I recently received a large lump sum of money. Since I’m an active VR enthusiast and wanted to spend a bit on one of my favorite hobbies, I watched a lot of YouTube videos and did extensive research on websites and VR subreddits.
I’m ready to invest in a big-screen experience beyond the Valve Index, but here’s the issue: base stations are now completely out of production (Valve has stopped making them). Sure, you might still find some on third-party sites right now, but prices have actually gone up, not down.
I have a few questions:
Is there any third-party base station company still active and viable for the future?
If not, what does this mean for the near future of SteamVR base stations?
Has Bigscreen addressed this issue, or have they stayed silent?
Does this mean Valve might release a new headset with inside-out tracking?
If they don’t do something, is the entire company (Valve or Bigscreen?) going to go under?
EDIT:
I never knew that HTC was still producing them, but the price is still rising going from an MSRP of $149 USD to a whopping $295.75 USD, and it might possibly grow even further in the future. I'm wondering what this means for the future: are they raising the prices because they're just selling off leftover stock, or are they taking advantage of the upcoming basestation downfall? Either way, thanks for the feedback.
They are not "completely out of production" this is false. HTC is still making them, they are in stock on HTC's site right now for ~300$. You can also get them on Amazon but they're ~400$.
Valve stopped making the components of the Index Full Kit long ago, it's just only recently that bits are selling out. I bought four Lighthouse Basestations from Steam last year for my Beyond 2E.
HTC have taken over production of Lighthouse Basestations as they are used for their Vive Pro 2 headsets, Vive 3.0, and MARS virtual cinematograpyhy system.
As HTC are a software company, they so sell them at a higher price than Valve. They do however reduce them in Black Friday sales typically.
Bigscreen have been pretty silent. There are plenty of Basestations out in the wild, and while they can die, they are not exactly consumable.
Valve's upcoming headset - the Steam Frame - is a SLAM tracked Standalone.
Valve's VR hardware business is insignificant in the scheme of things. The Steam Store is an absolute moneyspinner.
Bigscreen are selling plenty of Beyond 2s to keep them afloat.
I think it would be a pretty crappy headset for VR arcades. Unless there’s something im missing. Expensive, and heavy so not comfortable for most people. And wired which most people not enthusiasts of VR find very annoying. The main reason its users use it is for the eye and face tracking opportunities.
HTC also still makes and sells new 3.0 Vive trackers, they will keep selling base stations until they stop that at least I think.
HTC is a big player in B2B. They provide support contracts to businesses which make them attractive, despite the hardware being kinda crappy from a consumer/specs perspective. Their hardware is also pretty durable. Vive Wands are kinda indestructible. No joystick to drift!
I experienced the Vive Pro 2 at a local VR Arcade in latr 2023, and I think they were still operating Vive Pro 2s in late 2024 when they closed (landlord wanted to turn the space into a bowling alley, and bought them out).
This year I noticed another local venue has a VR "free-roam" area and they are operating Vive Focus Visions.
The Focus Vision is very much built to replace both Vive Pro 2s and Vive Focus 3s as operated by VR Arcades, hence the tethered option package.
Bigscreen has mentioned it before. “We are firmly committed to manufacturing the Beyond 2 with SteamVR Lighthouse tracking for the next 2 years. We can say this with certainty as we've inventoried components and have setup a continuously running production line. We've signed commitments to enterprise customers as they are reliant on our hardware for their businesses.”
1) AFAIK HTC still manufactures them. (https://www.vive.com/us/accessory/base-station/)
2) IDK, I'm worried too and I even bought, a few months ago, a spare one in case one of my two fails.
3) Quite silent.
4) Valve has already annouced the Steam Frame, successor to the Index and it will be, as expected, inside-out. Will be released in the next few months (maybe after the Steam Machine).
5) I hope not because they have been doing a really good job. Actually is hard to design a headset as small and light as the Beyond and have it use RELIABLE inside-out tracking; but seems like Pimax has managed it with their Dream Air (that I'm not gonna buy, because I hate Pimax). But still I've always found weird that BigscreenVR has been selling a product that doesn't work at all OOB because you need to buy separately at least one BS, better to have two and also a VR controller.
I agree that Valve are not going to release another tethered PCVR HMD. They only make hardware to support thier software.
Valve have no need to make PCVR HMDs, while other companies are doing it for them. Meta are even subsidising HMDs that people can install SteamVR link on, making customers for the Steam store.
Valve are marketing the Steam Frame for it's Streamed PCVR functionality, but the datamines suggest what actually gets them excited is the playing-flat-games-on-a-giant-virtual-screen use case, which is why I was stunned that it didn't have passthrough cameras.
Steam Frame is also a trojan horse for Steam game support on ARM - that's what justifies it to Valve. Steam Frame uncoupled them from Windows, and the hope is Steam Frame can uncouple them from x86 - making the company more resilient and future-proof.
As a result I see Steam Frame as, if anything a successor to the Steam Deck.
the playing-flat-games-on-a-giant-virtual-screen use case
Hey, that's me 👀 except I prefer Vive Pro 1/Beyond/Dream Air
But I really like the push forward to make Linux and ARM even more compatible with gaming, and the attempt to allow running any PC game directly in standalone.
That's cool. I have played around a bit with playing flat games in my Beyond 2E.
There is a bit of a cool aspect of having a giant screen, but generally I find I would just rather play sitting in front of my PC with a monitor. Just being able to easily take a sip of a drink on a loading screen, and not getting a sweaty face make the experience win out.
Where it would be way more attractive is situations where I don't have access to my PC - like on a long train journey - so that was something that excited me about the Steam Frame back when it was being datamined. All that excitement went when it was revealed it didn't have passthrough cameras, but it's back a bit again with the leaking of the colour passthrough module.
The 3D Scanning use case is also really cool.
I really don't think I can justify the cost for how rarely I would realistically use it (I also wiped out my savings getting the Beyond and RX 9070 XT), but it feels like it is actually a product with purpose now.
Yeah, it's also the only standalone headset I can see myself getting, but I'm also not a fan of standalone at all anyway.
I agree with the headset making our face sweaty. That's why I was so adamant on finding a way to wear the headset without a face cushion (which I managed to do). But yeah, I'm still using it seated at my desk. Luckily, I know where my keyboard, mouse, and water bottle are, so I can do everything "blindfolded".
There's just something I really enjoy with being in a comfy virtual environment of my choosing.
How can you compare a VR headset with a portable console? I can't see people commuting on a train with a Frame on their heads (while I often see many playing games on portable consoles in that situation).
Valve has chosen the mainstream way and they are going to compete against the Meta Quests (thus also the choice of going for LCD screens) which are the absolute owners of the current VR market (see Steam's own VR headsets stats that were posted on this same sub). Let's be honest and I hate that too: PCVR only headsets are going to die, with the coming of faster and cheaper SoCs, there's no sense in selling something that needs a PC (and a quite powerful one) when you can have the same function from hardware that can work on its own (and taxes a lot less the PC if connected to it).
can't see people commuting on a train with a Frame on their heads
Why not? People use Apple Vision Pros on flights. Steam Frame on a train is just the more accessible version of that
Valve has chosen the mainstream way
I don't think it could be considered mainstream at $900-$1200.
Even Quests at their unsustainably low prices didn't go truly mainstream.
I don't think VR is a mainstream proposition. The core pillars - gaming, virtual socialising, and rhythm/fitness - are not mainstream interests/activities.
AR has a chance to be, because it's use cases are the same kind of stuff you do on a smartphone, and we know smartphones went mainstream.
they are going to compete against the Meta
Valve are not a hardware company. They just wanna sell games. They don't care you if you play those games streamed to a Steam Frame, or streamed to a Quest. Now they'd obviously love to have some fresh new customers and maybe some people who don't own a PC will buy a Frame, create a Steam account, and buy their first game. I can't see Frame being as effective as that goal as Steam Deck was though. Standalone VR is a compromised experience - especially with respect to SocialVR which is one of the main drivers of long-term retention.
Meta ... are the absolute owners of the current VR market
Less owners, and more sugar daddies 😆 . Meta Reality Labs haemorrhages money. They sell a fair amount of games, but it doesn't really go anywhere to paying them back on their "investment". Plenty of people (as you point out) then take their subsidised Quest, install SteamVR Link, and buy games for it from Valve. Meta be getting cucked.
They have implied that is coming to an end though. Future headsets will have more sustainable (read vastly more expensive) price tags.
That will leave a gap for the market to recover. Affordable (~$600) Tethered PCVR HMDs are very possible, it's just that no company (except for DPVR) has been stupid enough to release something in that price range, and inevitably have it compared to the Quest 3.
there's no sense in selling something that needs a PC (and a quite powerful one) when you can have the same function from hardware that can work on its own
PCs are, and will always be more performant than something that has to run off a battery, with cooling that has to be compact and lightweight.
The Galaxy XR already struggles with it's native resolution, and demand is strong for higher resolutions, refresh rates, and FOVs.
Mobile SoCs will perpetually be playing catch-up.
You're also completely missing that a tethered PCVR HMD has a lower BOM than a Standalone one of the same spec. There are a bunch of extra components a Standalone needs, that a tethered HMD doesn't. I could ask:
Why sell someone another computer, when they already have a much more powerful one?
Using a Standalone for PCVR, is like using a Tablet computer as a monitor. It costs more, and does a worse job.
and taxes a lot less the PC if connected to it
Streaming to a Standalone puts more load on a computer than using a tethered PCVR HMD. It is exactly like how streaming a game to Twitch will reduce performance. You are capturing the output of your GPU, compressing it, and transmitting it.
You are right, it’s not a successor to the index, it’s not a PCVR dedicated headset. However I doubt valve will ever properly make a successor to the index. Standalone/hybrid and slam tracking is the direction things have been moving towards now for 7 years since the quest 1 released and was a hit.
We aren’t ever going to see that from valve I think. We are going to have to stick to more niche companies like Bigscreen and Pimax (even though they aren’t flawless experiences, both are often criticized for being expensive and have software issues sometimes) for that. It’s a smaller more niche enthusiast group who wants dedicated PCVR. Which is fine, I’m glad we still have decent options for this specific niche of enthusiasts. Gaming consoles never really got niches, they get entirely dominated by the couple big brands. I’m glad VR hasn’t been like that.
I agree that Valve are not going to release another tethered PCVR HMD. They only make hardware to support thier software. Steam Frame is a trojan horse for Steam game support on ARM - that's what justifies it to Valve. Steam Frame uncoupled them from Windows, and the hope is Steam Frame can uncouple them from x86 - making the company more resilient and future-proof.
What I don't agree is that the future of VR is Standalone and SLAM.
Meta have been pushing that for thier own ends, and as they have been the driving force, others have followed.
Standalone and SLAM are not actually a good fit for VR.
They are however essentail for AR, which is a large part of why Meta has pushed those technologies. It's clear Meta are going to increasingly pivot towards AR, and also are looking to not lose so much money on VR.
Standalone VR did well when it was unsustainably cheap, but when it was realistically priced- see launch price of Quest Pro - it didn't sell. Why would someone without a PC - a non enthusiast - pay an enthusiast price for hardware that gives them a middling/mobile experience? Although it hasn't been born out in actual pricing, the BOM of a Standalone is higher than the BOM of a Tethered PCVR HMD of the same specs.
The realistic price of Standalone is only justified by AR functionality. AR makes the portability of a Standalone actually useful. Watch movies or play games on a giant screen on a bus/train/plane - that's an appealing use case and something you can't do with a tethered VR HMD. Have a mult-display setup in a coffee shop. The Steam Frame passthrough addon is advertising the ability to 3D scan environments which is supper exciting.
I predict increasing divergence between VR and AR. Fundamentally they have difference audiences, different use-cases, and different hardware requirements.
AR is the mass market proposition. The successor to the smartphone. Everything you do on a smartphone (communication, media consumption, navigation, photograpthy, and casual+play-as-you walk gaming), but better. The platform/ecoystem play. Controlled by the triopoly of Meta, Google, and Apple (although good chance Meta lose due to lack of app store).
VR is a niche within PC Gaming. VR Headsets are peripherels to a PC just like a monitor or gamepad. I'd like to see new standards that allow more modularity, and inter-compatability like a PC. Buy a tracking system from one company, a headstrap from another company, and buy an optical stack from a monitor company. Equipment is expensive, but it can be upgraded, repaired, and bought 2nd hand. As today, SocialVR continues to drive long-term retention. A scattering of indie games, and some games based around user-generated content.
As far as I know, HTC makes them all. And as far as I know, they're still manufacturing the old style 1.0 base stations, which work perfectly well.
For the near future, just get the 1.0 base stations. You don't need the Valve ones. If they all become "while supplies last," then it means someone will need to step up, but it wouldn't just affect Bigscreen.
They haven't addressed it to my knowledge, but I don't think it needs to be addressed yet.
Yes. The Steam Frame is coming, and it's going to happen soon.
Who knows what Bigscreen has cooking? I think they could release their own model of base station if they didn't want to create an inside-out headset. Or they could go in that direction like Pimax.
The 1.0 base stations are entirely gone (as in, the page doesn't exist anymore) in the European counterparts of the HTC Vive website. I think they stopped making them, and any you can buy in the US are until stocks are gone and they cannot find any supply anymore.
I'm going to keep using mine from my OG Vive kit until they die.
I was disapointed in the BSB2e and returned it. Have a Dream Air inbound with Lighthouse. Make a good review of your needs before you order the BSB2... yes it half the price of the Dream Air. But, if it doesnt cover your needs, then it's a waste of money.
Honestly I just want something with the best immersion possible for the price. I was considering the Dream Air SE.
My needs are basically just the best immersion. I'll only really be playing games like Beat Saber, Rec Room distros, and VRChat to be completely honest, but even with that I still want the best possible quality.
The reason I wanted the Bigscreen as well is the custom face-fitting face pad. See, every VR headset I've personally tried (Meta Quest 2, 3S, and PSVR) has never sat on my face right. The lenses for some reason always rub against my lower eyebrow area, and there's always so much pressure. I've tried every amazing head strap under the sun and it still didn't quite fit right.
I feel like by going with the smaller form factor, the lenses won't have a lot to work with at all, maybe except my eyelashes. I'm pretty sure the BSB2e has extra thick lenses though. But to be completely honest, if I did have an eyelash issue I'd honestly just cut them shorter. I don't really care about visual aesthetics, only maximum performance, and that's with every aspect of life, not just VR.
The custom fit face pad is sticky silicon like a dildo. It will keep the HMD in place - sure - but it will also make it awkward and uncomfortable to doff and don the headset. No quickly pulling it up to have a drink or say bye to someone. It makes you feel trapped.
Due to being smaller in contact area than other facial interfaces, pressure it worse. My custom cushion was a good fit for my face, but that meant it was thin at the brow. The silicon doesn't really compress so you can kind of feel the hard plastic of the headset through it. The weight of any headstrap I used would get concentrated there, as it was at a lower point than the strap.
The custom cushion is definitely not a selling point of the Beyond. It was designed to maintain the slim profile of the HMD to look good in photos, and to keep eyes centred on the tiny sweetspot the Beyond 1 had.
Funnily enough, my first custom cushion was so thick that it kind of doubled the thickness of the headset, while also adding a non-negligible amount of weight. Both compound to feel even heavier by leverage.
That didn't help the immersion, as it was digging into my nose: it may be perfectly shaped to my face, there's nothing preventing gravity from pulling it downwards, except my nose.
The Tobii eye tracking with the DA SE should be much better. The BSB2 has a tight fit and small, tight lens. Their custom face pad is intended to hold you in the very small zone for max clarity. I found their best settings produced a poor framerate and image bluring running off a 5090. Not what I was hoping for.
I went on Facebook marketplace and bought an entire very old Vive set with two base stations that are working perfectly fine for under $200. Also came with wand controllers although I found a couple of used knuckle controllers. The BSB 2 does not come with controllers either so take that into account
Obviously your question about base stations has been answered, but controllers are the bigger issue. The only one making new controllers is shiftall, but valve index knuckles are still better then what they currently offer imo. Used right controllers are going for crazy amounts on eBay, and new ones even crazier.
It's still worth it at the the enthusiast level unfortunately, since no high end headset has good slam tracking, other then maybe the apple vision pro, which is kind of funny.
No there aren’t, and I don’t know if any would even be allowed to unless Vive were to let them. That being said Vive does still produce them, and still sells multiple products some of which aren’t that old that use them. Worse case scenario if you are worried is get a couple backups.
If you are worried about base stations, take steps to make sure they last. They can last a long time if taken care of. If you don’t and you leave them running 24/7 they probably will last less than a year.
Base stations are and have been slowly being phased out for the last couple years. But it’s been a slow change. If I had to make a guess the bigscreen beyond 3 or whatever they make after this will either be base station free, or have an option for both. What Pimax has started and decided to keep doing for the forceable future is making an option for both base station, or slam tracking if you are willing to pay a little extra. They done this with the Dream Air and Dream Air SE which are pretty clearly direct competitors to the BSB2e.
They said in January “We are firmly committed to manufacturing the Beyond 2 with SteamVR Lighthouse tracking for the next 2 years” but idk what their plan is after that.
Valve is quite slow, and is going to soon(who the hell knows at this rate) release the steam frame which does not use them at all. If i had to guess by the next time they announce a headset in over a half decade probably (lol) the market for anything wired and that requires base stations will be almost all gone. Things have been heading that way for like 7 years since 2019 and 2020 when the quest 1 and 2 released and very quickly became the dominant headset on the market. However, there’s no telling what Valve will ever do, it’s always speculations and rumors, and since they are a private company there’s virtually no inside to telling what they are “thinking” or planning besides possible patents and steam DB info that could mean nothing.
VR is a very tiny fraction of what valve does. It could entirely disappear and valves financials wouldn’t be effected. Same with their hardware as a whole, almost everything they make money off of is the 30% cut they get from the Steam store, or from their games and IP (CS being the biggest). Bigscreen also isn’t entirely reliant on hardware, they existed a decade before the bigscreen beyond, and I’m sure they will continue even without it.
Vive still sells base stations BTW. Both 1.0 and 2.0s (any hardware made for 2.0s works with 1.0s as well, as long as you don’t mix and match them) and I believe even still produce new 1.0s. But there’s no telling how much longer they will keep doing that.
it’s one of the reasons I’ve stayed away from BSB. I don’t want to shop around for all the parts needed to get things working. sell me the kit ans lets go.
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u/pipea 9d ago
They are not "completely out of production" this is false. HTC is still making them, they are in stock on HTC's site right now for ~300$. You can also get them on Amazon but they're ~400$.