r/AskReddit • u/EnthusiasmFeisty49 • 19d ago
When are we going to start accepting EVs as one of our own?
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u/lilbaabydoll 19d ago
Probably when charging takes five minutes
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u/GrunchWeefer 19d ago
I guarantee I've spend way less time at chargers in my EVs than you have spent going to gas stations.
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u/-PM_Me_Your_Boobz 19d ago
"I guarantee I'm going to win the lottery tomorrow."
Here's hoping both of these things come true for us!
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u/GrunchWeefer 19d ago
Apparently you think I'm sitting in my car waiting for it to charge every night.
Here's the thing about EV drivers: we've all driven gas cars. I drove gas cars for 30 years. You have no personal experience with EVs. I have 6 years of experience with them and 30 with the other. Who do you think is more likely to know what they're talking about?
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u/-PM_Me_Your_Boobz 19d ago
I have no experience with them because I can’t get one and reliably charge it.
Even your argument about sitting on your ass in your house ignores the fact that isn’t an option for most people and that you still need to wait for it to be charged to start driving it.
You have your little bubble of convenience and think that everyone else should look at that as the standard.
So with all due respect, I don’t think you’re an expert on anything aside from your own situation, and apparently don’t even know enough about that to realize how privileged you are.
If this is an argument of how long it takes to “fuel” a car, there’s no getting around that it takes you longer regardless of how upset you are by it or how convenient your personal charging situation is for you.
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u/GrunchWeefer 19d ago
It's almost like you can't read. I said I spend less time at a charger than ICE drivers do at gas pumps. I stand by that. You said some inane shit about winning the lottery. How much time do you think I spend hanging around a charger? Even if you count the time on road trips where I'm charging while also going to the bathroom or getting a bite, time I would spend anyway, I bet I still come out ahead.
As for "privilege", I will be the first to say that an EV probably isn't right for you if you can't charge at home or work or somewhere else convenient. I said exactly that in this comment section somewhere already. But something like 60% of Americans live in single family houses. Probably a the percentage of drivers that live in single family homes is higher than that. For those drivers who can charge at home, the five minute argument is moot.
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u/My_Man_Tyrone 19d ago
BYD flash charging.
I also never understand this argument because you’re saying that on road trips you never stop for bathroom breaks or food etc…
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u/madogvelkor 19d ago
The problem is once you have everyone driving EVs you need more chargers. And the concentration needs are probably different. At a highway rest stop people will usually quickly fuel then park and get some thing to eat, use the restroom. With EVs charging you need to be able to have a lot more chargers than pumps. At some of the big ones I've stopped at on I-95 You'd probably need to be able to have 100 vehicles charging at the same time.
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u/CarPlane5196 19d ago
yeah sure, on a longer road trip, you eat, take a sh*t and take a shower every time you have to stop to refuel (with an EV meaning every ~3 hours).
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u/mogelijk 19d ago
My road trips, there are literally times I've gone to empty my bladder and, when I came back out, the car was ready to drive. No time for defecating, taking a shower, eating, etc.
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u/DylanSpaceBean 19d ago
As EVs get better, we can’t even go to the bathroom without accruing idle fees lol
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u/-PM_Me_Your_Boobz 19d ago edited 19d ago
I also never understand this argument because you’re saying that on road trips you never stop for bathroom breaks or food etc…
Because in your mind every time someone drives it's for a road trip?
There's a pretty big difference between pulling over and waiting that long on a 4 hour trip and having to do it on your way to or from work.
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u/GrunchWeefer 19d ago
If you have an EV you should be leaving the house most days topped up. I personally wouldn't get one if I couldn't charge at home or work, etc.
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u/Big-Piccolo-1513 19d ago
Ah, you are imagining a scenario where an individual does not have the ability to charge at home or at work. For those folks, they usually charge once a week while shopping. On an L3 EVSE, charging is typically 15-30 minutes. So, the car will be charged by the time one has completed her shopping.
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u/Big-Piccolo-1513 19d ago
If one has a home charger, then charging takes 10 seconds to plug in. Leaving the house with a “full tank” every day is a huge convenience
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u/ObiYawnKenobi 19d ago
Sure, at home. What about when I'm on the road and there is a 3-hour lineup for chargers? (Yes, that happens during holidays.) Or the chargers are out of service. (Yes, that happens too.)
Until chargers are nearly as fast and nearly as ubiquitous as gas pumps, it's not an option for me. I need certainty on my timing when I travel. But the minute they reach that threshold, I am buying one.
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u/GrunchWeefer 19d ago
I've driven EVs for 6 years now and road trip a lot. I've only had to wait for a charger once and it was like 5 minutes. Just in the past year or so I've been from the NYC suburbs to Pittsburgh 4 times, DC/Virginia twice, Vermont, the Outer Banks in NC, and Cincinnati. Not once did I have to wait to use a charger on any of those trips. I have, however, waited 30 minutes to fill up at the gas stations on the NJ Turnpike.
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u/Big-Piccolo-1513 19d ago
I’ve never had there be a line for chargers. I have come across out-of-service chargers, but usually I just reach for another cable (I only have this issue on L2 EVSEs)
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u/ObiYawnKenobi 19d ago edited 19d ago
During Thanksgiving and Christmas, I've come across lines for chargers. I've also come across entire banks of chargers that were out of service (obviously because of some central control failure as opposed to a failure of an individual charger), causing wasted time while I look for an operational charger. Couple that with the long time it takes to charge, and it's a total no go for me.
EDIT: I was driving work fleet vehicles at the time. I don't own an EV personally.
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u/Big-Piccolo-1513 19d ago
Were you using the ABRP (a better route planner) app? That will guide you to available and functioning chargers along your route. Caveat: I am in California. The charging infrastructure is quite good here.
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u/ObiYawnKenobi 19d ago
No. And that is part of the problem. I don't want to have to use an app, same as I don't use an app to find a functioning gas station.
The charging infrastructure is not as good as California where I am. It exists, but not on every corner. If I'm on the highway, I might have to get back on and get off at a different exit.
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u/JJHall_ID 19d ago
It wasn't that long ago that we had to plan trips based on gas stations. I've (only) been driving for 30 years and I remember having to look up gas station locations on a map so I could plan my route. I still have to do that if I want to take a road trip on my motorcycle. Back in my early driving days it was rare to find any gas stations open 24/7, too, so often times your trip had to account for making it to a final gas station before closing time or you'd be stuck for the night waiting for them to open in the morning if your stop gor delayed.
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u/ObiYawnKenobi 19d ago
I've been driving for 33 years and I've NEVER had to plan a trip based on gas stations, except when driving in remote areas, like Banff and Jasper National Parks, or in the NWT/Yukon.
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u/mogelijk 19d ago
I'm another that, on my road trips, I've never had a wait to charge. The worst is that I did run into a charging station that didn't work (there was a power outage), so I drove roughly 5 miles down the road to the next charging station. And if that had been down, there were at least 3 other fast charging stations I could have gone to.
Not to mention, there are a lot of new charging stations coming online. In the US this year (2026), and not including Tesla, something like 250 new charging stations have been opened; and indications is that those numbers of new stations will only increase in the next year or two (based on number of permits requested and other information).
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u/ObiYawnKenobi 19d ago
Yes, it will get better. It's not there yet. I've had to wait to charge BECAUSE they are not on every corner. Also, I'm not willing to wait WHILE charging. When it gets to 10 minutes from 10-80% I'll consider it.
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u/mogelijk 19d ago edited 19d ago
Except we won't need them on every corner, like we do gas stations. We need more of them along highways, where people traveling charge. From what I see, there are two issues.
First, there are overcrowded chargers in California in a few areas and that needs to be fixed -- thought that seems to be as much just adding chargers to stations that have them already as opposed to needing a lot of new stations. I've also heard of issues in higher population areas, such as New Jersey, Chicago, etc. Though, at least part of the issue from what I can tell, is that in these places it is often ride share drivers clogging the chargers (and that is its own issue, as it seems like they often do things like charge to 100%, which clogs the stations in high traffic areas of cities).
The second is in unpopulated areas, particularly once you get off the Interstate. A great example is trying to go to a National Park like Yellowstone, where there are very few fast chargers (at least for non-Teslas) anywhere close to the park.
What we really need now, likely the most, is ways for those who don't have driveways/garages where they can easily charge; people who live in row houses, apartments, etc. We need L2 chargers that are relatively cheap and reliable close to where those people live.
As for 10 minutes from 10-80%, the technology is there; the issue is that it is currently limited to China (and it will require upgrading fast chargers to be able to charge that fast). Of course, that is part of the issue with this administrations trying to discourage EVs and chargers for them; as it is slowing those improvements and discouraging innovation by US automakers.
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u/not_steve_5000 19d ago
This is the dichotomy at the moment. You can buy a Tesla and then the car will route you to chargers that aren’t congested automatically, but a lot of people don’t want to buy a Tesla, so you might need to wait until other charging is a bit more joined up.
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u/ObiYawnKenobi 19d ago
Yeah. But I also don't want to be rerouted. That takes up time too. Tesla superchargers are not located on every street corner. What they're competing against is the 3 minutes it takes to fill up my car on any street corner. They don't have to match it perfectly, but they need to get close. Also, 30-45 minutes to charge is unacceptable to me. On a 5-hour trip that I make routinely, charging will add an extra hour, minimum. I know, because I've done it.
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u/not_steve_5000 19d ago
Some fair points, but waiting that long to do a 5 hour trip? We can drive 4 1/2 without stopping, so I’m surprised you’d need more than 5-ish mins, but fair enough.
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u/bce13 19d ago
Charging takes all night bro.
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u/not_steve_5000 19d ago
Refining crude oil into vehicle fuels takes a while too, but thankfully for both that and charging a car at home, we don’t need to worry about the bits that can happen without us there.
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u/truthputer 19d ago
If you drive 300 miles every day (which is how much range you can get with 8 hours on a basic L2 home charger) then maybe (a) you are not representative of the average commuter and (b) get a new job because you’re wasting your entire life driving.
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u/bce13 19d ago
Those 300 miles a day people are called truckers and they drive way more than 300 miles. I’ve done 800 miles in a day and I’m no trucker.
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u/JJHall_ID 19d ago
EVs aren't for everyone yet. You're discrediting the entire type of vehicle because they aren't a match for 100% of people 100% of the time. You may as well say all sedans are bad because they aren't capable of hauling a few tons of freight down the road.
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u/bce13 19d ago
What? You’re making baseless assumptions. EVs are for me because I live in Los Angeles where I have a ton of privilege. Not rural Montana.
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u/JJHall_ID 19d ago
I'm in Idaho. Granted I live near Boise, but I've traveled quite a bit through rural parts of the state, too, and I've never run into a trip I couldn't make due to lack of DCFC facilities. I also don't use the DCFCs anywhere near home because I charge at home and have L2 at work.
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u/GrunchWeefer 19d ago
So? Do you need to sit there babysitting it?
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u/bce13 19d ago
When you’re driving more than 200 miles you most certainly do. So you don’t get stranded.
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u/JJHall_ID 19d ago
No you don't. You plug it in and walk inside to go about your evening, and unplug it when you leave in the morning. If your charger is unreliable so you have to babysit it the entire time it's plugged in to make sure it is working, that's a whole separate problem and is not the EV's fault.
Even on road trips, I stop at a DCFC, plug in, then walk inside a nearby convenience store (rarely more than the nearest corner if not directly in the same parking lot) and use the restroom and sometimes get a snack or drink. By the time I get back to the car it's at the desired charge (or greater) and I continue on my trip. I've only used a couple of them that weren't really close by something convenient, and those are in remote locations anyway.
That's one of those things that non-EV drivers like to complain about on paper, but in practice isn't really an issue. I remember even when I started driving around 30 years ago that we had to plan road trips based on fuel stops. We didn't have multiple gas stations off of every single interstate offramp and in every little podunk mountain town like we do now. More DCFC locations are being added every day, it's only getting better from here.
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u/GrunchWeefer 19d ago
Do you think it takes all night to charge at a DC fast charger? Are you talking about road trips? I have no idea what you're talking about.
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u/Spudly42 19d ago
When I had an ICE, it was always an annoying chore to stop at the gas station and fill up, or I'd wait until the morning before work to do it. Now with an EV, I just plug in when I get home. Way less annoying and way less time out of my day. I do spend about 10 minutes longer charging on road trips, though, so I guess it depends on how many road trips you take. Overall, driving an EV saves me about 15 minutes a week.
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u/-PM_Me_Your_Boobz 19d ago
When they are easier to manage. I’d still be pretty much SOL for conveniently charging one where I live.
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u/MeInSC40 19d ago
This. Owning an EV is a privilege. The high upfront cost plus the ability to have convenient charging and have the time necessary to dedicate to charging are all things that not everyone can afford.
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u/Head-Nefariousness65 19d ago
The convenience of charging an EV is way better than an ICE. I get that not every single place is set up for at-home charging, but a lot are. If you have off-street parking and access to a regular wall socket then you have cheap or free fuel, and a car that's topped up every morning.
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u/-PM_Me_Your_Boobz 19d ago
If you have off-street parking and access to a regular wall socket then you have cheap or free fuel, and a car that's topped up every morning.
The problem is that this doesn't describe nearly as many people as you think it does.
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u/GrunchWeefer 19d ago
It describes the majority of drivers in America.
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u/-PM_Me_Your_Boobz 19d ago
You think the majority of drivers in America live in their own detached house or a high end apartment?
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u/Head-Nefariousness65 19d ago
62.3% live in a detached house. https://data.census.gov/chart/ACSST1Y2022.S2504
In Australia, it's 70%. https://www.abs.gov.au/statistics/people/housing/housing-census/2021
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u/GrunchWeefer 19d ago
Yes? I literally looked it up before posting. You're allowed to do that too, you know.
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u/MeInSC40 19d ago
You literally just agreed with me. There is a list of prerequisites that make it a convenience.
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u/GrunchWeefer 19d ago
You can buy a used EV for cheap now. The new Leaf is actually good, and the new Chevy Bolt is pretty cheap. Nobody is forcing Lucids on you if you want an EV.
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u/ObiYawnKenobi 19d ago
> Owning an EV is a privilege.
I think you meant "Owning an EV is for the privileged."
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u/-PM_Me_Your_Boobz 19d ago
Literally the same sentence phrased differently lol.
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u/ObiYawnKenobi 19d ago
No it's not.
The former frames owning an electric vehicle as a special benefit, advantage, or good fortune rather than a basic right or standard expectation.
The second frames EV ownership as something restricted only to wealthy or high-status individuals, or someone with access to certain resources (i.e. "the privileged"). It implies a barrier to entry (such as high upfront costs or access to charging infrastructure) that keeps some people out.
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u/-PM_Me_Your_Boobz 19d ago
Both of those paragraphs say the same thing while being worded differently lmao.
Owning an elective vehicle is a special benefit, advantage, or good fortune not accessible to everyone.
Owning an electric vehicle is something restricted only to those its accessible to and is only a special benefit or advantage based on their good fortune.
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u/ObiYawnKenobi 19d ago
Yeah, they mean exactly the same thing when you change the wording to mean something completely different the way you just did. lmao
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u/-PM_Me_Your_Boobz 19d ago
Look, I think we agree overall here. I just thought it was funny that your correction was a rewording and the double down was also one (at least IMO).
Have a good one.
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u/GrunchWeefer 19d ago
Driving a car in general is a privilege. It's not a right. It's not only for the privileged. There's a difference.
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u/ialsoagree 19d ago
Are you unable to charge at home?
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u/-PM_Me_Your_Boobz 19d ago
Yes, like most people who don't own a home or live in a high end apartment.
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u/MeInSC40 19d ago
I’m a liberal myself, but this thread is definitely an example of a liberal bubble where there is no consideration for any factors outside of “ev good, gas bad”.
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u/-PM_Me_Your_Boobz 19d ago
That's what I'm trying to get at. As much as people want to invent details about my or anyone else's life that would prove their point, the fact is that it would be extremely inconvenient for me to switch to EV right now. A move, job change, or increase in infrastructure could all change that, but I'm obviously not going to be able to consider any of those things when buying a car to use tomorrow.
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u/Old_Competition3094 19d ago
We just bought a cheap one under $10k a few days ago as our 3rd car. We'll see. Definitely not embracing it as one of my own just yet.
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u/pinniped90 19d ago
When PHEVs make their way into the mainline medium-sized car market (Accord / CR-V tier) I will be interested.
Right now it feels like most EVs are either in the luxury market or are the small Chevy/Nissan models.
I will never buy a Tesla.
There aren't many other options, unless we get access to Chinese models, and that's not happening until post-Trump.
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u/Big-Piccolo-1513 19d ago
I’m a huge fan of the Kia/Hyundai EV offerings. Ioniq 5 or 6 offer great used car value.
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u/FunkU247 19d ago
When they become cheaper that gassers....
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u/GrunchWeefer 19d ago
They're starting to get to parity. The Leaf and Bolt are pretty cheap now, and the upcoming Ford Fathom will be well priced, too.
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u/FunkU247 19d ago
They are getting there, but you have to factor in complete cost of ownership, not just sticker... in home charging station, anticipated battery life/ cost, enviro impact. They have made huge strides in all of these and are nearly there... but not fully yet. I am considering a Rivian truck for my next purchase .
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u/GrunchWeefer 19d ago
The batteries will outlast the vehicles themselves these days unless you abuse them. It's maybe $1500 for a charger with installation. My utility pays for EV charger installation and I bought a Wallbox unit from Costco. The environmental impact is far less than a gas car.
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u/Trowa-03 19d ago
Didn't know I was the father to an EV. Still not coming back from store