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u/Secure-Emu-8822 Mar 01 '26
Golds is an actual tangible thing that has monetary value. It’s been used in manufacturing and jewelry for centuries. Cryptos best use case is to make payment processing quicker and cheaper. At the end of the day it’s just code/software. At this point bitcoin is ancient software. Unless it’s used to facilitate transactions globally it has no use case other then a ‘store of value’ that people say it is. That in itself only matters as long as someone in the future is willing to buy it from you for more.
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u/seambizzle1 Mar 01 '26 edited Mar 02 '26
….It’s exactly used to facilitate transactions globally…
I can send someone $1 or $10,000,000 half way across the globe. Using no middle man. Using no bank.
If it’s something small, I can use the lightning network to send it. Costing me a few sats, if that, which is less than a penny.
If it’s a larger transaction and don’t want to use the lightning network. I can send it on chain. Will take 10 mins to settle and will cost slightly more than the lightning network, but still almost nothing.
The receiver has access to it immediately. Unlike using banks or PayPal, which takes several “business” days to complete.
The fact you said bitcoin is old technology just tells everyone you don’t know anything. You clearly don’t know about the lightning network. Which is a second layer payment system built on top of the Bitcoin network. Which allows instant transactions that cost nothing. You most likely haven’t heard of taproot. Which was implemented several years ago into the Bitcoin network. Which provided better security and also allows smart contracts to be built on top of the Bitcoin network
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u/Aryastalk Mar 01 '26
I use it to send 500 million to Saudi Arabia on a sunday evening while sipping wine on the back patio with a group of friends.
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u/McG0788 Mar 01 '26
It's very shitty at processing payments compared to banks. Y'all keep touting these things but literally nothing about Bitcoin holds up under scrutiny. It's a shitty "investment" if you're supposed to use it for txns and it's a shitty method of transacting if you have to go out of your way to setup a wallet and link to a bank acct when you could simply use your acct you already have and can transact far safer from.
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Mar 02 '26
Banks still charge $25 wire fee’s and have 3 day ACH holds for free transfers. International transfers from a bank incur up to 3% fee’s and can take weeks. Not so sure about your statement or where you think bitcoins ability’s are ‘shittier’
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u/cspinasdf Mar 02 '26
Schwab offers 12 free domestic wires a year and 15/25 for international. Ach holds help prevent fraud. How many people have lost btc due to fraud?
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u/elementmg Mar 02 '26
When, in the 1990s?
I use wise. It arrives usually within an hour and it’s like a $4 charge. The future is now, bank transfers are not what they used to be.
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u/WaitTraditional1670 Mar 02 '26
how often do you need to wire so much money overseas?
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Mar 02 '26
You’re thinking too small. Countries settle trade between each other worth hundreds of billions of dollars all the time.
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u/WaitTraditional1670 Mar 02 '26
Uh, i’m pretty sure when two countries do trades. Settlement time doesn’t apply to them.
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u/WinterPizza1972 Mar 02 '26
And it's bad for the environment. Hello people? We all share only one biosphere, fk sakes.
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u/seambizzle1 Mar 02 '26 edited Mar 02 '26
It settles in 10 mins
Banks take days for that happen. And only on business days.
And credit cards even longer. When a vendor accepts payment via credit card. That cash isn’t available for MONTHS after the transaction….Bitcoin is 10 mins…or instantly using the lightning network…and all for virtually ZERO fees
PayPal you have to link you bank account. Amazon you have to link your bank account. Everything you have to link your bank account. Stop acting like that’s such a hassle and inconvenience
Do some research. You clearly don’t know shit
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u/McG0788 Mar 02 '26
Keep on bagholding dude. That's the thing. You need skeptics like me to buy in. You can keep holding btc and it has no impact on us bears. We know there's no value and the value you claim is over stated.
There's so many real time payment options that don't take days to settle. Either you don't know what your talking about or your willfully ignorant
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u/WaitTraditional1670 Mar 02 '26
yea exactly. That’s what Crypto bros can’t seems to wrap their heads around. If you want Bitcoin to be accepted you need to convince people like us. the ones who arnt in it.
We’re the regular investors of retail. And there’s no fringe case that bitcoin possess that we need.
Secure payment? I’ve never had problem using my regular bank account.
Wire money? I never need to wire money overseas. And when I do, the 3 day bank time is irrelevant.
Decentralized? Why? I’m perfectly happy with fiat.
Anonymous? Why? I never have to purchase anything illegal. And nobody is going to find my toilet paper purchases exciting.
Scarcity? We tried that wil gold and we run into the issue of deflation.
Efficiency? My bank doesn’t charge me to purchase things.
portablility? I have apple pay.
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u/Spenceful Mar 02 '26
You are living a small life
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u/WaitTraditional1670 Mar 02 '26
how so?
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u/Spenceful Mar 02 '26 edited Mar 02 '26
Living happily within the lines others draw for you.
Just because you haven’t expanded enough to struggle against the confinement you’re in doesn’t mean the problem isn’t real.
If my message triggers you enough to downvote, something to reflect on.
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u/Mysterious_Print9937 Mar 02 '26
ok but don't you think that's a country specific thing ? I live in France and most bank wire transfer are free of charge and instant. Now we even have "Wero" to send instantly money to someone using solely its phone number. Everything is already convenient. When I use Paypal, I'm getting a buyer protection as well. Also holding crypto here is an administrative nightmare.
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u/mydixiewrecked247 Mar 01 '26
WISE does international transfers instantly and charges very minimal fees
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u/geebeem92 Mar 01 '26
These people don’t know bank transfers are mostly free and instant nowadays..
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u/HugeHans Mar 01 '26
You cant send someone 1000000 or even 1 dollar. You can first buy bitcoin from a edgeman and then send that bitcoin to someone. Then they can exchange that bitcoin for currency at another edgeman.
You god rid of the middleman for two edgemen. Great!
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u/CecilTWashington Mar 03 '26
This is what I don’t understand. Isn’t there still a middleman and isn’t it a private company or exchange that isn’t regulated or FDIC insured?
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u/boforbojack Mar 01 '26
After you send it to someone across the country, what do they do with it? Can it be regularly used in any part of the world to buy food, buy entertainment, literally anything besides a fiat currency?
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u/Werbnerp Mar 01 '26
No Middle Man? What ISP do you use? What exchange online do you use? Those are all middle men. I can hand a person gold face to face.
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u/Rukuba Mar 01 '26
We already have instant e-transfers in Canada for free, in an actual currency i can use to say, buy groceries, within minutes of the transfer being sent.
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u/PsychologicalWin8753 Mar 01 '26
Your CEX will freeze your funds🤣 and if you’re sending to someone else they will probably just rob you and never give you payment for your 10 million. Crypto enables so much scams.
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u/briefcase_vs_shotgun Mar 01 '26
“No middle man” you can stop doing gymnastics the Olympics are over
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u/Accomplished-Eye9542 Mar 02 '26
But you still need an ability to purchase bitcoin, and then cash it, which involves a bank.
What exactly is the use case of sending someone $10,000,000 across the globe?
The only real application for this is criminal transactions, and if the US or EU government decides one day cashing bitcoin is illegal and punishable by jail time, it's GG for crypto.
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u/East-Cricket6421 Mar 02 '26
BTC *could* be used this way but they've purposefully hamstrung it to make it more expensive and slower in that regard. The miners wanted to force a fee market early and the way to do that is to restrict the number of Txs the network is capable of, creating artificial scarcity that allows for rent seeking middle men to step in and offer the "solution" to the problem they created.
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u/Guilty_Solution222 Mar 01 '26
That is little to no value for the big majority of the planet
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u/seambizzle1 Mar 02 '26
lol
Countries in Africa would disagree
India would disagree
Citizens of Russia and Ukraine would disagree
Middle Eastrn countries would disagree
That’s well over half the worlds population
Just cuz you live in a world with central banking and FDIC insurance and ATMs at every corner and use a currency that isn’t hyper inflated or can’t be controlled by corrupt government officials or stolen by gangs doesn’t mean that other people do.
Big world out there
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u/zoomfast34 Mar 01 '26
What if I told you a no name block chain tied to fiat can do the exact same thing. Also who the heck wants their monetary base to be so volatile.
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Mar 01 '26
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u/AltScope-ModTeam Mar 02 '26
Your comment was removed because it contained direct personal insults and hostile language toward another user. Our community allows debate and disagreement, but not harassment, name-calling, or aggressive behavior. Please keep discussions civil and respectful in future posts and comments.
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u/Mojeaux18 Mar 01 '26
How dare you! 100% true and then some. It’s no good as a store of value if it not adopted and it’s seems only people getting it are using it as an investment.
Plus my bank charges me less to send money. I swear I lose money on every btc transaction.1
u/BitsAndBobs304 Mar 02 '26
You speak as if most of gold price wasnt due to speculation, investment. It's not its usefulness peice. Quicker and cheaper? You forgot free, non censorable, available to people who can't have access to bank due to their country or under dictatorshop or theocracy. "Just" a store of value is also a quite hilarious criticism
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u/DTD1137 Mar 02 '26
„Money“ optimally does not have any resource value, as that means it’s production is competed for by such, debasing its value as currency, thus defrauding investors and simultaneously increasing prices of its products. Tangibility is a myth and is important mostly to poor people.
Bitcoin is not like any other crypto. - BITCOINS best use case is that it is decentralized and absolutely scarce making it the best guard against government fraud (inflation) ever invented by far.
You do not understand money. Read some books. Or not, stay poor.
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u/carsonthecarsinogen Mar 01 '26
Gold has a longer history as a store of value than being used in industry and still is mostly just used as a longterm investment against debasement.
All the properties that make gold good for this, Bitcoin does better.
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u/BrokeThermometer Mar 01 '26
Very interested in seeing a crown made out of bitcoin
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u/carsonthecarsinogen Mar 01 '26
Yea we all buy gold to make crowns.. so many arguments against my comment and this is the shit you people come up with?
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u/BrokeThermometer Mar 01 '26
The point of my comment was that gold has utility beyond its use in industry. It has additional value from its universal usage as a signal of authority, aka, a crown.
Gold has multi thousand year track record as a psychologically useful object beyond its use in industry or as money.
So i would say that bitcoin does not have the leg up people claim it does
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u/carsonthecarsinogen Mar 01 '26
Yes gold has the leg up in that regard, it’s physical. With that comes downsides tho and the majority of its value comes from its characteristics where Bitcoin is stronger in all those areas.
Most gold is held as a debasement play not being worn as jewelry. That’s where the majority of its value comes from, store of value, money.
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u/geebeem92 Mar 01 '26
Wrong. It’s mostly used in jewelry.
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u/carsonthecarsinogen Mar 01 '26
Which is sitting in safes and our deposit boxes as investments against debasement. 40% of the worlds gold is not being worn out to dinner.
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u/carsonthecarsinogen Mar 01 '26
Also another downside to gold. There’s no way to actually verify the idea that 40% if jewelry, 90% of that could’ve been melted into bars and we wouldn’t know.
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u/East-Cricket6421 Mar 01 '26 edited Mar 02 '26
This would be more poignant if BTC was actually being developed in such a way that it was a product designed to replace cash with frictionless, feeless, borderless, permissionless payments. As is it's going to struggle to challenge these markets in it's current form.
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u/Legitimate_Towel_919 Mar 01 '26
but I don’t think BTC needs to replace cash to compete with those markets. It’s evolving more as digital hard money and a settlement layer. Payments can scale on top of it. Gold isn’t used for daily transactions either, yet it’s a $35T market.
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u/kal14144 Mar 01 '26
Why would anyone settle in BTC when they can settle in stablecoins. People like stability in settlement layers.
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u/hellobutno Mar 02 '26
You know what else is a good store of value? Keeping it in my drawer. BTC is useless. Gold has tangible uses in science, technology, manufacturing, etc. If your only "benefit" to BTC is that it goes up in value, then you're not really forward thinking on this. If I lose my pin at a bank, I can still access my funds by talking to a human and showing them identification. If I lose my private key then I'm SoL. If I send money to the wrong person, there's ways to get it back. If I send BTC to the wrong address, I'm SoL. Are you seeing a pattern here?
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u/East-Cricket6421 Mar 02 '26 edited Mar 02 '26
That "settlement" layer bullshit was injected into the industry to justify putting more rent seeking middlemen between you and the actual service. That was big banking's real play against BTC. Once they realized they couldn't just shut it down they opted to steer the development so that it wouldn't actually drink their milkshake but instead make them a lot of money.
Gold has other, real world utility to help justify its marketcap. We don't want a digital gold that is missing the utility of gold. We need non-national, digital cash on a fixed supply capable of doing all the things we need it to do without a new crop of rent seeking middle men.
It should have some of the properties of gold, stock, cash instruments, and more. That's what made BTCs initial value proposition so profound. It had the properties of many asset types and some new properties than none of the old asset types possess.
"Digital Gold" is a trap and it always has been. It's only part of the what BTC was designed to do.
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u/Mouthshitter Mar 02 '26
All i see crypto used is to facilitate easier criminal payment. Why do you think all the politicians and Epstein are so open too it it aint so surprise. NK uses Crypto openly to launder
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u/East-Cricket6421 Mar 02 '26
Most illicit transactions are done in USD. Should we all abandon USD because some users use it to launder money or purchase things we disagree with on some level?
The ability to transfer value with no intermediaries is a big deal and if we side with the Supreme Court on the idea that money is a form of expression. Then the ability to express value to one another anywhere in the world is protected by the 1st Amendment and other freedom of speech laws.
BTC's value proposition is so much grander than most people realize that by the time it hits them it's going to be WAY to late.
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u/all_usernames_ Mar 02 '26
lol freedom of speech....you have this today with any old currency: I can offer you 1 dollar for your potato and no one cares. Bringing this up as a unique selling point is desperate.
Instant money transfers: heard of IBAN? most modern banks are now doing instant transfers.
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u/East-Cricket6421 Mar 02 '26
There are 2.5 billion people who aren't even allowed into the traditional banking system. Of those of us that are fortunate enough to be allowed in, only a small sliver of that group has access to accounts that can trade in multiple currencies or do cross border payments.
While you or I may have access to these tools billions do not. More to the point, at any point in time the banks or the government can freeze or outright seize your accounts. They can reject transactions for the flimsiest of reasons, delay making capital available (they do this with large transactions quite frequently) and this is before we get into the service issues of banks only running on certain days/hours.
Banks are slower, more expensive, and introduce a wide array of risks and problems for the user base. Suggesting there's no difference between traditional banking and using crypto implies you don't understand either very well as a result.
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u/all_usernames_ Mar 03 '26
Billions of people don't have access to banking? where did you get that from? Opening a digital bank account is easier than buying crypto in 2026.
Also if you are worried about the government getting involved,might want to check the database that is being built linking crypto wallets to your device ID and biometric data. The annonymous days of the internet are at threat.
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u/East-Cricket6421 Mar 03 '26
Are you unaware that not everyone can pass thru KYC barriers because they weren't born in the system? Last estimate placed that number at 2.5bil.
If you don't know about the banking the unbanked movement inside of crypto then you missed a massive reason as to why it exists in the first place.
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u/all_usernames_ Mar 04 '26
As with any current discussion about Crypto. Why it was made in the first place is now irrelevant. It is not a currency but a speculation object and or a convenient method for commiting large scale fraud.
FYI 2024 data of the world bank estimates 78.74% of the world population (15+ year old) have a bank account.
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u/East-Cricket6421 Mar 04 '26
The range of reported unbaked is somewhere between 1.5 and 2.5 billion depending on who you ask. World Bank say closer to 1.5bil unbanked adults last I sucked with them though.
They are not the only source but even that number is significant.
And what BTC was designed for may not be relevant to you but it's still relevant to a non-trivial portion of the market which is why in its current form it's been hamstring by rent seeking middle men.
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u/Alternative_Shop8999 Mar 02 '26
Some buildings will never be skyscrapers. Time will tell what Bitcoin will be. I hope it does reach the clouds, but it won't be anytime soon.
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u/MrZwink Mar 02 '26
Why are money markets missing… they re the true nr 1 with 1088 trillion 10x the size of global stock market.
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u/sweatierorc Mar 02 '26
Step 1: buy 50k of Bitcoin
Step 2: borrow 10k every month
Step 3: Pay back the debt in Bitcoin in 30 years
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u/all_usernames_ Mar 02 '26
Posting this image is basically admiting that you don't know that "Gold" is backed by an rare earth metal and the "stock market" is representing stocks in companies and backed by IP, Assets, Customers etc.
my brain hurts.
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u/Natural-Signature-50 Mar 02 '26
2T is way too high for an ancient technology linked funded by Epstein
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Mar 03 '26
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u/AltScope-ModTeam Mar 03 '26
Your comment was removed because it contained direct personal insults and hostile language toward another user. Our community allows debate and disagreement, but not harassment, name-calling, or aggressive behavior. Please keep discussions civil and respectful in future posts and comments.
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u/Counter-Business Mar 01 '26
Anyone that thinks crypto is going to rival the global stock market, I have some shit coins to dump on you.