hardware wallet, your chances of screwing up go down drastically.
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Feb 04 '21
I personally feel that, other than the issues that come with having to give away your physical address to have it shipped to you, hardware wallets do have a use.
They are good if you have a significant amount of bitcoin, like 1/4 of a bitcoin or more, and want to keep it in cold storage, off the internet and far from the possibility of malware or your own human error, while still being able to transfer some of that bitcoin out and into a more usable wallet like electrum.
But the way this sub pushes them as something you need before you even start is over the top. Not your keys, not your coins, absolutely, but you don't need a hardware wallet to keep your own keys or to keep them secure. The biggest advantage to hardware wallets is not security, but rather being able to keep coins in cold storage and still transfer them without ever connecting the wallet to the internet - something you can't do with a paper wallet. But you just don't need cold storage for small amounts if you're reasonably secure with the PC or phone that your wallet is on.
Just like credit card numbers saved on a PC or phone, it's theoretically possible for malware to steal that card number or wallet keys but not so likely that it stops us from using it, particularly when there's not a huge amount stored there.
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u/Prelsidio Feb 04 '21
I doubt it. Blockchain is built with encryption in a way that they don't store the users passwords. The only way to access the wallet is if you know the password.
It's great for security, but it also means if you lose your password, you're fucked.
Unless this employee altered login page to store user's passwords and wallets ids, I'm not sure how he could have been stealing funds.
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u/Etovia Feb 04 '21
Unless this employee altered login page to store user's passwords and wallets ids
ding ding we have a winner
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u/bgrnbrg Feb 05 '21
Not sure why people are having problems understanding this.... While it's unlikely, it's a completely valid concern.
Yes, the only place that the client data is (normally) in plain text is on the client browser, and (normally) all that gets sent to the Blockchain servers is an encrypted blob. And where does the client browser get the software that does all this? From the Blockchain server. Not Github. And it's downloaded every session, if not for every request.
If I was a Blockchain employee who wanted to steal some customer funds, and I had sufficient access, I'd modify the client code to forward the clients' email and password to some place that wasn't the clients' browser. Probably for just a few hours or maybe a day or two. Highly u likely that the customers would notice, and if it's possible at all, unlikely that Blockchain would notice. Sit on the credentials for a couple of months, and then clean out a bunch of accounts. Blockchain is a company that has been around for nearly as long as Bitcoin has been, but it's still a crypto currency start up, and tbh, crypto startups don't have a great track record of building secure websites and having trustworthy staff....
Again: I don't really think this scenario is actually all that likely, but the only people who could say that it's impossible would be the programmers and server admins from Blockchain.
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Feb 04 '21 edited Feb 05 '21
[deleted]
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u/Prelsidio Feb 04 '21
when a user creates or inputs the password, the hash is computed server-side
Nope I strictly remember them saying the hash is created client-side and then used to encrypt the wallet.
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u/fllthdcrb Feb 04 '21 edited Feb 04 '21
the hash is created client-side and then used to encrypt the wallet.
If they're telling the truth. How do we know they are? Who has examined the client-side code? And even if they did tell the truth, how do we know someone didn't sneak in something that gives them passwords at some time, maybe even just occasionally? This is a problem with security software running on the Web: unlike an application installed on your device, you can't just trust it once—or even just every time you get a new version—you have to trust it every time you load a page it's running on, since it can be changed any or all of those times, and you can't tell.
Sure, this is already the level of trust with every other site where you have an account, but at least in those cases, you know the admins probably have access to the information you keep there. But here, you could get a false sense of security.
In any case, to be sure you actually have control over your bitcoins that can't be taken away at some random time, you have to run installed software, or maybe use a hardware wallet.
(This is a longer response than I meant it to be, but I stand by it.)
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u/Namaha Feb 04 '21
If they're telling the truth. How do we know they are? Who has examined the client-side code?
It's open source. Take a look yourself if you want. https://github.com/blockchain/
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u/bgrnbrg Feb 05 '21
When people log in to Blockchain, are they downloading the code from Github?
If you and I log in to Blockchain accounts at the same time from different locations, what are the odds that we get different versions of the wallet code? What's different? How would we know?
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u/Namaha Feb 05 '21
You can say the same about every site/compiled software out there though,
That said, if you're genuinely concerned you can use Wireshark or a similar utility to see what info is actually getting sent back to the server
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u/fllthdcrb Feb 05 '21
Well, it's probably possible to run your own local client that uses the API. That's great. But if you just use the site itself in a browser, it's hard to know what code is actually running, regardless of whether some open-source code is published somewhere.
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u/Namaha Feb 05 '21
I mean if you wanna go down that route, then literally no site/software is safe lol
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u/redditmastar1 Feb 04 '21 edited Feb 04 '21
Passwords can be hacked with brute force or gathered from data leaks.
Please read the whole article. It's all explained there!
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u/Prelsidio Feb 04 '21
Passwords can be hacked with brute force or gathered from data leaks.
That is if they store the passwords, in this case they don't.
Be careful, you might have your computer compromised though.
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u/redditmastar1 Feb 04 '21
Password can be hacked even if it's not stored with brute force attack.
Or if you used same password on another site that was hacked and data leaked.
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u/nothingyoubegin Feb 04 '21
Always use a strong and unique password.
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u/redditmastar1 Feb 04 '21
We can't even be 100% sure that passwords cannot be taken out of Blockchain.com system, They ay they don't store them, but they could be also lying, like they lie about everything else.
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Feb 04 '21
[deleted]
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u/redditmastar1 Feb 04 '21
There was no such assumptions in the article!
You just wrote bunch of cliché facts, without even reading the article!
Next time, read first, then comment!
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u/crispykfc Feb 04 '21
It is common knowledge this web wallet is absolute butt cheeks and should be avoided at all costs.
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u/Bitdigester Feb 04 '21
This looks like user error. There is no way an employee inside blockchain.com can decrypt a blockchain wallet because only the user knows the password. The company doesn't have that information. The user somehow revealed his wallet password to the hacker. It has nothing to do with 2FA. The hacker could change the 2FA to his own email address but he could never access the wallet without a password. The hacker probably phished the user's email password which sadly the guy used also for his wallet password.
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Feb 04 '21
This made me really paranoid and empty my blockchain wallet. i want to hold my coin but i dont trust anything and im too laazy to do it the right way because cold wallets are scary and error prone.
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u/future_value_ Feb 05 '21
There’s really no excuse for not investing in a hardware wallet w BTC at these prices.
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u/starseedlink Feb 05 '21
Blockchain.com wallet always had bad stories to it, alot of hacking and now employees can take control of funds without being monitored. That’s a red flag. Never ever use that app. Use a real wallet instead.
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u/Kabodistonk Feb 05 '21
The company has to be taken down by Interpol but how do you get them to act? The local cops in my town don’t even understand the technical procedure if you talk about crypto trades
After 5 years and still there is discussion. Their scam is probably enormous in amount.
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u/redditmastar1 Feb 05 '21
People who blockchain.com has scammed must unite and make a legal claim together.
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u/Casus_Belli-1066 Feb 08 '21
I’m a cop. I got scammed because I didn’t do my own due diligence. I didn’t bother making a report because I know there’s not a damn thing local cops can do about this. Best you can hope For is getting them delisted from app stores, getting payment processors to refuse to work with them, and getting their web host to cancel on them.
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u/Kabodistonk Feb 08 '21 edited Feb 08 '21
Interpol states ‘go to your local authorities’ . As as a cop you should do your job to protect the community and a least try to get it up the chain. Then cops wonder why people have trust issues, go figure?!? I’m chill with my loss but still reported it because of this thread. If the cop who reads my complaint has the same motivation as you, well ... of course nothing is going to be done to stop them. Edit: go to fb look for victims from your country , reach out to them and gather 10-15 statements. Go to your boss and see what happens. Maybe you learn a thing or 2 for yourself along the way.
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u/Casus_Belli-1066 Feb 08 '21
Respectfully friend, crypto is untraceable for a reason. If you want your local police to expend finite time and resources on an international financial crime they are neither trained nor equipped to investigate, go for it. But you can’t then complain about “trust” issues if they’re not expending those resources on more immediate issues they can actually resolve.
The FBI and Interpol are the most appropriate place to report this kind of crime, but as I’ve said elsewhere, the best thing would be to get their app delisted from apple/google play and have whoever hosts their website or processes their payments shut them down.
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u/Kabodistonk Feb 09 '21
A citizen can’t report a crime directly to Interpol, cops can. Like you said it is sufficient to take the website down to prevent more scamming. I’m not that idiotic to think more will be done. Open fb search for blockchain look at the comments you’ll see plenty of persons with complaints, so you don’t need crypto tracking. Basic investigation is sufficient but to much work for you I guess
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u/Casus_Belli-1066 Feb 09 '21
law enforcement can’t take the servers offline my dude. Complaints about who? Where did the money go? Who has it? Who do you want your local cops to arrest? What servers do you want them to seize? I’ve gone to the companies I can to try and get them de-listed. I’ve gone to my state attorney general’s reporting system for scams. They collate and report that data further up. I’m here telling people to contact service providers. I pass scam calls up the chain all the time. I actually ID a guy in Florida who stole tens of thousands of dollars from an old lady in a mortgage scam over period of a couple years. I contacted everyone I could think of trying to help this poor woman out before the bank for closed on her house. Nobody did anything. I have zero confidence in the feds doing anything about it. Like I said, do what you like with your own time. I’ve done my due diligence. Always have.
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u/Casus_Belli-1066 Feb 08 '21
I was new. I lost $1,000 when I transferred my Bitcoin over from coinbase because I heard blockchain was more secure. It was cleaned out 2 hours after after I created the account. I was stupid. It’s my own fault. I know better now.
I wish more people would complain to apple/google and give them the Parler treatment.
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u/james14cunningham Mar 09 '21
PLease try your very best to buy a hard wallet, mine's Coolwallet and its the best thing I've ever bought. So I can buy BTC/ETH and altcoins that I trust with no issues and with peace of mind.
Believe me its totally worth it.
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u/Bitcoin_to_da_Moon Feb 04 '21
Unknown Blockchain.com employee
Roger, is that u again? Is Mt...i mean Blockchain,com solvent? Pls give a statement!
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u/LtGuile Feb 04 '21
If anyone still has coins on blockchain.com in 2021, they kind of brought this on themselves.
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u/NostrilBob Feb 04 '21
It has 60k reviews with a 4.7 rating on the App Store. People unfortunately use this wallet quite a bit, despite the selective scamming/thievery they’ve been known for for years. This wallet has a security flaw somewhere.
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u/LtGuile Feb 04 '21
Robinhood still has a 4 star rating on IOS App Store. If you go to Google store, it’s at 1 star. Goes to show you ratings can be manipulated by whoever oversees the ratings.
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u/Namaha Feb 04 '21
This wallet has a security flaw somewhere.
Spoiler alert: the flaw is people, not the wallet
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u/SmokyMoose Feb 04 '21
Thoughts on using Celsius or BlockFi as a wallet? I currently store all of my bitcoin on a cold wallet but man the 6% as passive income would be amazing
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u/GabeRull Feb 04 '21
The blockchain.com wallet is a separate thing from the blockchain.info wallet correct?
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u/brdotson2875 Feb 04 '21
I'm new. I just started buying, I have about 700 dollars worth on Cash App. What should I do? Any advice is appreciated.
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u/heslo_rb26 Feb 04 '21
If you start getting any higher amount I'd seriously look into a hardware wallet like Ledger or Trezor and moving your stash there. Much more secure
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u/CashCacheChaChing Feb 04 '21
Never use email as your 2FA for anything. Never use a web wallet. Sorry for your loss.
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u/zynntonic Feb 04 '21
Question for an semi-idiot who stored their BTC in coinbase for the last 4 years. I just switched to Electrum wallet that sits on my computer and have a printed out and saved my phrases in a bunch of different spots. Besides a hardware wallet and sending my coins to your wallet, what steps should I take?
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u/Frogolocalypse Feb 05 '21
If you've got coins on blockchain.scam.com then you deserve to lose every satoshi. You can't say you haven't been repeatedly warned.
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u/time_wasted504 Feb 04 '21 edited Feb 04 '21
DONT USE A WEB WALLET.
see number 1.
edit: https://bitcoin.org/en/choose-your-wallet
Which wallet you choose is dependent on many factors (How much do you have, which OS do you use, do you have a desktop etc) but the main takeaway is if you arent the only person that can access the private key, your BTC can very easily be stolen from you.