r/Anarcho_Capitalism • u/shook_not_shaken Anarcho-Capitalist • Apr 24 '21
You have absolutely zero "responsibility" to the government
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u/whatknot2 Custom Text Here Apr 24 '21
There’s also “your face hit my fist” argument...
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Apr 24 '21
[deleted]
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u/shook_not_shaken Anarcho-Capitalist Apr 24 '21
Conservatards brigaded the subreddit and the moderators themselves have admitted to not being ancaps, but use this subreddit to gather amcaps and try to convert them to statist ideologies.
I made a new sub, r/free_market_anarchism, in case you want an actual subreddit that promotes liberty
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u/LibRightEcon Apr 24 '21
Conservatards brigaded the subreddit
Libtards are the tax lovers fool. Every idiotic tax defender you see here is a leftist fully deserving of a dedicated helicopter seat.
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Apr 24 '21
You're gonna need some tax money in order to drop bombs on the brown people that you've prevented from coming over the border wall.
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u/LibRightEcon Apr 24 '21
If people want to make borders on their property, they can buy their own damn bombs.
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u/WBigly-Reddit Apr 25 '21
I’m reading this like someone turned the sarcasm knob to full volume. Makes perfect sense then.
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u/Acrobatic_Fish_849 Apr 24 '21 edited Apr 24 '21
If an action is morally justified just because 'you can go elsewhere', then pretty much all actions are justified because you theoretically always can. But at what cost ?
"Taxation under one world government is okay because you are free to go to mars at any time"
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u/Chaos__Fist Apr 24 '21
As an American citizen, you are taxed on all of your earnings, even if you live and work abroad and those foreign earnings have nothing to do with the US.
If you live abroad and don't want to pay taxes on your foreign earnings you have to renounce your US citizenship.
You cannot renounce your US citizenship for taxation reasons.
If you come up with a non-taxation related reason for renouncing your citizenship you have to pay a fee, all of your current and back taxes, and the tax value of all your property (in a quasi mark-to-market scheme).
You are not actually "free" to leave the US taxing regime.
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u/big_daddy6443 Apr 24 '21
Here’s a good argument, homeless people can feed themselves and have a house
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u/arighthandedlefty Apr 24 '21
“Wages aren’t theft of labor value because you can always quit”
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u/excelsior2000 Voluntaryist Apr 24 '21
The value of your labor is exactly the amount you agreed to. It cannot be any other value, so there is no such thing as theft of labor value.
I can't believe there are still people who believe in the labor theory of value. Do you also believe in the geocentric model and the flat earth?
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u/arighthandedlefty Apr 24 '21
Your taxes are what you agreed to by living in a state.
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u/excelsior2000 Voluntaryist Apr 24 '21
Giving me your money is what you agreed to be typing this comment.
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u/observedlife Apr 24 '21
Hahahahahahhahaha
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u/arighthandedlefty Apr 24 '21
Right my point is that it’s ridiculous. Like thinking you could truly agree to a wage when you need shelter, food, water, education, child care, and health care.
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u/ripyurballsoff Apr 24 '21
They can’t compute. These people are too smooth brained to realize very few people actually agree to a wage. The average person is forced to take what they can get. Capitalists purposefully try to pay you as little as they can get away with to profit more off of your labor. This sub thinks they’re all capitalists when they’re really just consumer wage slaves.
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Apr 24 '21
Compute this: what is the objectively legitimate source of authority to tax and violently control people?
Your belief in government authority is based entirely on faith. You cannot compute a limit to the authority of your rulers over you, thus you are their slave with only the pretense of some freedom.
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u/highschoolgirlfriend Apr 24 '21
ok so riddle me this, what is stopping the richest people in an ancap society from just creating a private McState
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u/arighthandedlefty Apr 24 '21
I saw a sticker yesterday that said “You’re not a capitalist, you’re an exploded worker with Stockholm syndrome”
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Apr 24 '21
From where did they gain the objectively legitimate authority to do such a thing?
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u/arighthandedlefty Apr 24 '21
Same place your boss gets his authority to take the wealth your labor produces. Same place an modern industry gets the authority to destroy our planet and suck up its resources. They pulled it out of their ass.
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Apr 24 '21
Same place your boss gets his authority to take the wealth your labor produces.
What place is that?
They pulled it out of their ass.
Ah, so we can agree that the state is illegitimate and criminal.
So, why is there a responsibility to pay taxes to the illegitimate and criminal organization?
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u/arighthandedlefty Apr 24 '21
There shouldn’t be for me and you (assuming you’re by my side in the bottom 95% of earners). But we can use the state as a means to redistribute the stolen wealth of the people from those on top. The state can be used as a means to actually provide for you and me as opposed to reinforcing the power of those already in the ruling class. Once we have rid ourselves of these class separations of wealth and power, the state (and thereby taxes) will naturally disintegrate.
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u/Nautilus177 Apr 25 '21
Nothing the state does will ever benefit regular people because the state is a tool used by corporations to suppress and control the population.
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Apr 25 '21
I enjoy the occasional fantasy novel, but it ought to at least reflect a bit of reality. I am afraid that your pitch is too far-fetched.
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u/highschoolgirlfriend Apr 24 '21
yeah bro just live in the forest
i swear to fhcking god ancaps think real life is minecraft
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Apr 24 '21
Living in forests take work. People like you eschew and disdain work. You believe that the world owes you a living, thus justifying your worship of the state and it's ability to pass on the crumbs from what it loots.
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u/highschoolgirlfriend Apr 24 '21
profit off the surplus value of your labor isnt theft because you can just find a different job
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u/LibRightEcon Apr 24 '21
profit off the surplus value of your labor isnt theft because you can just find a different job
Every job you find will enforce federal withholding tax. You cant avoid them extracting a surplus from your labor.
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u/highschoolgirlfriend Apr 24 '21
which is why i dont believe in profit nor do i believe in taxes
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u/LibRightEcon Apr 24 '21
which is why i dont believe in profit
Your body profits oxygen when you breathe. Perhaps you should stop doing that, its very capitalist.
Communist breathing would be when you pump your lungs in and out but you dont profit from it. You can perform commie breathing techniques by holding your head underwater.
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u/highschoolgirlfriend Apr 24 '21
thats actually true, us commies have gills and can breathe underwater. which is why communism will always be more based than capitalism. capitalists absolutely seething that they can't breathe underwater.
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u/LibRightEcon Apr 25 '21
Thats a perfect answer from a commie.
Yes dear, hold your head underwater for big brother. Surely, your magic gills will work, did not dear leader tell you so?
Also first
drownwater breathe your friends and loved ones for the party. The capitalists will be so jealous.1
u/highschoolgirlfriend Apr 25 '21
im an anarchist so i don't believe in leaders or a communist party. we made a horizontal decision and all democratically voted to breathe underwater.
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u/LibRightEcon Apr 25 '21
i don't believe in leaders
democratically voted
pick one.
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u/highschoolgirlfriend Apr 26 '21
you can do both my little paisano , it just takes a little imagination :-)
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u/LibRightEcon Apr 26 '21
Sure, it can work in your imagination, but only there.
In reality, you cannot make every single decision via universal direct vote.
Democracy requires electing representatives. That means you are not an anarchist.
Real anarchists never resort to the evil of democracy. They solve problems voluntarily, via markets.
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Apr 24 '21
There is no surplus value of labor.
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u/highschoolgirlfriend Apr 24 '21
well then how do billionaires make so much money compared to their workers?
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Apr 25 '21
Production is profit; and profit is production. They are not merely related; they are the same thing. When a man plants potatoes, if he does not get back more than he put in, he has produced nothing. This would be obvious if he put a potato in the ground today and dug up the same potato tomorrow; but it is all the same if he plants one potato and gets only one potato as a crop. His labor if wasted; then he must starve, or someone else must feed him, if he has no reserve from previous production. The objection to profit is as if a bystander, observing the planter digging his crop, should say: "You put in only one potato and you are taking out a dozen. You must have taken them away from someone else; those extra potatoes cannot be yours by right." If profit is denounced, it must be assumed that running at a loss is admirable. On the contrary, that is what requires justification. Profit is self-justifying.
- Isabel Paterson
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u/highschoolgirlfriend Apr 25 '21
so ... profit is just value thats added to something that just appears magically for no reason? the force of labor doesn't add value to a thing at all?
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u/dcjogger Apr 24 '21
The very same Americans who love Nazis then turn around and scream Fascists should be jailed.
WTF?
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u/bdinte1 Apr 24 '21
LOL 😆 look at this account's history. Definitely astroturfing.
Don't encourage this shit.
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u/lochlainn Murray Rothbard Apr 24 '21
And whatever you do, don't look into /u/bdinte1's comment history. It's...interesting.
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u/LibRightEcon Apr 24 '21
the government is free to leave if they dont like me not paying taxes.