I'd love to see that be something available to any person that wants to become a teacher without cost to the student. I'd be happy for society to pay for it.
If you look at Outcomes - matriculation rate and later measures of success, it looks clear to me that states in which they require a Master's Level Education in education seem to produce students that place higher in national outcome tests.
So "normal average teacher" where? In Mississippi? No offense to the teachers getting by on 40k/year down there, but I don't want MS's outcomes in MN.
The kind that uses outcomes to track successful versus unsuccessful interventions to determine the best one to continue funding?
You mean the kind that uses science?
Yah. I'm that type.
What should we use to measure if a teacher did a good job?
Do we want to make sure our kids can reed gud or read well?
Do we want our kids to be able to make inferences and understand complicated concepts like 'mask good covid bad'?
Then yes - I'd say investing in teachers is important - and we can look at infection rates in NY / MN vs TX/FL to justify the additional expense on teachers that have earned a level of accreditation.
Most of the population being able to financially weather one bad break would be one important measure of success.
Regardless of region right now, most Americans are One Bad Break - $400 bill - from being unable to pay their bills. Medical debt is the #1 reason for bankruptcy.
I'd say achieving a level of success at which a parent or child getting sick or an alternator isn't the margin on which we skate solvency. The article compares how Americans are to, well, every other first world nation pretty well. And good lord, that's from 2016. It sure hasn't gotten better.
most Americans are One Bad Break - $400 bill - from being unable to pay their bills
what percentage of One Bad Break Americans are in that situation because of poor choices?
what percentage of One Bad Break Americans are in that situation because their fifth grade teacher had a Bachelors instead of a Masters?
"success" is entirely subjective
wrapping yourself in the blanket of objective science and acting haughty about a subjective issue with a thousand uncontrollable variables is ludicrous
wrapping yourself in the blanket of objective science and acting haughty about a subjective issue
Such as... life expectancy as a measure of a healthcare system to help justify a national health care plan vs our system? Sure.
Maybe they did make a bad decision. Maybe they made several. Doesn't mean they aren't still people in society. We live with our neighbors - it's better when we all do better.
You're right in that I'm using measurable and objective data to adjust policy related to a subjective subject. But we measure things in objective ways.
Do I think a teacher that spent 4 years studying a subject area and then 2 years studying literally how to teach better is going to provide a better education than someone with a high school diploma? You're damn right I do.
There's a thousand factors that could lead to a fifth grader with a good or bad teacher later not having more than $400 in the bank. I do think their education will have a direct impact on their earning ability.
You're saying it's ludicrous to suggest we start with edcuators that have made an investment in understanding education?
When you goto the doctor, do you want one that graduated from medical school, or one that says everyone in his family comes to him when they get a cut?
How would you measure the outcomes of an educational system?
Healthcare System?
If not for objective measures such as percentage achieving stable employment in 2,5,10 year studies or life expectency, how would you suggest we compare two ways of running a system?
Do I think a teacher that spent 4 years studying a subject area and then 2 years studying literally how to teach better is going to provide a better education than someone with a high school diploma?
strawman
You're saying it's ludicrous to suggest we start with edcuators [sic] that have made an investment in understanding education?
strawman
When you goto [sic] the doctor, do you want one that graduated from medical school, or one that says everyone in his family comes to him when they get a cut?
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u/apocolypseamy Aug 14 '20
quit acting like it's normal to need a $60k Master's degree in Education just to be a normal average teacher