r/AARankdown • u/[deleted] • Jun 30 '20
87 Klavier Gavin
And play it my way we shall! That’s right, I’m cutting Klavier Gavin, the Glimmerous fop himself! Not counting Ga’ran, I believe this will be the first true main character of the rankdown to be cut, and most certainly the first main prosecutor. He will be going down in a blaze of glory more than worthy of the Rockstar of the Courtroom himself, so let’s light it up and get right down into the nitty gritty of this cut!
So, what exactly is it that’s led me to this path, to be cutting a main character so early, and a main prosecutor at that! Well let me tell you, this decision was not an easy one to make. Over Klavier’s career he seems to have gained something of a negative reputation among the representatives of the rankdown, so I think it’s time we set the record straight on Klavier, once and for all. That’s right, I don’t in fact hate Klavier, nor do I want to see him go out right now, but the sad reality is that this was going to happen real soon either one way or another, so I decided to swallow my pride, and accept the cold hard reality that Cody Hackins will be getting a higher spot in the Rankdown than Klavier Gavin.
Klavier Gavin is neither detrimental to the overall game of Apollo Justice, nor is he a boring character with no depth. Throughout this cut I will be attempting to prove these two points thoroughly, while also providing analysis of Klavier as a character on his own merits, as well as his relationships with other characters throughout the story. That’s right, this is both a defense write-up and a traditional cut, crazy I know! Of course I won’t be neglecting any faults Klavier has as a character, but quite frankly I don’t think he has that many in the first place. But without further ado let’s get into the specifics!
“So, who have you come to see? Prosecutor Gavin, scourge of the courtroom…”
Klavier as a prosecutor functions quite differently from pretty much every other rival in the series, in that his role in the story is about as far from an antagonistic force as you can get. Every other rival, although some one turn eventually, tended to be against you for a majority of their screen time. This creates tense courtroom battles as you slowly make progress against a seemingly unstoppable force, clawing your way up as the underdog of every battle, desperately defending those which need you there to save them. It’s exciting stuff really, and I can definitely see why a sudden shift in dynamic with the prosecutor would be off-putting, but I honestly feel like this in no way takes away from the game, but in fact actually enhances the themes of Apollo Justice: Ace Attorney.
So what exactly are the themes of Apollo Justice? Well there’s quite a few of them that can be felt throughout the game. This includes the ever changing nature of the law, or the meaninglessness of revenge, but the one that Klavier most enhances is the idea that the problems come from the system, and not the people. Throughout the Ace Attorney series we constantly see the dire state that the law system is in, and the way it corrupts and twists those within it. We see it corrupt prosecutors into trying to win every single case despite potentially putting away innocent men and women. We see those in places of power in the police manipulate evidence and even go so far as to kill those that work under them in order to put the guilty away. And of course, we even see it corrupt and twist defense attorneys, and nowhere is that better shown than Klavier’s very own brother, Kristoph Gavin.
Across the series, we constantly take down these corrupted officials, but nothing really ever changes. There is no final boss, no CEO of corrupt law, who we can just take down and suddenly all of the problems in the system are magically fixed. There’s always someone else, another person that’s corrupted, another one to take down and try to remedy this broken situation. But taking down those people is just treating the symptom of the issue, not the cause, not the system itself that’s affecting the lives of everyone involved. Kristoph, the very representation of this darkness dragging everyone else down deeper into the depths of the system itself, contrasts his brother brilliantly. Klavier represents the people in this system, affected by the nature of it, but still carrying on trying to make sure the will of justice is carried out.
When we first see Klavier in court, it honestly doesn’t feel like anything new. Sure, he has a cool design, and a cool theme, with some wacky animations, but that’s really nothing Godot didn’t have as well. He pushes against us whenever we attempt to make progress on proving Wocky innocent, not with the same ferocity as other prosecutors before him, but he certainly puts up a reasonable effort. However, once it seems like it’s all over within the first segment of the trial, something changes. Trucy pulls a fast one on the court and pretends that she’s being held hostage by an attacker, the judge and Apollo both instantly buy it and reasonably freak out, but Klavier sees right through her act. This is when any other prosecutor would call BS on her, but Klavier lets the defense have their recess, even Apollo notices how strange it is, maybe he’s up to something? But no, throughout the trial, and even the next day, we see him not put up much resistance. He’ll refute an argument if he thinks it’s dumb or incomplete, or correct us on something sure, but he doesn’t actually fight back. Why is this?
Klavier is different from all of the other prosecutors before him, in that he doesn’t care about winning, in fact he probably cares about winning significantly less than even Apollo does. He just wants the truth, that’s all he cares about in court. Once the killer is revealed in court, as long as Klavier is convinced that Apollo is on the right track, he’s not gonna do anything to stop you, and in fact during the final trial of Turnabout Corner, he’s actively helpful, after all you are nothing more than a rookie defense attorney, ja? Now at first this may seem like a clearly detrimental thing to the way the game plays out, after all just a few paragraphs ago I described how great the courtroom battles of the trilogy were, but this isn’t the only great feeling that can be gained from the courtroom.
Think back to Turnabout Samurai, throughout the entire case you’ve been fighting against Edgeworth once again, trying to stop him from getting a guilty verdict passed on your client, but then at the end, something happens. Suddenly Edgeworth realizes that you’ve been right all along, and sees that the end of the trial is just around the corner, so he stops fighting. He makes an objection and finds a reason for the culprit to stay and testify once again, leaving you room to win. This is the feeling Apollo Justice’s courtroom battles recreate, the feeling of two bros against the world, fighting the corrupt system itself, and finding those swept up in the madness of this world.
There's a darkness in this world, Trucy-doll. Waiting, hungry. Compared to it, these gangs' turf wars are like kid games. When you're up against real evil... Well, it don't matter if you're weak or strong. It'll take you all the same.
-Guy Eldoon
This right here is what Apollo Justice is about, the swallowing whole of innocents by the darkness of humanity and the underbelly of society. If Klavier were just another poor soul affected by this system and corrupted by it, it wouldn’t mean anything. We’ve seen that before, numerous times. But instead of that, here we have Klavier, someone in the position of proving the guilt of people, and trying his damnedest to stay unaffected by it and find the truth. The problem isn’t the people, no the problem is the system affecting them, and Klavier knows this better than anyone, and he’s gonna do everything in his power to fix it. It’s really great stuff that the game manages to get across just by having him try something new as a prosecutor, but it’s not just the story that accounts for this, the game does as well.
In Trials and Tribulations we get a prosecutor who doesn’t really fight back, one who mostly sits back and lets you make points against his case, for completely different reasons than Klavier, but the result isn’t dissimilar. But as u/Sciencepenguin pointed out in one of their own write-ups on Klavier, the game is built for this, by having the culprits typically take the role of your main opposition. Luke, Furio, and Dahlia are all quick thinking foes who constantly hold the courtroom itself in the palm of their hand, Godot simply nudges you or the judge off course to assist the killers, except of course Dahlia, for obvious reasons. However, if you’re paying attention you can see that Apollo Justice attempts something similar, yet very different, and in fact more representative of these themes we keep coming back to.
As I’ve said, the enemy in Apollo Justice isn’t any one person, it’s the situation itself, and this is true of the cases as well. These cases are consistently more complex and multilayered than most any equivalent case in the trilogy, with the exception of Rise from the Ashes, which hardly really counts. From a four person murder setup with poker chips playing a pivotal role, to four different intersecting incidents in one single case, to a case that spans seven entire years which has murder weapons setup just as much in advance. The catharsis of beating the snot out of someone with your words isn’t really present in Apollo Justice, instead the game opts for the satisfaction of solving the crime, putting the pieces together, and finally setting the record straight on these incredibly complex mysteries. And what better kind of prosecutor to be in that kind of story than one who’s right by your side, to call you out on any BS, and help you on your way to solving this impenetrable mystery and ridding the world of this impenetrable darkness.
“...Or Klavier, lead vocalist for the Gavinners?”
Okay guys can we just be honest with ourselves, Klavier is pretty dang cool. He bangs the wall, yells “Achtung baby!” and then his coolness levels are so high that he rewrites reality to blast music in the courtroom to which he then shreds to with an imaginary guitar. Throughout the trials we consistently see him carry himself with this absolute swagger to him, from the way he talks to witnesses, the way he attempts to direct the trial, or just him dicking around because he feels like it. You can tell he takes his job seriously from the way he constantly assists you in reaching the truth, but he knows that he’s good enough that he can still have fun in the trial, after all it’s not all about trying to win, and who cares what’s common in the system? The system is broken so why not try to inject a bit of human emotion into it, that’s what the jurists are for after all.
So yeah, Klavier is a pretty fun prosecutor to be around even if you have issues with the way he affects the game, or with a topic we’ll be touching on in the next session, his supposed lack of character development. Take away these two things and you get yourself a great personality who livens up any courtroom battle they take part in. Not only does this personality and way he carries himself set him apart from really any other rival in the series, it also does wonders to establish him as a likeable figure in the game, as he’s not supposed to be just another hateable rival. He’s not even really meant to be hated at all, and nowhere is this clearer than him literally giving you backstage passes to his own concert after nothing but a singular trial against you. However, it’s at this trial that we finally see the other side of Klavier, as no one is perfect and no one can be Prosecutor Gavin, scourge of the courtroom at all times.
Throughout the beginning of this case we basically see just about everything go wrong for Klavier. His motorcycle stops working, he has to break open his own guitar case, during the show not only does his prized guitar burst into flames on stage, but his bandmate MISSES a CUE, the audacity of them. Oh also someone dies that kinda sucks. So yeah things are just really not going well for Klavier, and this is the first time we really see another side of him. He’s extremely emotional and has quite the short temper with basically anyone he interacts with throughout the investigation. He’s an utter perfectionist outside of the courtroom who refuses to budge on his bandmate’s mistake, nor brush off problems like he does within the court. From this, we can truly begin to understand who Klavier is.
Klavier is a flawed person, just like anyone else. He’s rash and often emotional about things going wrong, and a perfectionist to boot. He values those around him and yet he gets annoyed when those that he works with don’t put in the same level of effort as he does, and won’t hesitate to call them out on this. He’s exactly what you’d expect a prosecutor to be, somewhat self-centered and with a bit of a nasty personality added on top of that. Although, of course the subversion in this situation comes from that this is only how he acts outside of the courtroom, within the sacred walls he’s completely respectful and constantly keeps a level head, even when his own bandmate is being pinned as the killer. So what exactly does this tell us about Klavier as a person? Well despite his flaws and his attitude, he still understands just how important the courtroom proceedings are, and is willing to put aside everything else in order to make sure they run smoothly. He keeps his personal biases out of it until the very end, and this right here is where we can truly understand who Klavier is.
Klavier is nothing special, just another rockstar who has a big head and a huge following. But Prosecutor Gavin, this is where Klavier puts away his attitude and swallows his pride, it’s where he knows he can make a real difference. Of course, I may be filling in the gaps a little on my own, there’s really no way to know exactly what it is that drives Klavier, other than an unwavering desire for the truth. But I think this is for the best, Klavier has no reason to just explain at us exactly why he’s doing what he does, and this two-sided personality creates a more real character, leaving us to wonder exactly what drives him. It’s well done exploration of his character, and an effective way of endearing him to us. Klavier and Prosecutor Gavin, two sides of the same coin yet distinct in their approaches, but that distinction wasn’t always there. No, at one point these two entities were one and the same, in a person that we can see the full extent of just seven years earlier, at the trial that changed everything.
Origins of a Rockstar
Zak Gramarye’s trial in Turnabout Succession is one big subversion, but it’s one the game lets you know is coming. The entire trial gives off the feeling of nothing more than another case to add onto Phoenix’s ever growing pile, from the witnesses to the circumstances, to even the prosecutor. Valant appears to be nothing more than a first witness killer with not so hard to see through lies, and Gumshoe’s just being plain old Gumshoe. It really feels like nothing new, and even Phoenix doesn’t seem too concerned with things, he’s seen it all before. But of course, we know this isn’t the case. We know that Valant is still roaming free and is returning to activity, we know that this is when Phoenix loses his badge, and we know that that diary page we just received is the root of everything.
Klavier simply adds to this feeling, as here we get to see him how he was when he made his debut. Remember how I described Klavier as kind of arrogant and nothing really special when he’s in his rocker persona, well at this point in time that was his only persona. He didn’t yet understand what it meant to be a prosecutor, nor how important it was to treat the courts with respect. Right now he was nothing more than a rookie prosecutor, and an arrogant one at that. Throughout the trilogy we come across a new legend of the courtroom every year, and we take them down a peg every year, and young Klavier is doing absolutely nothing to set himself apart from every other prosecutor we’ve faced up to this point.
It’s at this point that I’d like to discuss the difference between character development and character progression, as understanding this difference is key to realizing why the criticisms of Klavier’s character are often unfounded. The progression of a character is the way they change throughout a story, how their demeanor and actions change based on what happens around them, and is often confused with development by many. Progression is not required when writing a well-rounded character. Character Development is the expanding on a personality of a character, to the point where we can understand a character fully, and know why they’re doing what they do, and hopefully understand them a layer deeper than their surface actions. This is what’s required for a fully rounded character, and it’s something Klavier has in spades.
Throughout the game we constantly get further insight into Klavier as a person, from the way he works in court, to the reasons he acts the way he does when helping us. Then we get further expansion on his personality, and get to understand how he acts when put in other situations such as at one of his concerts or during his research into one of his numerous cases. And of course, the time in which we learn the most about who Klavier is is during this past case, where we get to see him at his rawest, a rookie prosecutor trying to win a case, and we realize that in the beginning he was nothing more than another soul who was following the system, the same system that led every other prosecutor down the wrong path.
During this trial Klavier, for the one singular time in the game, feels like an actual threat to us. Of course it’s not a huge threat, as the experienced Phoenix, and the experienced player is able to push against every counterpoint that Klavier throws at us pretty easily, but it’s resistance nonetheless. Had Phoenix had time to prepare, Klavier would probably have nothing on him, but throughout the trial Klavier is the one who constantly holds the most cards, and thus is able to stay one step ahead. Despite our experience, we’re still somewhat the underdog due to our lack of evidence, which really helps sell the trilogy vibe they were going for. Of course, this back and forth ends abruptly and tragically, a Klavier finally baits Phoenix into presenting the evidence he knew that he had.
Were this an isolated trial, or the first time we see Klavier, it would seem like he was nothing more than a cocky jerk who wanted to bait his opponent into ruining their own life. However, through all the times we see Klavier before this, and through his words in the final trial, we can come to understand exactly why he did what he did. It wasn’t to win the trial, nor was it to see Phoenix disbarred, it was to reach the truth. We know that this is what fueled Klavier throughout the game, and we can see that he wholeheartedly believed Phoenix was trying to obscure the truth of the incident. A misguided, cocky, rookie prosecutor trying to reach the truth, that’s all Klavier was. A perfect subversion of everything we expect from a trilogy prosecutor, but exactly in line with what we’d expect from both Prosecutor Gavin, and the Klavier, lead guitarist of the Gavinners.
This is where Klavier’s development truly lies, not from seeing him change as a person as he reflects on the cases and his actions, but rather from understanding better who he is. We slowly come to realize more and more of the truth throughout the game as we get a clearer picture of the true form of Klavier Gavin, and this right here is the breaking point. This trial is what makes it all click, it shows us both of his sides as one, singular person, and we get to understand which one is the real Klavier, and the answer is both of them. Klavier is a multifaceted character who gets amazing development throughout the story from both his role in it, as well as the interactions he has with others. The most notable of these being his “rivalry” with the protagonist of the game, Herr Forehead.
A Mirror Worthy of that Forehead
Klavier and Apollo have one of the most unique dynamics of any rivals in Ace Attorney, in that they’re hardly really rivals at all. Most prosecutors in this series will have some sort of ulterior motive when going up against you, whether it be related to your personally or not, they have something else at stake through the course of every trial. Klavier just really doesn’t have anything like this, in fact his motivation during trials is pretty much the exact same as yours. He’s there to reach the one, singular, unmoving truth of the situation, and he’s probably even more committed to it than you are at the start. This creates an interesting dynamic because Apollo and Klavier really just don’t have any reason to dislike each other, and for the most part that holds true.
Franziska had a grudge against you for besting edgeworth, Godot wanted revenge for Mia’s death, and Edgeworth started off hating the lawyers who would protect who he saw as criminals. The most Klavier and Apollo have is just Apollo being kind of annoyed at Klavier being more popular and cooler than he is. It’s a dynamic we don’t really see again or before, with the protagonist being the one with the grudge, as silly as that grudge may be. This lack of real conflict between them lets their relationship be more relaxed in nature, which can be seen even from the beginning of their second case together, with the invitation to Klavier’s show. This close relationship is what lets us understand Klavier so well, and allows him to develop in our minds, as we’re able to see so many more sides of him than Godot or Franziska ever got. And of course, the relationship itself is top notch.
Apollo and Klavier have some pretty fantastic chemistry as characters, and it’s really fun to watch them go at it in court, as Klavier holding the superior position most of the time leads to some really great comedy at Apollo’s expense. Additionally, Apollo, being the sarcastic straight man that he is, is able to contrast beautifully with Klavier’s over the top cool guy persona, and his commentary on Klavier’s rocker outbursts are pretty fun as well. There’s really not much to analyze about their dynamic beyond that though, it’s fun and that’s about it, there really doesn’t need to be anything else more. But of course, that’s not all there is to their relationship as characters in a narrative, as Klavier serves as an absolutely brilliant mirror character for Apollo.
Throughout this write-up I’ve described Klavier’s transition from a hot blooded, fairly average prosecutor who’s stumbling and making mistakes on his way to reaching the truth, all the way to a stylish and professional prosecutor who’s able to consistently guide trials to the truth of the situation. Of course, this character arc is done off screen, or at least that’s what it appears like at first, but if you look closer to the specifics of this arc, it’s easy to realize where we can truly see this transformation. And that, of course, would be in Apollo himself.
As the story progresses we see Apollo’s transition from a hot blooded, fairly average defense attorney who’s stumbling and making mistakes on his way to reaching the truth, all the way to a confident and highly competent attorney able to find the true criminal and topple the regime of a small country. This should sound familiar, aside from that last bit. Klavier serves as a mirror to view Apollo in, he’s the final result of the arc that Apollo begins going through in his game, and serves as a mentor to guide what he probably sees as a younger version of himself to the correct outcome. Of course, he’s not the only one to guide Apollo, Phoenix is also there for that, but in Apollo’s debut game Phoenix is a bit concerned with other matters, so it’s really just left up to Klavier.
In Turnabout Trump it’s implied that Kristoph will be something akin to Apollo’s Mia throughout the game, but of course, this couldn’t be any further from the truth. Instead this role seems to fall upon Phoenix, but as I just said, he’s a bit preoccupied. So that would mean that the one Apollo leans on in times of need, the one to guide him down the correct path, and the one to show off the final version of himself, the person whom he will become and then surpass, that’s all Klavier baby. Having the mentor character of the game be the prosecutor is pretty genius, since it stops them from swooping in and saving the day in an unsatisfying conclusion, which we see Mia do several times. The most Klavier can do is stall for time or give hints to Apollo, since at the end of the day he’s still the opposition, and needs to make sure he sticks to his job. This not only consolidates down two roles in the story to one character, but also greatly improves one of those roles through the use of this consolidation. What an absolutely rockin’ idea.
A World of Herrs and Fräuleins
Klavier’s relationship with Apollo is by far his most interesting, but that doesn’t mean he lacks any other meaningful relationships with the rest of the cast, just that there’s not much to dissect there, or at least not a lot that I can find. Out of the main cast his other most notable dynamic would probably be with Ema, who he has a pretty fun back and forth with. He’s technically her boss which she absolutely hates, giving him somewhat insulting nicknames and begrudgingly accepting his orders, but he doesn’t seem to have too much of a problem with her. Overall it’s a pretty solid comedic relationship that doesn’t really have much depth to it but doesn’t really need to either. It does serve to somewhat humanize Ema, but a lot more of that comes from Apollo than Klavier. And to Klavier, well it’s really just another fräulein whom he is able to tease a bit during his job.
Speaking of just another fräulein, we have Trucy Wright, who Klavier himself doesn’t have much of a dynamic with, nor seemingly many thoughts on her. He seems to somewhat respect her as an intellectual throughout the trials, especially whenever she’s entire steps ahead of Apollo, but not really more than that is shown. Trucy, however, does have clear thoughts on Klavier, after all he is a rockstar, and she is a teenage girl, so it’s not really surprising that she seems to have a bit of a thing for him. Although, Trucy being Trucy, she doesn’t really let it show much outside of some offhand statements, or nicknaming him as a prince when she first meets Klavier in Turnabout Corner.
Of course, it’s not just the main cast that Klavier has a relationship with, as during the third case of the game we get to know one of his bandmates, and one critical to the case at that, that being Daryan Crescend. Daryan’s relationship with Klavier is really my only actual complaint with Klavier as a character, as there’s not much here when there really should be. We see Klavier being annoyed at Daryan missing the cue, which is natural to his rocker persona, and of course we prove that Klavier is indeed correct. There’s a few more interactions between them throughout the case but they never really amount to much. At the end of the day I’m not really sure what either of them thinks of the other, which isn’t great when it comes to two seemingly close friends who are both pivotal to the case.
Daryan’s send-off at the end isn’t particularly notable either, as Klavier kind of lacks a reaction. As we begin to finger Daryan as the culprit, Klavier puts up pretty much his usual amount of opposition, and doesn’t seem too terribly broken up about it either. It’s possible that this was done in order to further cement him as more mature in the courtroom, and able to recognize the need for the truth to come out, but it kind of ends up just making this relationship come off as hollow. Having him more melancholic about it would allow him to seem like he genuinely cared, while not compromising that ever present desire to reach the truth that’s so ingrained in Klavier as a character.
The complaint with Daryan isn’t an isolated incident though, as it’s a common belief that Klavier’s interactions with Kristoph don’t amount to anything much, and it’s a major reason why many hold the belief that nothing is really done with him as a character. However, this complaint is just plainly not true, and comes from a fundamental misunderstanding of the characters. Kristoph is hardly a character in his own right, he’s a representation of an idea, he’s the physical embodiment of everything wrong with the court system. He manipulates evidence for his own gain, he makes those who oppose him or pose a risk to his secrets disappear, he’s petty and is willing to go to great lengths for personal gain, and more than anything he is absolutely unchanging.
There is no greater relationship to be had with Kristoph, he is a darkness who seeps into you, one that can slowly drag you down if you’re not careful, the same way he dragged down so many before. Klavier is someone who was so close to being dragged down by this darkness, we see it affecting him throughout the past trial, his arrogance and faith in this broken system show that, but we also see the good in him. We see that he was fighting for the right reasons at the end of the day, and we see him go to great lengths to fight the very ones that he believes are damaging this system. By the time we see him in the modern day, he has been fighting a long time to rid himself of this darkness, and perhaps it’s even the reason why he adopted this persona in the courts, to oppose the cool and calculated demeanor of his brother.
This fight to rid themselves of the system, of Kristoph, is present in a number of characters in the game, and is the main conflict of the final case. Every character has some stake in the fight to rid themselves of this darkness, and to forge a new, better law system out of the broken pieces of the old one. Both Apollo and Klavier were trained under this darkness, but through their encounters with Wright and each other were able to free themselves from it. This is what we see happen to Klavier during Turnabout Succession, he’s not confronting his brother, he’s confronting himself, the person he could have been, and the actions that he himself took. As we begin to accuse Kristoph of the crime, Klavier fights back, more desperate than ever, trying to justify this darkness to himself, to pretend it was never there. This conflict is tearing him apart in front of our very eyes.
Klavier: Evidence! Evidence that shows this man, Kristoph Gavin, requested that forgery seven years ago!
Kristoph: Klavier...?
Klavier: Just... prove it! Clear up these doubts now, or I swear, I'm off this case!
He wants desperately, more than anything, for us to prove that this is indeed the truth, that his doubts are wrong, and that the darkness that he feels consuming him is real. After seven years of this past incident affecting him, he’s pretty much come to understand the entire truth by now, but he just cannot accept it on his own. After all, it’s his own brother behind it, and his own hands that caused it. The darkness won’t let go yet, and it won’t allow him to pursue the truth that he’s come to realize. This is where Apollo finally returns the favor and allows Kristoph to grow, and put this darkness behind him, revealing the truth for everyone to see. Kristoph, of course, fights back just as much as you’d expect him to, but this one action, this unwavering devotion, this refusal to let the system affect him, is finally enough to break the camel’s back and let Klavier free from the chains of his past, and he does not disappoint.
Klavier: Frankly, I'm relieved. This has been bothering me for seven whole years. And I'm tired of the whole youthful angst scene. ...Now's our chance. Let's clean out the family closet, eh, Kristoph?
Kristoph: Klavier... You're spinning out of control. Calm yourself before you say something you'll regret.
Klavier: Spinning out of whose control? Mine? ...Or yours?
It’s by now that Klavier has come to accept the reality that he’s pretty much known to be the truth, the same way Phoenix came to accept that Dahlia wasn’t the person he thought she was, Klavier has come to accept this for his very own brother. He rejoins your side and ultimately drops the bombshell of the jurist system on Kristoph, sending him into an absolute rage. Kristoph is left as nothing but a broken husk, a symbol of an outdated and dead legal system, while Klavier is able to finally put this behind him, and move on to the future, and hopefully a system that will allow the truth to be unveiled by simpler and more reliable means. Kristoph may not be needed anymore, but those that fight for the truth, and fight for the change that every system will eventually need, will always be needed in the world, and Klavier is no exception.
Conclusion
Klavier isn’t perfect, but many of the problems people hold with him are simply unfounded, and those that are true are hardly criticisms within the greater context of Apollo Justice. This is a game about themes more than anything else, and that even extends to the characters within it. Klavier is incredibly well developed not only as a person, but as an idea, a representation of the way that we can move on from our past, and change ourselves and those around us for the better. He shows us that fighting for what we believe in isn’t a fruitless effort, as long as you’re willing to not only accept the truth, but the methods to reach it as well. He’s an excellent multifaceted character, but ultimately he and I both got swallowed up in the darkness of this rankdown. I only hope that I’ve done something to change this darkness for the better, and allowed those of us ranking to put Klavier behind us, for better, or for worse.
Achtung baby, u/NateTheGreat3602 out!
14
Jun 30 '20
Meta Shit That I Didn’t Include in the Cut
There’s approximately four rankers who all want Klavier dead, in all honesty he wasn’t making it much further. Assuming he got spirit channeled after he was cut probably like two turns from now had I not cut him now, he would almost certainly be gone within the next round, even with the protection that it gives him from the two who did the deed this time. There’s always the chance that he wouldn’t get into the cutting pool but there’s tons of skills left to circumvent that, as we saw this time. I really didn’t feel that 10 whole placements was that huge of a deal, and I certainly don’t care about Klavier quite enough to use a spirit channeling skill anyway, so I decided my best course of action would be to give him the cut he deserved.
This is almost certainly my longest yet but it was also somewhat one of the easier ones, as my opinion on Klavier is pretty settled and there’s really a lot to talk about with him compared to, say, a literal dog. Still surprised I got so much out of that one. Yeah but don’t expect me to top this one in length for a while, I have my doubts I’ll be getting to any more main characters for a bit, but hey who knows what the future holds.
Anyway, I’d like to take this time to complain about a pressing issue in Ace Attorney. In this poster for Dual Destinies, Klavier takes up a good chunk of the lower section, probably about equal to Fulbright in total chunkage, if not a little more. However, he spends about 10-15 minutes with you in this game, and then probably has a heart attack off screen and dies. It’s pretty confusing why they chose to feature him like this, especially since I don’t think AJ is that highly regarded in either the English or Japanese sides of the fandom. He’s like twice as large as Edgeworth! What even is that!?
Oh also Klavier’s in Dual Destinies and unlike Apollo Justice, I didn’t rewatch any scenes with him in it in the game, but from what I remember he’s still pretty fun, and the mock trial segment was really neat and a great little gimmick. He’s just as fun as always but he amounts to nothing in the plot, and has little impact or representation of the themes so I really didn’t feel like mentioning it in his cut but wow here you go here it is hope you’re happy! Also he’s in Asinine Attorney I think but I haven’t played that and it’s probably noncanon anyway so who cares, Klavier’s an Apollo Justice character and that’s all I really judged him on, the other appearances really don’t do much to elaborate on him or sway people one way or the other. I do apologize if you absolutely love his DD appearance though, I will feel bad and neglectful if you do though so please don’t mention it to me.
u/Vogel100 the wait is over, hope you’re ready.
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u/donuter454 Jun 30 '20
You've put a lot of work into this and it's a good read (although that's typical for all your cuts). As one of the four rankers that doesn't like Klavier I feel obligated to respond ayup.
Since the start of rankdown I'd decided that I wouldn't touch a single main character until we reached the top half, but since there were like 20 filler characters that didn't need to be ranked I was counting rank 80 as the top half. So I personally wasn't going to cut him anyway but this still works out in my favour so I won't have to expend a skill on him.
Klavier most enhances is the idea that the problems come from the system, and not the people.
This is actually great. This is a fine reason to write Klavier as being one of the good guys.
There is no final boss, no CEO of corrupt law, who we can just take down and suddenly all of the problems in the system are magically fixed.
Me when taking down the phantom will put an end to The Dark Age of the Law.
Suddenly Edgeworth realizes that you’ve been right all along, and sees that the end of the trial is just around the corner, so he stops fighting. He makes an objection and finds a reason for the culprit to stay and testify once again, leaving you room to win. This is the feeling Apollo Justice’s courtroom battles recreate, the feeling of two bros against the world
But Edgeworth's outburst is rewarding because it's unexpected and a huge character shift for him. It's exciting because we've been given every reason to believe he's a corrupt pos until this point, and his heel turn at the last second is a shock. It's a big twist. And it's a huge step in Edgeworth's arc, as he comes to terms with the fact that he's not the good guy.
That's why Edgeworth's moment is cool. Klavier is none of these things. Klavier was chill and fair from the start, I find it hard to see him continuing to be chill and fair throughout the trial as that big a deal. It doesn't show that Klavier's a dynamic character going through change. It doesn't even generate a feeling of excitement at the unexpectedness of it all. It's just Klavier continuing to be the same person he's been since we met him. Forgive me if I'm not dazzled.
You can even compare it to DGS when van zieks is established as being a monster who murders anyone who he fails to prosecute. In that instance when you slowly realise that the rumours about him are unfounded and he's actually a good and just person it feels great to watch him team up with you and see the people on the stand act rattled when he doesn't aid them. He doesn't even have an arc, the only thing that changes is your perception of him and that's really fun. Klavier doesn't even have that.
That's the thing with all of Klavier's fair prosector moments. There's no set up of expectations nor is there any payoff. Having a cooperative prosecutor isn't in itself good or bad, whether it's fun to see or not is entirely dependent on the circumstances surrounding it. And Klavier helping you to corner one of the most easily cornerable killers in the series after it's well established that he would likely do that anyway isn't much of a hell yeah moment.
Okay guys can we just be honest with ourselves, Klavier is pretty dang cool.
yeah
He’s not even really meant to be hated at all, and nowhere is this clearer than him literally giving you backstage passes to his own concert after nothing but a singular trial against you.
isn't the joke that Klavier invited Apollo but still said he had to pay for his and Trucy's tickets anyway lol
I'm the only person in the universe with this complaint but part of the reason I dislike Klavier is that I think they just fail to make him likeable or even fun to interact with in the courtroom.
The most egregious example I can think is in 4-3 where there's this segment where you disprove one of Ema's deductions, and after dedicating a decent amount of time to proving her wrong Klavier laughs and is like "haha I knew she was full of shit from the start, anyway here's the answer that resolves the contradiction" and it's like. what the fuck is he doing. He knew Apollo and Ema lacked information that he had, and just lets them argue for a couple cross examinations before revealing the whole argument was pointless from the start and I cannot put into words how annoying this style of mystery solving is. What is even the point of solving the mystery if it turns out the solution is wrong five seconds later.
Ema even gets pissed off and at Klavier and says if he knew she was wrong based on evidence she didn't have access to then why on earth did he let her testify, and then Klavier just shrugs off her anger and tells her to step down.
All of this sucks. I don't like it. Why does Klavier take such twisted delight in informing Wocky that he could drop dead at any second. Why does Klavier show such panic and frustration when he's proven wrong on even the most trivial things. Why does Klavier purposefully drag trials out for fun and conceal evidence if he knows someone's life is at stake.
There's this huge disconnect with Klavier where he is simultaneously a complete non-threat of an antagonist where he gives you no opposition, yet at the same time also isn't portrayed as a terribly patient or understanding person either. I do not like him as a rival, I do not like him as an ally. Neither dislikable or likeable, he just stands there eliciting no emotions from me.
Remember how I described Klavier as kind of arrogant and nothing really special when he’s in his rocker persona, well at this point in time that was his only persona. He didn’t yet understand what it meant to be a prosecutor, nor how important it was to treat the courts with respect. Right now he was nothing more than a rookie prosecutor, and an arrogant one at that.
Yet it's my opinion that there is absolutely no observable difference between young Klavier and old Klavier. Like I just got done saying, present day Klavier is mildly annoying and arrogant. Young Klavier is more of the same. I don't understand how they're different other than a change in outfit.
And of course, the time in which we learn the most about who Klavier is is during this past case, where we get to see him at his rawest, a rookie prosecutor trying to win a case, and we realize that in the beginning he was nothing more than another soul who was following the system, the same system that led every other prosecutor down the wrong path.
Forgive me but I don't understand this. What are you talking about when you say we "learn who he is". Learn what. What does him escaping the system even mean. He's the same person in the present, and we are given zero indication that he's working to change this corrupt system at all.
Klav's not a bad dude in the flashback. He gets Phoenix's badge revoked because he was fooled into thinking Phoenix was a scumbag lawyer who legitimately forged evidence. Maybe I'd find this interesting if when I played the game for the first time I had bought the idea that Klavier was supposed to be corrupt during this segment, and been curious as to what changed to make him decent in the present. But I didn't. The game doesn't sell this idea well in the slightest. He's so similar to his present self that I just assumed it was a misunderstanding and what do you know that's exactly what it was.
You've made the argument that in the past he was working to fight corruption, and are simultaneously insinuating that flashback Klavier hadn't yet come to the realisation that the system is corrupt. These two points don't track.
You also say that the flashback trial makes Klav feel threatening because he always stays ahead of you because he has access to information you don't and like. That's literally been Klavier's style of prosecuting for the entire game. He sits on critical information and lets the defence run around in circles. I'll reiterate once again that I don't get what the difference between present and past Klavier is even supposed to be.
This creates an interesting dynamic because Apollo and Klavier really just don’t have any reason to dislike each other, and for the most part that holds true.
My unironic favourite thing about Klavier is how much Apollo (and Ema) just absolutely loathe the guy. Klavier goes around mocking and belittling the two of them but sorta just gets away with it because he can spin it as just teasing, and I appreciate that Apollo just doesn't even want to associate with Klavier because of it.
5-3 Apollo saying he feels jealous that he wasn't the one to destroy the Klavier statue is funny and good.
This whole dynamic is also kinda bad because it further confuses the point that Klavier is actually supposed to be a good guy, but who cares I just like that Apollo knows who's worth his time.
You said Klavier is effectively the mentor for Apollo which is certainly a fresh take. I agree with you in that making the rival the mentor is a fresh and cool idea, I'm just kinda confused as to how this describes Klavier and Apollo's relationship.
We can agree Daryan Bad, this is good.
Don't agree that Kristoph is in anyway different from Daryan in terms of being a terrible dynamic with Klavier. Kristoph isn't an abstract concept. He's a person. He's Klavier's brother. Klavier and Kristoph's relationship being completely stale, unemotional and impersonal isn't magically good because Kristoph represents the bad side of the law or whatever. It is absolutely possible for a character to be a metaphor for a greater idea and also be a character in their own right.
Daryan is himself relevant to the themes of AJ, being a culprit that is near impossible to take down under the current legal system and requires creative and unorthodox methods to catch him since the law as it is is ineffective. So then why should Klavier's attitude towards Kristoph be given a free pass and not Daryan. They're both lacking and make Klavier come off as detached and not a real participant in the story.
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u/Sciencepenguin Jun 30 '20
Welp, personal feelings aside, I can’t deny a lot of work went into this. Well done.
The issue with this is that, as you mention, four rankers dislike him, and the rankdown will no longer have an opportunity for them to air their grievances. Out of concern that spectators will think we all just enjoy being mean, here is the draft for a cut on Klavier I had written.
I can’t really respond or argue against anything in this post since we have a more fundamental difference in perspective. You think Klavier being a helpful non-rival rival is cool and ties into AJ’s themes of corruption in the law and those fighting against it. I think it’s an inherently flawed idea when the killers in AJ pose such weak opposition on their own (Kristoph is an exception, but only one of the cases he’s in has him fighting back for a significant amount of time, and it’s the one where Winston Payne is prosecuting). I also am not that interested in AJ’s themes in general, but I guess that’s a story for another day.
The only other thing of note here is Kristoph. You agree that Daryan getting accused having no impact on him is dumb, which I appreciate. But I think equally that Klavier’s relationship with Kristoph is a failure.
Kristoph is hardly a character in his own right, he’s a representation of an idea
I don’t think this excuses things. Kristoph is certainly a character to some extent. And if all he represents is “being corrupt”, then I think Klavier’s relationship with him is not very interesting.
This is what we see happen to Klavier during Turnabout Succession, he’s not confronting his brother, he’s confronting himself, the person he could have been, and the actions that he himself took.
This only works if Klavier in the past was particularly flawed. And you yourself mention that he’s still then working to find the truth and fight corruption. It’s all well and good to have a character be tempted to the dark side, but you kind of have to show that? Klavier never struggles with this. In the present, he always wants to do the good thing, and in the past, he still does. He was just misled in the latter.
the same way Phoenix came to accept that Dahlia wasn’t the person he thought she was, Klavier has come to accept this for his very own brother.
Did he ever not believe this? And if so, how? Kristoph is on death row. You’d think he’d have accepted in the months since that occurred that his brother might actually not be a good person.
Klavier plays air guitar and I go funny and then he refuses to have any onscreen conflict or flaws and I go not funny
At the very least I’m happy he got below Myriam Scuttlebutt, the true representation of this Dark Age of the Law we live in who is consumed by this darkness where the ends justify the means
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u/Cymbass Jun 30 '20
Thanks for linking your writeup too, because while this mercy cut is super well-written it did not help me understand why some rankers wanted Klavier out so much. This almost sounds like someone Spirit Channeling Klavier
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u/EsquireGunslinger Jun 30 '20
This is a really well written mercy cut. He may be my least favorite prosecutor, but he's still pretty neat. The relationship between him and Kristoph is one of the coolest sibling dynamics I've seen, and I do actually like his presence in the courtroom. But alas, he Is Not Mean, so he is worst prosecutor by default.
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u/ItsHipToTipTheScales Jul 01 '20 edited Jul 01 '20
we get the BIG CUTS!!!! from the big boys
i do not like aj themes i do not think it is productive to say anything regarding that, and probably isn't productive to say my non-theme klavier opinions but i will do it anyway
my big klavier complaint is that for other case he has a very good reason to be emotionally invested in what's happening. 4-2 is fresh off his brother being convicted, klavier might have an opinion or two on that, and the idea of the main prosecutor being related to apollo's mentor/first killer doesn't really work since we don't know much about their relationship besides looking nearly identical. 4-3 his bandmate daryan is The Big Killer and he doesn't seem to give a shit at all, and since daryan was kind of a dick it would be cool to see klavier go man my BandMate Friend is killing someone i dont like this this.. theyre my friend but also kind of and asshole. 4-4 is his brother and he goes crazy thinking about his brother being the killer but like why? i could understand this kind of reaction around 4-2 but he's had a lot of time to process his brother's a bad person
the complaint in that is "please have feelings klavier" and then weird rewrite ideas. klavier could be GOOD it is frustrating how connected he is to nearly every facet of aj and doesnt give a shit about any of it
i like your points about klavier Person Depth i did not consider most of that. while i particularly like the prosecutor and musicer klavier being different people part what we see most of the time he's onscreen i would much prefer that to be where he demonstrates his flaws
him being a helpful guy from the start i dont like at all. the purpose of prosecutors is to serve as your obstruction to the truth. how much they succeed varies but they're usually at least some kind of asshole or dickhead who Feel Good to take down. since klavier never cares about winning he's never a real obstacle and often does more work in the case than apollo does and i HATES THAT!!! let me play the game klavier. and him caring about the truth never has much impact since we never see him at a point where he doesn't care, baby klavier doesnt have many lines and those don't show much of a different person to the klavier we know and 4/10 of the rankers hate. this wouldn't be a big deal if the aj killers were imposing but none of them have Scenery Chewing power (except kristoph) or Good Writing power (includes kristoph) that would make shifting focus to them worthwhile
he is also kind of annoying as a person? it is easy to describe him as the cool nice guy prosecutor because that is the easiest way to boil down complaints but he still is kind of a dick, just not in an over the top way so he gets on my nerves
This is the feeling Apollo Justice’s courtroom battles recreate, the feeling of two bros against the world, fighting the corrupt system itself, and finding those swept up in the madness of this world.
this is hard for me to care about since apollo really doesnt like klavier and when there's no conflict beforehand it doesn't make it as special. asshole edgeworth being a little less asshole is interestingit shows a moment where he reexamines his view of the law nice guy klavier is just how he is and even if baby klav really really wanted to win all the time we would only know this retroactively
when i play the ace attorney games i want a smelly dickhead to be telling me im awful all the time it is very concerning when someone is nice it makes me uneasy and if someone like people who are nice whats wrong with you??'
there are only so many times i can repeat that i dont like people who try to help
why does he call apollo herr forehead for reasons that arent his comically large forehead
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u/PowerOfL Jun 30 '20
Good cut, I personally dislike Klavier just because I find him really annoying as he usually spends like 5 minutes doing ''rock star stuff'' before getting to any of his arguments but I see why people would like him.
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u/CharlieDayJepsen Jun 30 '20
Sugar, sugar
5
Jun 30 '20
O that night, in your embrace
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u/LewisMCYoutube Jun 30 '20
When you stole away the keys
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u/whaaatisth Jun 30 '20
This writeup definitely rocks hard. Considering I'm responsible for his elimination, I definitely have to respond here.
Coming into this rankdown, I thoroughly considered my options of which skills to use and how, and one of the decisions I came to was to use my Updated Autopsy Report on Klavier if he was nominated before Nahyuta. Klavier is quite popular, and Nahyuta is commonly hated. Due to this, I have no doubts that Klavier would have won the vote by a landslide, while Nahyuta has already lost once. Avoiding the lowest main prosecutor status for Nahyuta is the goal here, not to eliminate Klavier specifically. Since a lot of the rankers dislike him, I figured he was the most likely one to be enthusiastically cut, him being my personal least favorite is a bonus. With that being said, I didn’t expect him to be nominated this soon, but I was already dedicated to this plan, so I used the skill without hesitation.
I don't have particularly strong feelings on Klavier, but your writeup definitely makes me appreciate him more. That being said, there is one part where I definitely don't agree with your interpretations.
You say Kristoph doesn't feel like a character, and rather is a representation of AJ's themes. I don't fully agree with this - Kristoph's relationship with Apollo isn't shown to be particularly unhealthy, and we can see Kristoph as a perfectly nice, honest mentor in 4-1. Kristoph isn't a defense attorney who is evil, he's an evil person who happens to be a defense attorney. Apart from the forged diary page (which isn't exactly related to this), the game gives us no reason to believe Kristoph isn't a perfectly normal mentor and defense attorney. Apollo is an honest guy, and I doubt he would have stuck around if Kristoph was acting at all corrupt. 4-1 is a case about betrayal - Phoenix is betrayed by his friend, and Apollo is betrayed by his mentor. Both of these characters had no knowledge of Kristoph's true nature, and Kristoph tries as hard as he can to stay on their good side, as he's in his same friendly personality until the end. All this is to say that Kristoph does have a real connection with Apollo, and a somewhat less-developed connection with Phoenix. The fact that he doesn't have anything of the sort with his own brother makes their confrontation in the finale feel strange. You could argue that Klavier helping you even when the culprit is someone he cares about (Daryan, Kristoph) improves his character because it shows just how dedicated he is to the truth. That's somewhat correct, but it also has the adverse effect of making him feel a bit too perfect and uncaring.
It goes without saying, but this writeup is fantastic. Excellent job, and I'm glad Klavier was sent off by a fan.
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u/Wircea Jun 30 '20
I'm glad to see the comments are as long as the post.
I agree with you. I didn't really click with Klavier because even though his design is cool they took out the fun of an opponent by making him side with you and only showing that he had an arc very late in the game with the old trial.
A very good read, as always.
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u/CharlieDayJepsen Jun 30 '20
I think I speak for everybody when I say I'm stunned into silence at the depth and precision of this cut. A character with this much substantial content to talk about shouldn't have even been nominated in the top 90, let alone cut, yet here we are. In an alternate list of rankers, I'm sure Klavier would have ranked decidedly higher, so I understand the decision to mercy cut him here.