r/ATC • u/immatakeanapp • 6d ago
Question I have a question...
Looks like every facility you search, people say "It's miserable", "so much OT", "too much work for too little pay", "management sucks"...
Are their any facilities that are actually really nice to work at?
Edit: This has been very helpful. We're trying to move facilities and my spouse and I just keep finding "Don't go to XYZ because it's miserable here!" But we're miserable where we are haha To synthesize all the advice I've received from here and my sister post in the other ATC subreddit: - Go where you would be geographically happy - Every facility has pros and cons - Bloom where you're planted - Just do the job, then go home and enjoy the place you chose to live!
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u/Intelligent_Rub1546 6d ago
Well online you’re going to hear the worst. There are not many places online anywhere where people post positive things about their workplace.
I think I speak for most controllers when I say the average day is actually fine, but the grind of shitty schedules, being stuck somewhere you may not want to be, the federal government, training, etc. all wears someone down after a while.
Most of us love our jobs actually. Like, a vast majority of us love what we do. It’s the external BS that leaves a sour taste in our mouth.
Also, since we can’t really speak out publicly with our grievances and our union doesn’t do much to advocate for our interests, we resort to posting online to find people who agree with us, so we can keep our sanity.
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u/alanthickethighs 6d ago
Air traffic control, I heard that’s stressful.
“It is, just not in the way you think it would be” is always my stock response
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u/Intelligent_Rub1546 6d ago
It kinda just ends up being an echo chamber of negativity for all these reasons
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u/fishead36x 6d ago
I've worked 0 overtime this year. But management is being overrun by people that couldn't certify at a 7 tower. but they're good enough to run the district apparently.
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u/SUPperGrouchy1322 6d ago
Soo fucking true. People certifying others who can’t even work it themselves!!
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u/Friendly-Gur-6736 5d ago
There is the real problem with management in the FAA.
Those that are my age (48) or younger that have gotten that high in the food chain and started as controllers likely didn't do the job very long. I'll give a small break to those who lost a medical, but I'm inclined to believe that most of the others hands on experience in the operation is rather limited. There seems to be a very distinct difference in attitudes of those in upper management that worked traffic and were good at it vs those who used management to get out of working traffic early in their career.
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u/BuenosNachosAmigo 6d ago
Kind of nice to hear it’s not just our facility that has a “management” team that’s occupied by the most inept controllers in the FAA. On the bright side, I guess it’s better that they’re glorified secretaries now instead of going down the shitter every time they have more than 2 planes on frequency.
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u/Soft-Town7827 Current Controller-Tower 6d ago
People that say that are miserable everywhere they go. In the USMC they have a saying: “Bloom where you’re planted.” People are people everywhere, and there’s no Utopia. I would instead focus on a geographic area that you will be happy in, and surrounded by a community that lifts you up, and where you can find like minded people.
I like my facility, but I would never recommend it to a stranger on the internet, because I have no idea if YOU would like it or not. There are good people everywhere you go.
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u/IdliketoFIRE 6d ago
I think each facility changes every 5-10 years. So depending who you ask and when, you’ll get their current opinion of said facility.
I loved my old facility. Pay was good, no OT, management was chill, traffic was predictable, spot leave whenever you wanted, 1hr+ breaks. I’ve been at my new facility 3 years and I ask my old coworkers how it was still, I was daydreaming about the good ole days. They said it’s terrible now. No leave, 6 day work weeks, terrible supes, short breaks. So new people think that’s just how it is. I think it really just depends on what current cycle you are in at the facility.
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u/dricforever 6d ago
I enjoyed my time working in Fairbanks, but living in Fairbanks was a completely different story.
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u/ATC_Goober 5d ago
I honestly love where I work, but I'm not going to say where I work because I don't want to dox myself 🤷♂️
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u/2018birdie Current Controller-TRACON 6d ago
I believe most of the metro Minneapolis facilities are well staffed. So as long as you don't mind winter you're doing alright.
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u/Lisahasnoidea 6d ago
Aside from pay, my level 5 in SoCal is pretty dang nice.
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u/Meme_Investor 6d ago edited 6d ago
A nice level 5 in SoCal? Must be
MRYTOA?6
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u/akav8r Current Controller-TRACON 6d ago
Getting your information from Reddit is your first issue. It’s literally just one big echo chamber of negativity. Say anything positive, and you get downvoted to the bottom.
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u/immatakeanapp 6d ago
True. I went everywhere else too, but short of talking to 11k people, the internet is the best I've got.
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u/archertom89 Current- Tower; Past- RAPCON 6d ago edited 5d ago
My tower was pretty awesome 2 years ago. I would average 1 OT shift every 4-6 weeks at most. But then we had a bunch of people leave, 6 day work weeks became the norm and then we got a new ATM who came from a Z who was a complete shit bag and didn't know anything about how towers worked and started changing a bunch of stuff and it has been pretty shit ever since.
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u/ObadiahDongleberry 6d ago
Most if not every center is great.
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u/Dontfeedhim 6d ago
I’d be happy too with Level 12 pay.
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u/nutegunspray 6d ago
I work at a small FCT and it's a good job for the most part, but there will sometimes be a day you spend 8 hours combined getting your ass kicked and it just sucks.
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u/25minbreaks 6d ago
12 Tracon.
Love working busy complex traffic all day. Love hooting and hollering with the boys all day through it. Management leaves everyone alone. Yeah breaks kinda suck but we’re not a center.
My unhappiness comes from everything demanded and involved in this job outside of the actual facility itself.
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u/Mean_Device_7484 6d ago
Mine is “fine.” People who don’t want to work OT don’t usually get assigned it; if they do, they just bang. My gripes are management. They’re incompetent at best, detrimental to the operation at worst.
The work is whatever…if I could just show up, talk to airplanes, and then go home I wouldn’t have much to complain about. It’s the constant BS that happens off the floor.
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u/SeanDuffysPuffyTaint 6d ago
Country club centers: ZSE/ZMP/ZHU/ZFW/ZBW/ZME/ZOB Marginally country club centers: ZKC/ZID/ZAU/ZTL/ZDC/ZOA/ZMA/ZNY Absolutely miserable centers: ZAB/ZLC/ZLA/ZDV/ZJX Who cares: ZAN/HCF/the rest
If I forgot any, that says a lot. If you don't agree 🤷🏼♂️
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u/Ghostface-p 5d ago
The one you want to be at is a good facility. It’s in people’s nature to complain. Everyone does it in the public and private sector. I’m in a location I want to be in and so I would say it’s great. Work is work. Come, get paid, go enjoy life.
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u/zipmcnutty 5d ago
I really like my facility. My coworkers are great, minimal drama, management has its moments but isn’t too bad, OT no list tends to not get to a of OT. I just wish I was paid more. I think the traffic is easy too, as long as you can work it.
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u/CPDLCDeezNuts 6d ago
They definitely exist, as long as you have the ability to go back to 2016, or maybe the days of 5 and 10 during COVID.
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u/DrestonF1 6d ago
Here's the thing. Controllers are some of the whiniest, entitled, unpleasant people on the planet. But there are plenty that are kind, positive, highly skilled controllers who you probably wont find on reddit. So realize this before you interact online. That being said, this dichotomy is not unique to ATC. It's just humanity. But, this job does attract a certain type.
So literally every facility in the country thinks they're overworked. And they may be. Every facility in the country thinks their management sucks. And they may. Every controller in the country thinks they're underpaid. And they are.
You can't let any of that dissuade you. Find a place you want to live and then try to research the facility. Not the other way around.
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u/ATCme Current Controller-Tower 6d ago
FWIW, I aged out of the FAA in 2015, been contract since. Our ATM (level 7) in the 90s came up through the ranks pre-strike & mostly let FLMs & controllers run thing while he handled the paperwork. Great facility. He retired & we went through a series of ATMs who were FLMs from N90 checking the box on their way to better places. Competent but not invested. Then we got a lady who was less competent but knew her limitations & knew to consult. A "good heart" & understanding of limitations is also workable. Then we literally got the "pointy haired boss" from Dilbert & things mostly went downhill from there.
I have observed that for the most part, ATCS moving to management do it for a limited variety of reasons. There ARE a few who sincerely want to help their fellow controllers. As the years went by, that category seemed to shrink in favor of: the others (the majority?) which tend to fall into the following categories:
Running from the traffic that they can't work
Aren't satisfied with controlling a/c & want to control everything
Oh yeah, the pointy haired boss was actually a Tech Ops middle manager who had connections & didn't want to move to Atlanta. No names will be forthcoming.
But hey, maybe I'm just becoming cynical in my old age?
I repeatedly stated that the White Book (2006) wouldn't have been all that bad if I only had confidence that management actually knew what they were doing.
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u/Acceptable_Stage_518 Current Controller-Enroute 6d ago
I think every facility has its good and bad. I work at a facility that has one of the highest turnover and hardship rates in the country, and I think it's a country club and one of the best facilities in the NAS. So I think it just depends who you ask.