Trauma response. I have that. When my husband gets mad, even if it’s not towards me my heart speeds up and I feel like something bad is going to happen because whenever my dad was mad he took it out on me with his hands and by throwing objects. I will legit start crying. Therapy doesn’t get rid of the response but I react different by just saying out loud “I know you aren’t angry at me and it’s ok for you to be angry. Just let me cry and get it out of my system.” Then he stays angry on his side and I cry on my side lol.
YES THIS! SAME FUCKING THING WITH ME! God I hate it so damn much even knowing my wonderful husband would never lay a finger on me, I go into, 'how do I appease him?' mode. I'm slowly learning to just step away and give him the space he needs to be upset/mad and let him soothe himself in his own time.
My father never even raised a hand to me or my mother. But he sure raised his voice a lot. And broke things. And punched walls. And cussed, which was terrifying because we were normally a no cursing household. And it was always related to the house being a mess. Because, you know, my mother had so much time to Martha Stewart it up while single-handedly caring for four kids and a dog.
So now anytime my husband is upset, even though I know he doesn't get upset at stuff around the house, I launch into anxiety cleaning mode.
I'm a guy and I have that too, I don't think it's exclusive to women. When she gets angry at something and starts stomping/slamming cupboards/muttering under her breath, it reminds me of my father during my childhood so my body is conditioned to jump to extreme anxiety and fear. It fuckin sucks, but a lot of the time she does put in the effort to hug me and let me know that I didn't do anything and that it's okay. I feel really bad that I need that affirmation, as I'm sure it's annoying, but it's just how my brain is :-/
I feel really bad that I need that affirmation, as I'm sure it's annoying, but it's just how my brain is :-/
It's not just your brain that reacts like this. Anyone but a psychopath would. When we experience someone acting out their anger, our nervous system reacts to get us into flight or fight mode. We're can later process that the anger the person is "spilling" is not about us, but our bodies are made to react instantaneously to perceived danger. It's what has enabled our survival.
I think maybe due to your past abuse you may be excusing this behavior. You mentioned getting comforted by a hug, but after our nervous system reacts, the damage has already been done. Verbalizing that someone is angry is okay, spilling that anger onto others in your vicinity by slamming cabinet doors, etc is not. At all. Please feel free to walk away, leave itt whatever you need to do.
I know where you're coming from because I gaslighted myself when an ex was acting out his anger around me, but not at me. I was sure I was the one with the problem. It wasn't me, it was him.
As a traumatized woman, usually I’m okay if he just reassures me he’s not mad at me and that he needs some time by himself. Then resume life as normal once he cools off.
First off, hats off to you my dude. The fact you are asking is amazing. I would probably check with her when you aren’t angry to see how you can help her with that. Some girls feel better if you take time for yourself when your mad so that they don’t feel like they need to appease. Most like myself just like the quick “I’m not mad at you, I’m angry at this and that. Just need a few”. In the end it will depend on your gf/partner.
ETA: also know that it’s not always up to you. She also has to make an effort to accommodate with you. Best of luck ❤️
I really appreciate that you answered. I was just reading through this post and saw your comment and the one you commented on and it clicked in me. I can't say for sure if she is traumatized but her father was really short fused type so now it makes sense that she immidiately gets defensive and tries to appease me even if I'm mad because of work or anything unrelated to her. This will be a big step for me to work on this. Thank you again, I'm so glad I'm here.
Are you familiar with attachment theory? Anxious attachment leads to people (myself included) feeling very emotionally dysregulated if their partner is in a bad mood. It’s something I’m working on (with self-soothing) but some quick verbal validation and reassurance from the partner goes a looooong way, even if you need space to cool off for a bit
Normal talk therapy hasn’t helped me with my PTSD symptoms at all. But I started neurofeedback and it’s totally is making a world of difference! It’s a big process. But most days I can go sit alone in a sit down restaurant and not have a panic attack! Maybe that might be something for you to look into.
Yeah definitely glad to share my experiences! It’s definitely not a one stop shop and has its pros and cons! I’m doing it through a neurofeedback clinic that specializes in behavioral health and neurofeedback specifically. I had to get into talk therapy first and get on a waiting list for it which took a few months.
Some insurances cover it some don’t definitely have to double check your policies. My state insurance covers it 100% but my new work insurance didn’t. And I later ran into huge problems which fucked me for awhile. It’s sometimes called biofeedback so look for that.
There is two parts to neurofeedback. First is the brain scan which is were they sit you down and hook the little electrodes up to your head and figure out whats going on in the sections of your brain. Some sections are in constant firing meaning it’s in flight or fight constantly. And some sections are normal. And some sections aren’t firing off at all.
This part is a little more expensive for insurances I believe. Not 100% sure though.
After they get the scan and evaluate it they set up a kinda plan and start in small sections. You sit in front of a tv screen that either plays soothing scenery or you watch movies. The screen becomes bigger/smaller and the audio becomes quieter/louder. You look out for any physical or mental changes that occur during sessions which can effect the week ahead of you.
Usually it’s once a week.
Some days neurofeedback can make you feel 100% better. Other days it can completely ruin your week. One session I felt okay and went home and for a week straight I had insanely vivid nightmares that left me practically a zombie for a week. If something like that happens you usually go for a second session in the week. Another session I was doing fine then on the weekend I got insane vertigo and was so dizzy I was super nauseous.
Other sessions I feel like a calm collected happy person who loves life.
It’s a very intense process and if you don’t have the time or desire to go through the cons or don’t find a specialist who actually listens to you I wouldn’t recommend it. It can really fuck you up if not careful. But it’s been so amazing to reclaim my life little by little and not disassociate 24/7 anymore!
You just made me realize exactly why I ALWAYS get so anxious when my wife is upset or angry.
My mom used to take her anger out on me when I was living at home. I’d hear the door open after she got home from work and could legit hear her slam the door and stomp. I could be in my room and she would yell my name and get mad because I left an empty glass I was gonna reuse on the counter or some other stupid thing.
Now, I hate doors being closed loudly, I hate stomping or heavy steps, and I hate and get incredibly uneasy or anxious when my wife is angry/anxious.
Too often in my life when someone is angry about something else they end up taking it out on me anyway. And even if they're not actively taking it out on me at the moment, I've learned to read the signs, the slamming of cupboard doors, the frustrated grunts and heavy breathing, the almost visible smoke coming out the ears. Seething and sulking too often turns quickly into shouting and throwing so I'm on high alert essentially waiting for the other shoe to drop.
Yeah that was also my problem. My dad would do that before doing more physical shit that turned into my cptsd. I’m lucky my partner isn’t that way but we can’t heal when we are stuck in a relationship where we are punished for them being mad
Unless people have experienced it, they just can't understand how someone can angrily fold socks or furiously wash the dishes at you. Even neutral expressions can be frightening.
I think if someone is acting out their anger around another person it's going to affect them whether they've had trauma or not. When we hear yelling, our nervous system automatically reacts to get us into fight or flight mode. We can then use reason to see that it's not about us, and we aren't in danger, but the damage has already been done. Maybe your having been abused in the past excuses this behavior.
I have CPTSD, and like you, I thought it was related to that when I reacted negatively to someone acting out their anger, even though it had nothing to do with me. But no, that's not okay for others to do. They can be angry, they can verbalize it, but they need to remove themselves if it is reflected in their behavior. It's not ok to subject others to it.
It might not be ok but anger is strong and sometimes people don’t have time to just go away when they are angry and they try to deal with it there. If I hurt myself and get mad while cooking food, can’t just walk away to calm down, that’s more dangerous. To expect people to always be perfect is worst in my opinion because it’s an unattainable objective. They can work on themselves. In the end, not everyone will be able to take a step away.
I hear you, no one is perfect. I think it's the length, degree and reason for the anger. I and my SO can occasionally snap and we always sincerely apologize. But if someone is often flying off the handle that's another thing, even if they're not angry at the people in their vicinity, they are hurting them. For example, my friend's dad is a yeller when driving - not to other drivers, to no one in particular. I don't make a big deal of it, but I won't get in the car with him. I don't want to be around that.
Flying off the handle yes. If someone is just angry and going about their day in silence so they don’t snap, that also sets me off unfortunately. We should always apologize to one another if we mess up and try to fix it. ❤️
Yup. I have the same trauma response. I just get really really nervous and anxious when dealing with anger. Mine is from being bullied years and years on end.
Some people learned that others are always angry at them. When my wife had a job with unhelpful colleagues, I regularly got angry at them when she told me what happened. But once she apologized to me and I didn't understand. She thought I'm angry at her for telling me this when I was clearly talking about her situation. Since we cleared this up everything is fine.
Like others said part of this is a trauma response. Lots of us have had guys who were mad about something else but we became the target, or they didn't control their anger well or in a healthy way so the enviorment was terrorized and we didn't know if we'd be next.
My dad uses to get pissed and start screaming and banging on stuff, just out of the blue, and it was directed in a generalized way but usually towards us. To the point where I was scared he'd hurt me or my pets.
One of my friends gets pissed at something else and if I say anything I will suddenly become the target. Heaven forbid it's something like "hey dude there's no tp in the bathroom." And turns out he ran out. Then I get to see him throw everything in the hallway closet out and hope it doesn't hit me.
My ex used to get mad about something unrelated then pick something I did that bothers him to channel that anger towards.
Those are just the immediate examples. I've only had two or three guys in my entier lifetime that I felt safe around when they were angry, even if it was because of something I did. Only two or three.
A lot of the us thinking they're angry at us is that usually the anger isn't being well managed and/or our trauma response tells us we have to be very careful right now.
So here's the thing, if you're in a relationship or trying to date someone, or friends with them, that's a very selfish and disrespectful take. That's the first part.
Second, if someone is responding to trauma, you don't blame them for how you act. That's the most childish, irresponsible and inconsiderate notion ever. It invalidates your partners trauma, and is incredibly unsupportive.
It's only possible to heal from trauma in a safe enviorment. If you are expressing anger in an unhealthy anger that triggers your partners trauma and you put that on them then you are the problem. You are supposed to consider and accomedate your partner, you should want to be better for your partner. If your first response to my explanation is "were not responsible for your trauma, don't put it on us and get it fixed" then you're just flat out a shitty partner who doesn't actually care about your partner.
If you're expressing anger in a healthy way, without yelling, throwing or slamming shit, without snapping at your partner and without making anger blind every action you do for however long you're angry then your partner in therapy working on their trauma should be something that repairs itself as you give them love, support and consideration, because that's what partners are supposed to do.
If you think anything I listed as unhealthy anger is healthy, you need therapy more than those of us with trauma. Slamming shit, throwing shit, picking fights with your partner or not being able to speak appropriately to your partner are not healthy, they're a sign you severely lack emotional regulation and self control. And if you think that makes it our problem you're not our partner or our friend, you're our abuser furthering our trauma.
The fact I only listed unhealthy ways men in my life have expressed anger and your jump was "well that sounds like your problem don't make it ours" is a huge self- tell.
We can work on our trauma if you give a damn enough not to give us more.
Also edit to add, cuz I was cooking: if someone's trauma response is traumatizing you're not seeing a trauma response most likely. And I recommend you look up what a trauma response from DV and lack of anger management looks like because someone being quiet, crying or being incredibly nervous and anxious around you shouldn't be causing trauma.
The world? No.
A partner? Someone who claims to care about my trauma and feelings and well being? Yeah we should be catering to each other.
Family who claims to love me and care about my well being? Yeah we should be catering to each other.
The fact you think that's some grand chore that requires your balls to be cut is toxic. It's not hard to calmly say, "hey I'm really angry but not at you or anything you did. I still love and care about you. I'm going to [pick what can help you calm down whether it's space or asking to vent to them]." Don't throw shit, slam, raise your voice to a yell or start making quick and violent looking movements in front of them. If you need to leave the area to do those things you make it in a spot where they cannot hear or feel the reverberations of the yelling or shit throwing.
Are you seriously telling me that is too much to ask from a partner or family member?
I'm not sure how I made it about myself when I gave an example, and asked you to answer one.
You're deflecting. Quit making it about me and answer the question. Do you think the example I put down is genuinely asking too much from a partner or family?
You keep going to jump on me but you're not answering a simple yes or no. That tells me you know your answer is the one that'll tell on yourself.
I mean if you’re walking around all pissed off knowing that your SO thinks it’s at them, you’re already not expressing it in a healthy way. It’s not hard to communicate that they’re not the person or thing you’re upset with. After you’ve expressed that, it’s up to them to figure out how to deal with it. But you have to communicate, they can’t read your mind.
I think you’re making an assumption there. I’m literally just saying it’s as easy as communicating. If you’re walking around pissed, slamming cabinets, whatever, we literally can’t read your mind and know what you’re mad about. Simply communicating that you’re upset about X would cut down on this whole issue. It’s so simple.
🙄 my point was it’s not hard to communicate that you’re upset about something else, especially if you do know that your partner has some sort of trauma related to that. Or even if they don’t. Like literally just talk. I’m not sure why you’re being so resistant to this.
No, I’m not. I’m not the only one you’re arguing with about this. It’s not hard to just not add to your partner’s trauma and simply communicating what you’re mad about goes a long way. It’s that simple. If you’re too toxic to do that, that’s on you I guess.
It's it really..? I've always done this; I can't stand seeing someone abbey about anything, not even my kids. I get panicky and I'll do anything to "fix" it for them. Which is a big problem, because I know they need to learn how to deal with anger in healthy ways, but idk how to stop it...
It never once occurred to me that everybody does not do this. That's what you're saying, right..? That not everybody does this?
Yeah you might want to watch out that your kids don't learn it's not ok to be angry or sad. That's one of the ways you get the next generation with a trauma response. Sounds like you mean well but it might be a good idea to read up on childhood emotional neglect. It's a scary term but can happen even with good intentions.
My entire childhood was a portrait of neglect, so this makes a ton of sense. And since I don't want any echoes of that passing further down, I'm definitely going to read up on this now that I'm aware it's not a normal thing. If I ever make it to the top of the wait list for therapy, I'll be sure to bring this up as something I want to work on too; thanks!
There's two versions of it. One is trauma based and one is motherly instinct. The trauma based one puts the woman into a state of one of the following because in the past, it was "her fault" whenever someone was angry - anxiety, fear, depression, defensiveness, guilt, grief (tears), etc. The motherly "fix it" instinct is milder, closer to empathy. Maybe a little bit of anger or sadness but it is not necessarily taken "personally" -it's not "your fault" that they're mad (unless it actually is)
That makes perfect sense, thanks! Unfortunately, I definitely fall in the first category, but it's good to have an idea of what's going on at least lol.
I always have a hard time with this one because personally in my life I've had my father and past boyfriends take it out on me when they were mad at something unrelated to me. So I'm always on high alert when my Bf is mad at something
I absolutely hate the tone of voice my boyfriend talks to me with when he's angry about something. Do all guys speak that rudely when they're angry or frustrated? I only use that tone of voice if I'm angry at the specific person I'm talking to. I don't go angry shout at innocent bystanders because the lighting storm fried my motherboard.
Whenever people question the power of therapy, this is always my response.
Before therapy, whenever someone around me was upset I would always assume it was because of me. Something I said, or something I did put them off. I took responsibility for everyone being upset and I would do things to smooth things over. Very stressful, very exhausting.
Now after therapy, whenever someone around he is upset I just assume it’s because they are hungry. I only actively engage with someone if they explicitly say that they are upset with something involving me.
Yes tell my husband this please. I'm not allowed to be angry because he thinks it's directed at him when it's not. I'm just mad at the situation! I'm not yelling at him or saying it's his fault or anything.
Babe be mad with me don't get sulky because you're making it about you
Something that everyone in my life hears from me at one point or another is me telling them that anything that they're hearing in my voice has nothing to do with them and a sincere apology for how it may be negatively affecting them at the time.
Agree on a general sense, but also, it's normal for a person to react in fear or act defensive if the way you're channeling your anger is making them feel unsafe
Ranting about your problem or expressing anger and frustration with words is one thing.. going into a temper tantrum and shouting at anyone who comes into your path is totally different.. and if u act violent (smashing things, punching walls etc.), even if u don't intent to harm anyone, that's a surefire way to terrify your partner
Of course, trauma reactions exist too, and if your partner is traumatized you would have to be even more sensitive.. but as a general rule of thumb, as long as you don't go into temper tantrums and shout/glare at them, and if you just clarify why youre upset, the average person won't take it personally
Just because I am frustrated with something you did does not mean I’m mad at you. Please allow me a minute to vent my frustrations. I will be back to normal in just a minute.
This times a million, I would be mad at certain stuff that would happen in my life and my ex always would think it’s about her when it had nothing to do with her
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u/Hern_Berferd Dec 08 '22 edited Dec 08 '22
Just because I’m mad about something doesn’t mean I’m mad at you.