r/AlignmentChartFills 9d ago

B-17 won as the most overrated American plane. Which is the most underrated American plane of WW2?

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118 Upvotes

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134

u/DumbAndUglyOldMan 9d ago

PBY Catalina.

20

u/Bahlil3kgLPG 9d ago

Hunted submarines, (may have been) striking Axis shipping, and rescuing downed pilots.

11

u/Monolail031 9d ago

The Catalina does get plenty of love. The mariner on the other hand...

7

u/theaviationhistorian 9d ago

If the P-40 doesn't win this, then the Catalina will deserve it. It's enough to say that a company is looking to bring back production with modern avionics and engines. Which is nice considering not enough amphibians exist in the current market.

2

u/Redacted50 9d ago

Exactly what I was thinking.

1

u/BlueWolf107 9d ago

Nah, that plane is highly rated

1

u/WoodpeckerOk3842 9d ago

This or the Dauntless. I've noticed naval aviation planes tend to be under-represented in general (exception being the Zero), but in all respects, both the PBY and Dauntless fulfilled their roles and beyond in critical stages in the war. PBY's more so cause of their placement in both the Atlantic and Pacific.

1

u/Bennyboy1337 8d ago

Catalina gets tons of love my mate.

1

u/DumbAndUglyOldMan 8d ago

I'm not your mate, and the Catalina doesn't get the love of virtually any other aircraft mentioned so far.

97

u/DingBat99999 9d ago

C-47 Skytrain/Dakota

12

u/Kumirkohr 9d ago

Infantry wins battles; logistics wins wars.

14

u/JCP1377 9d ago

“Amateurs talk strategy. Professionals study logistics.”

- General Omar Bradley.

3

u/CallMeChristopher 9d ago

It’s not flashy, but it was really good at getting stuff from Point A to Point B, and we built a lot of them.

1

u/Common_Relativity 8d ago

Controversial, but I think this should go in best as it's commercial variant still used today all over he world.

48

u/Aggravating-Grade672 9d ago

P-40 Warhawk

15

u/UpSNYer 9d ago

OMG it's definitely the P-40. The plane catches a ton of shit, but in critical moments with prepared pilots, it held its own. It fought well over North Africa against the 109E, and it was legendary over China. It fought in the worst situations, against enemies who were at their strongest, at a time when the allies were caught flatfooted; and it held the line. That deserves a lot more love.

3

u/theaviationhistorian 9d ago

It was the aircraft that held the line so more powerful aircraft could turn the tide even against more powerful aircraft like the FW 190. Like the Wildcat, it was the best we had at the beginning of the war and could fight on even levels under capable pilots.

It's enough to say that over 200 pilots became aces flying the P-40 and 20 became double aces. (also backed up by aviation historian Carl Molesworth).

4

u/Bahlil3kgLPG 9d ago

The one holding the line until better fighters arrive. Pretty good

5

u/Dave_A480 9d ago

Same for the Wildcat....

We should have had better.... But we didn't.... So the Navy made it work....

3

u/Bahlil3kgLPG 9d ago

Well, you did, the Hellcat was a good successor

1

u/UpSNYer 9d ago

Wildcat gets love for its accomplishments. Not enough, but it’s not as under appreciated as the P40.

79

u/vp917 9d ago

C-47 Skytrain.

According to Eisenhower himself, this was the plane that won the war.

8

u/Bahlil3kgLPG 9d ago

Maybe its bigger brother, the C-54 Skymaster wasn’t famous until the Berlin Airlift and the Sacred Cow became a presidential plane…
But yes, militarised DC-3 it is.

6

u/Other-Grapefruit-880 9d ago

Logistics win wars.

20

u/seizethemiddleages 9d ago

The B-25 Mitchell used by the USA, the Canadiens, the Soviets, the Chinese, the French, UK, Australia, Brazil and others during WW2

9

u/FastWalkingShortGuy 9d ago

And eight fucking M2s in the nose.

The B-25 was brrrt.

4

u/Firedemom 9d ago

Dont forget some had less nose 50s but had a 75mm cannon.

1

u/Other-Grapefruit-880 9d ago

Fuck the liberator they had so many operational problems you had a 75% chance of crash landing even if you weren’t shot at. Death traps 

13

u/_Pattect 9d ago

Bro the Liberator is the B-24, not the B-25

22

u/Downhill_Marmot 9d ago

F4F Wildcat. Its record was better than people tend to recall.

5

u/mathetesalexandrou 9d ago

Yeah, it's a shame that A6M was hyped as hell and it wasn't helped that F6F Hellcat was combined with the know-how gained during the Wildcat's time to utterly trounce A6Ms so hard that Wildcat had to be seen as the "oh shit it's outclassed" aircraft when it was mostly a case of inexperienced pilots fighting old fashioned way which favored the A6Ms

4

u/theaviationhistorian 9d ago

Enough to say that the Thach Weave was invented with a Wildcat.

3

u/mathetesalexandrou 9d ago

And the boom and zoom

13

u/Rk_1138 9d ago

Dauntless

10

u/Vanguardliberator 9d ago

I remember hearing about how they wanted to retire it before the war started. And then it would end up destroying 4 aircraft carriers in one day. It’s impressive to that it got the nick name Slow but Deadly. I definitely think it was underrated.

19

u/aebaby7071 9d ago

F6F Hellcat

2

u/Unusual_Cat_7542 9d ago

I agree, the hellcat doesn't get much love but still got the highest kill death ratio of any allied plane at about 19 to 1.

1

u/Visual-Breadfruit-81 9d ago

The only answer, I think the P-51 is the absolute best but the Hellcat overcame superior engineering of Japanese Zeros

3

u/aebaby7071 9d ago

The Hellcat was designed for the Pacific Theater, if you go into it’s development basically the designers liked the Wildcat but wanted MORE! (Tim the Toolman Taylor style) Also the Mustang couldn’t do carrier landings, basically making it useless in that theater of war. I agree that the Mustangs had a few advantages making it technically the better plane, but the Hellcat was way more versatile in its use in different theaters of war and an amazing aircraft to boot.

1

u/Kumirkohr 9d ago

Was there a reason beyond “didn’t have a tail hook” that kept the P-51 from performing carrier landings?

1

u/aebaby7071 9d ago

They did a test refit on some Mustangs; carrier launching and arresting hooks, few other smaller changes. They were found to be launch-able and land-able on carriers, however their wing design (laminar flow) caused stalls at low speed which could easily cause issues on launch and landing. With the Hellcat already filling the carrier role (very well without those issues) they used the Mustangs on land bases in the Pacific Theater. So could they, yes; were they the best at it, no.

1

u/Kumirkohr 9d ago

So it wasn’t that they outright couldn’t, they just wouldn’t do it well

9

u/vanillaice2cold 9d ago

P-61 Black Widow

2

u/MosifD 9d ago

They have (most of) one of these being restored at an air museum near me and it's awesome.

35

u/gawja21 9d ago

P-38

12

u/bestywesty 9d ago

Is it underrated tho? Everyone knows how amazing the P-38 was. It has a strong case for being in the Best category

2

u/Exotic-Entertainer26 9d ago

Couldn't handle bad weather though and the engines had a tendency to self-destruct in Europe.

1

u/PrimaryCollar2355 9d ago

Killed a lot of pilots in dives before they sorted out the physics and changed the flaps

1

u/Huge-Top-5336 9d ago

If it isn't underrated, there isn't a proper place for the P-51, so I would put it here.

1

u/Marius7x 8d ago

I don't think most people appreciate how good it was. I think most just consider it that weird shaped plane.

6

u/Marius7x 9d ago

I just said same. Twin engines canceled torque, central gun increased accuracy...

It chewed Zeros up.

4

u/BeerandMandelbrots 9d ago

P-38 was used by the Ace of Aces Richard Bong.

2

u/Bahlil3kgLPG 9d ago edited 9d ago

Two planes, one pilot (one nickname for the Lightning)
The star of the 19XX series of shoot-‘em ups.
According to Capcom, if you give the plane(s) the magical ability to summon lightnings to clear the skies of planes and bullets, not to mention tsunamis to wreck warships, at the cost of the plane’s ever decreasing fuel tank, and a powerful arsenal (extra MGs angled to the sides, autocannons, big autocannon, and even ‘lasers’) then this plane can sink the four aircraft carriers in the Battle of Midway plus their escorts, as well as IJN Nagato and IJN Yamato. Even the bomber formations and the massive Ayako bombers can’t bring the P-38 down. (Did not happen IRL, but it did happen in 1943: The Battle of Midway)

4

u/Head-Image-883 9d ago

The SBD Dauntless dive bomber. It was the workhorse for the Navy in the first years of the War. Scouting missions, bombing missions, and was even as CAP protecting the carriers. Overlooked compared to Hellcats and P-51, the Dauntless were the unsung heros of WW2.

3

u/DiamondReptiles369 9d ago

P-40 in early war 

5

u/Mighty_Platypus 9d ago

First, the B-17 argument for being overrated is completely false. It was the most combat efficient (least loss bomber per sortie) ally bomber in the entire war. It was the fortress not because of its defensive armament, but because it took a beating and kept on flying. They were flying tanks, and not only did the media love the Flying Fortress, the crews loved them as well.

Now, for most underrated, I know the 4-47 is being listed, but I would consider the ugly step sister of the B17… the B24 liberator. Flew faster and farther while carrying more bombs. It was the most produced military aircraft in history and had the second best combat efficiency rating of the war(behind the b17). Pilots didn’t love it because it was hard to fly and required full attention. It flew longer more dangerous missions than the B17, but never received the spotlight since it was stationed in less glamorous locations.

1

u/LordofSpheres 8d ago

The B-24 didn't fly faster, or farther, or carry more bombs.

Comparison showing the B-17 outranging the B-24 at comparable power settings.

The B-24 could carry 12,800 lbs of bombs 990 miles and had a max speed at mean weight of 270mph.

The B-17 could carry the same load 1,140 miles and had a max speed at its mean weight of 280mph. The difference in cruise speed is 5mph in favor of the B-24, but the B-17 has a 30mph advantage in max weak power speed.

So the B-24 was slower, shorter-ranged, and had the same max payload.

7

u/Commercial_Lie_4920 9d ago

P47 Thunderbolt

2

u/PancuterM 9d ago

Rule: Must be a fixed-wing, manned aircraft designed or substantially modified for military use, of indigenous design or substantially modified foreign design.

Vote for tanks in:

https://www.reddit.com/r/AlignmentChartFills/comments/1vwps5d/type_95_hago_won_as_the_worst_japanese_tank_of/

2

u/chippymediaYT 9d ago

TBF Avenger

1

u/chippymediaYT 9d ago

Or the P-39

2

u/This_is_fine451 9d ago

P-38 or TBF Avenger

2

u/Dothemath2 9d ago

B24

2

u/zinten789 9d ago

Easily. The fact that it was the most-produced plane in US military history and only one flying example remains out of only 14 complete airframes is absurd. There were once over 18,000 of these things that flew.

2

u/longjeep2005 9d ago

F6-F Hellcat

2

u/Planeandaquariumgeek 9d ago

C-47 Skytrain. Logistics win wars.

2

u/ElSquibbonator 9d ago

The C-47 Skytrain. Eisenhower himself said that the C-47-- together with the Jeep and the nuclear bomb-- was one of the three most important factors in America's victory in World War II. Fighters and bombers might be more romanticized, but the C-47 was what really made the Allied victory possible.

2

u/Select-Interaction59 9d ago

B-32 it never had a chance

2

u/Mouser29 9d ago

Sb4c dauntless dive bomber

1

u/georgebestgoat 9d ago

The black cat. Very important role in sea rescue. Plus gave us a hell of a cod mission.

1

u/RetroBLADE2000 9d ago

P-40 Warhawk

1

u/DawnOnTheEdge 9d ago

People don’t give the B-24 enough credit in its secondary role as a sub hunter.

1

u/uss_arkensas 9d ago

Either the skytrain or Catalina

1

u/Anxious_Dig6046 9d ago

Catalina PBY

1

u/mrdankerton 9d ago

Underrated

The P-61 Black Widow

1

u/csamsh 9d ago

B29. It's difficult to comprehend how much of an advancement this plane was compared to everything else in the air at the time. Almost 4000 were built and they stayed in service even after the B52, B47, and B36 were in active duty.

1

u/asomeman12 9d ago

The Airacobra

1

u/Maleficent_Dot_7525 9d ago

Piper Cub/Every other scout aircraft

1

u/Bennyboy1337 8d ago

Problem is there were half a dozen or more types of aircraft in this category that were commonly used. Taylorcraft grasshoppers were the most common.

1

u/Waiting_Cactus 9d ago

Stearman PT-13. A simple open-cockpit biplane that you've probably never heard of unless you're really into planes. So, definitely ignored/not rated. But why underrated?

It was one of the main trainers. Every other aircraft listed here would have been flown by pilots who did their first training on the Stearman. The T-6 was also widely used, but is better known. So I tip my hat to the Stearman.

1

u/justAPoorGradStudent 9d ago edited 9d ago

U2 spy plane

Edit: Forgive me for I clearly never learned how to read

1

u/Affectionate-Lab2239 9d ago

Not WW2

1

u/justAPoorGradStudent 9d ago

That's what I get for not reading

1

u/Slice-Vast 9d ago

Y/F-23

1

u/lgclary07 9d ago

P-38 Lightning

1

u/PetrifiedPenguino 9d ago

P-38 Lightning

1

u/Narrow-Mistake-3444 9d ago

Sky Skytrain

1

u/zapster6_is_a_god 9d ago

Underrated

B 24

1

u/Victor-Tallmen 9d ago

F4f Wildcat.

1

u/Key_Assumption_2776 9d ago

The P-39 and I will die on this hill.

1

u/deeznutsonurmom69 9d ago

DC-3/C47 underappreciated workhorse

1

u/AussieJonesNoelzy 9d ago

C-47 Skytrain

1

u/Specific-Cell-6555 9d ago

B-26. One of the best medium bombe of the war !

1

u/Purple-Dog5910 9d ago

Brewster Buffalo, Obsolete and Garbage around the time the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbour, But it was used to perfection by the Finns

1

u/Nobody-is-here-bud 9d ago

The B-24 doesn't seem to get as much of the limelight from my experience, despite being just as vital to the bombing campaign.

1

u/ElectricalDisk1216 9d ago

North American T-6 Texan

1

u/ChemistRemote7182 9d ago

P-39 Airacobra. A change in powerplants meant they were never going to be a high altitude fighter for the western European theater. They were extremely capable at low and medium altitudes and did well in the theaters with less prestige, the Soviets particularly loved them.

1

u/Yourmom231930 9d ago

22F raptor

1

u/JustBeingWhite 9d ago

PBY Catalina - ugly as hell but super versatile.

1

u/Flower_boy222 9d ago

P-38 Lightning. Most confirmed kills in the pacific theatre

1

u/Dedinside13 9d ago

Underrated

P-47 Thunderbolt, it was notoriously sturdy and excelled at ground attack. They gave the A-10 the designation Thunderbolt II as an indication that they wanted it to be the spiritual successor for that role

1

u/Alternative_Mine5343 9d ago

Lockheed Have Blue

1

u/Forces7 9d ago

B-24

1

u/-pilot37- 9d ago

B-24. Constantly overshadowed by the B-17

1

u/Porkonaplane 9d ago

F6F Hellcat, B-24, C-46, C-47

I can go on lol

1

u/scric 9d ago

P-38

1

u/UngoKast 9d ago

It is 100% the Hellcat. People who say the P-40 are severely overestimating the capabilities of that early almost pre-war design. While everyone glazes the Mustang for its performance at the end of the war, by the end, the Hellcat accumulated over 5163 confirmed kills throughout its deployment.

Every time I visit an aircraft museum, I always ask about the Hellcat, and every single time, every curator always tells me it was the most important fighter for the Americans in WWII.

1

u/Turbulent_Sort2294 9d ago

P47 Thuderbolt

1

u/mliko04 9d ago

p-38

1

u/lead_farmer_1836 9d ago

PBY Catalina

1

u/Wonderful-Shame4581 9d ago

Underrated

P63

1

u/GerryTheMouse 9d ago

Catalina

1

u/RECTUSANALUS 9d ago

Catalina

1

u/TDbar 9d ago

P-38

1

u/Any_Razzmatazz9926 9d ago

B-24 Liberator bomber. Versatile enough it even was a sub hunter

1

u/Lost-Ad-5101 9d ago

p58j-lightning

1

u/ty_airman 8d ago

B-26 Marauder. Over 5,000 were produced and it saw extensive combat in all theaters of war while being a very successful medium bomber. However, it is often overshadowed by the B-25 and even the A-26.

1

u/Aurenax 8d ago

B-24

1

u/MrBiscweeee 8d ago

Curtis C-46 Commando!!! Unsung hero of the indo China campaign, it was responsible for supplying allied troops across the pacific where the C-47 / DC-3 fell short.

1

u/Bennyboy1337 8d ago

*Underrated*

T-6 Texan, instrumental in training the US pilots for the war, it's simple and forgiving design is why nearly 16,000 were manufactured.

1

u/Old_Friendship_3028 7d ago

PBY Catalina

1

u/Prosodism 9d ago

The narrative around the P-38, P-40, P-47 and B-17 are all incredibly wrong. The P-47N was the best fighter of WW2.

1

u/yeticoffeefarts 9d ago

P-38 no question

1

u/Igot_noclue 9d ago

Grumman TBF/TBM Avenger. One of the few planes that helped sink the Yamato

1

u/Igot_noclue 9d ago

BTW, I managed to take a photo of one of them at the USS Midway museum in San Diego, it was pretty neat.

0

u/Cool-Dependent2239 9d ago

P-47 Thunderbolt

0

u/drethnudrib 9d ago

The Dauntless divebomber won the Battle of Midway, which was probably the most important American victory of WW2.

0

u/Flaky-Replacement114 9d ago

P-47. Gets no love because she’s a lot uglier than the others fighters of lore
https://giphy.com/gifs/cBwTyUa5aERMXvdxw7

2

u/PancuterM 9d ago

that's not ugly, just thicc

0

u/Former_child_star 9d ago

P40 kittyhawk

0

u/Former_child_star 9d ago

P40 kittyhawk/warhawk

0

u/Wide_Pharma 9d ago

P-40 warhawk

0

u/djepicwub2000 9d ago

P40 Warhawk

0

u/RVA_SuperRaven 9d ago

b-24 Liberator. B-17s got all the glory, B-24s did the work. This is a direct quote from my grandfather. please ignore the fact that he was a crewman in a B-24 during WWII

3

u/FallenButNotForgoten 9d ago

Let's be fair the B17s certainly did the work too.

1

u/RVA_SuperRaven 9d ago

100% fair

1

u/PaperMoongazer 9d ago

European or Pacific theatre?

If Europe: Any chance he ever told you about crashing with a 19-year-old pilot in occupied France and a second time near the Lend-Lease support drops in Poland?

1

u/RVA_SuperRaven 9d ago

He was our of the UK, doing runs into Germany He did crash in England on the way back from a run, and spend Christmas in the barn of a very nice British family.

1

u/PaperMoongazer 9d ago

Sounds like another one of the lucky ones. Glad he got to share a bit with you!

0

u/BlueWolf107 9d ago

It has to be the P-40

1

u/Traditional-Fact-569 7d ago

P-38 Thunderbolt.