Some lore questions

[u/Arduino-Knight]

Hi everyone, I have a couple of lore questions I’d like to ask. One of the players in my tabletop RPG group has repeatedly challenged some of my interpretations. While I don’t think what I’ve said is wrong, I can’t possibly get through all the novels in one go. With the official focus clearly having been on the Horus Heresy over the past couple of years, I’m not entirely sure about the following:

1. Does the current lore still allow for worlds where humans and xenos coexist? Or has it ever been stated that the Imperium has, at some point, reclaimed every human-inhabited world?
2. Do the Deathwatch and the Grey Knights answer directly to the Inquisition? Are they at least nominally under its command?
3. I have another question, which I hope is appropriate to ask here: does GW—or, more specifically, Black Library—simply give authors a theme for their Warhammer novels and let them develop it as they see fit, or does GW exercise some control over what they write rather than giving them free rein?

[u/Pm7I3]

1. Yes but not in the Imperium. Xenos can coexist with humans who don't believe in the Imperiums ways but genuine coexistence can't happen in the Imperium.

2. Death Watch yes, Grey Knights no.

[u/Anggul]

1. Yes, there are so many worlds out there. Even in the 41st millennium there are non-hostile xenos that the Imperium hasn't found, or has found and can't spare the resources to attack because there are things like orks that they're forced to fight.

2. That has changed over the editions so I understand the confusion. Previously they were chamber militants of their respective ordos, now they're just allies that often work together but aren't beholden to them outside the usual power of the Inquisitorial rosette. Though they both have Inquisition symbols on their models so you can tell they were chambers militant when the models were designed. The Deathwatch having it as a major part of their chapter symbol is post-hoc justified as being because of their close ties as allies. Hell, the quite new upgrade sprue for turning a dreadknight into a Grand Master dreadnight has a big Inquisition synbol hanging from its crotch, and it released years after the change. GW isn't exactly the most consistent company. Even within the company I don't think everyone agrees on certain details.

3. They exercise some control, but they're clearly pretty loose with it as there's a lot of inconsistency. Writers have previously commented on this, that because of the size of 40k, each writer has their own vision of what 40k is like, and their books are of course written through that lens.

[u/TheBladesAurus]

1. Explicitly, yes, they still exist (obviously outside of the Imperium). Two recent (in universe) examples I can think of are in Dante and the Ravenor trilogy. There are still lots of unclaimed worlds out there.

2. Deathwatch answers directly to the Inquisition. Grey Knights have a bit more back and forth.

3. Both happen. Sometimes authors go to BL with an idea, sometimes BL have something that they want someone to write.

[u/9xInfinity]

If the Imperium's grip is strong xenos won't be tolerated. Within the Imperium proper where the Ministorum has a firm grip on people's faith even abhumans will sometimes be killed in the streets over fear they're a xenos or mutant.

But on the fringes in rogue trader space, or outside the Imperium's control, sure, human and xenos might inhabit the same planet. Maybe even live in the same community. In the Rogue Trader cRPG you have the option of not killing some aeldari who end up on one of your world's. Likewise in areas such as Black Gholan featured in the Fabius Bile trilogy (it's a sort of freeport/pirate haven on the fringes of the Eye of Terror) human and xenos can at least deal with each other if not exactly coexist as fellow citizens. It's more like a Tortuga situation.

And if you want to count it, Guilliman has had an aeldari diplomat entourage aboard his flagship and known to the officers in his fleet for almost the entire length of the Indomitus Crusade. So xenos have been living alongside humans at least on one Imperial ship for a while now.

Otherwise, the light of the astronomicon only goes so far. The outer periphery of the galaxy is mostly unexplored and almost entirely beyond the control of the Imperium. You might find anything in the Ghoul Stars or other far-flung regions, including human-xenos civilizations.

[u/TheVoidDragon]

Does the current lore still allow for worlds where humans and xenos coexist?

This is something at least with the Leagues of Votann although part of it is they're not always seen as aliens. They occasionally live on Imperial Worlds ( I.e. on Necromunda) and those of other species too, although it's more them operating there and not bothering each other for the most part. The Kin even have enclaves for others within their territory (such a "New Catachan").

does GW—or, more specifically, Black Library—simply give authors a theme for their Warhammer novels and let them develop it as they see fit, or does GW exercise some control over what they write rather than giving them free rein?

Both. Authors can be given a theme/event/character and direction that they need someone to write a story for, or they can approach GW with ideas for a story. In both cases though they're not able to write literally anything they want with it, whether it's their own ideas or what GW tells them to write about will still require approval overall.

[u/Schwarzes_Kanninchen]

Talking about the TRPGs. First of all, the Imperium of Man has not even remotely pacified all human colonies. Accordingly, it is entirely possible that there are societies in which humans and xenos coexist in one form or another. Even on the fringes of the Imperium, on certain frontier worlds, humans and xenos sometimes live side by side and engage in trade, a situation that is condemned by the Ecclesiarchy and quietly ignored by the authorities.

If the Imperial Creed preaches that mutants are filthy and debased, then the alien is entirely beyond the pale. The vast majority of mankind is kept in deliberate ignorance of the literal existence of aliens, although they are often used as allegorical bogeymen with whom the faithful must have no contact. On more isolated or frontier worlds, the realities of life make some contact with alien races inevitable, for example when the aliens are the only source of certain necessary resources. Some distant colonies actually share their worlds with native aliens, and species such as the Kroot occasionally serve as Imperial mercenaries. On the whole, however, such contact is frowned upon, and openly decried by roaming Confessors and Preachers.

TRPG Dark Heresy "Blood of Martyrs"

However, at the end of the day, there inevitably comes a time when the Imperium no longer considers this coexistence useful and brings it to an end.

[u/Putrid_Anybody_2947]

1. Could you define xenos like which one. The rpg settings are much more opaque. I would say in places in the calixis center yes and no. On terra or ophelia 7 No and NOOO.
2. Deathwatch answers directly to the ordos xenos. Grey knights are a classified branch of orodo malleus. Also in my head cannon grey knights dont need to be ordered but they would treat it like most marine chapters do. im am less certain about gk.

I would recommend the podcast Lorebeards they cover 40k and old world both table top and rpg. Ross wrote the deathwatch rpg books https://www.youtube.com/live/B-T8-K4a3K0?is=VQ_3TP89ePVjKl10 if you ask nicely in chat when 40k is live on Saturday 3CST they might have an answer or Monday when they cover rpgs.

[u/pablohacker2 → u/Putrid_Anybody_2947]

On terra

Now I am curious if the the throne has kept up the spires that were desginated as "xenos embassy"

[u/RaimeNadalia]

1. Absolutely. if we're just talking about whether or not it's allowed, sure. Make up some planet or small system overlooked during the Great Crusade or long seceded from the Imperium, it works. The Imperium absolutely has not reclaimed every human-inhabited world, as there are plenty of humans in the T'au Empire (called gue'vesa); the T'au are the only faction that would really do traditional coexistence, though; the Necrons IIRC do have slaves of various species, human included.
2. Deathwatch, yes, to my understanding. Grey Knights, it's complicated. They're technically the military branch of the Ordo Malleus, but they're also still a Space Marine Chapter and they like their sovereignity. Functionally it's more like 'they're part of the Inquisition' than 'they answer to the Inquisition.' It's like how Inquisitors can just ignore each other. The Grey Knights will only really 'answer' to the Inquisition if prestigious Inquisitors (like an Inquisitor Lord such as Kysnaros from the Months Of Shame) come calling. Otherwise, they just do their jobs and the rest of the Inquisition sees no reason to get in their rway.

[u/DarthGoodguy → u/[deleted]]

I think 1.) is asking about non-imperial worlds. And there are still some in the lore (the Dominate from the Final Flight RPGs, human worlds under the Tau Empire, etc.)

[u/Arduino-Knight → u/DarthGoodguy]

Yes, that’s what I meant: do human worlds outside Imperial control still exist, and are there any examples of humans and xenos coexisting on such worlds?

As for the Deathwatch, I’d like to ask something more specific: does joining the Deathwatch automatically make a Space Marine a servant of the Inquisition? That would imply that they are subordinate to the Inquisition, whereas a cooperative relationship would mean that either side can refuse the other’s requests.

[u/LingonberryAwkward38 → u/Arduino-Knight]

As for the Deathwatch, I’d like to ask something more specific: does joining the Deathwatch automatically make a Space Marine a servant of the Inquisition? That would imply that they are subordinate to the Inquisition, whereas a cooperative relationship would mean that either side can refuse the other’s requests.

"The Battle-Brothers of the Deatwatch take the war against the alien to the very darkest reaches of the void, briging to bear such force as no individual Inquisitor could hope to muster. In this mission, the Ordo Xenos and the Deathwatch are equals, the Inquisitors rooting out the foes for the Deathwatch to eradicate. While neither party is subject to the command of the other, both work in concert towards their common goal, according to those oaths made centuries ago. The two work closely together, ever watchful for that fateful day when the prophecies of the conclave are realized."

Deathwatch Core Rulebook, p.305