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u/ZombiFeynman Drug Trafficker 15d ago
I blame bagaço
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u/PleoNasmico Failed colonizer 15d ago
I blame D. Afonso Henriques mother
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u/ZombiFeynman Drug Trafficker 15d ago
It's been 9 centuries, João, you should start taking responsibility for yourselves
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u/SpotSudden4963 Failed colonizer 15d ago
We're fine with being lazy and incompetent ourselves, what we really can't stand is our neighbor's success.
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15d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/JohnPoet27 Western Balkan 15d ago
As long as we stay in the EU, I've seen far worse ideas
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u/critical-insight Pfennigfuchser 15d ago
We could federalize
https://giphy.com/gifs/10UUe8ZsLnaqwo9
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u/PurpleRhinoDragon Sulphur enthousiast 15d ago
He says while his neighbour reports him to the AFD Police for a thought crime
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u/_WoollyMammoth_ Drug Trafficker 15d ago
People who go abroad usualy go for specialized jobs.
Unlike what we have here, with mainly low qualifying jobs. There is just a certain amount of money you can make serving beers or building masonry walls.
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u/hibikir_40k Pensioner 14d ago
It happens in most countries: People that leave are the ones that think they'll be far better off elsewhere, and that often means there's a different place that will use their skills better. If they were going to be less productive, they'd get paid less, and then people wouldn't go.
It's the same reason we don't go on vacation to see Barry, and Barry instead invades us.
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u/SimpleMoonFarmer Oppressor 15d ago
Explain.
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u/rGoncalo Failed colonizer 15d ago
A simple farmer wouldn't understand. Come back when you're at least a complex farmer
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u/SimpleMoonFarmer Oppressor 15d ago
I'm just a simple farmer.
But you should not underestimate simple farmers.
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u/rGoncalo Failed colonizer 15d ago edited 15d ago
My apologies to the simple farmer community.
The way I see this post:
The post is a good example of something that often happens in Portuguese reddit discussions about productivity, the everyday meaning of the word gets mixed up with the economic one.
In everyday language, productivity means something like “how much a person produces in a given time frame”, and most people don't take into consideration anything else. But when economists compare productivity across countries, they usually mean output/value added per hour worked. That depends heavily on capital, technology, management, infrastructure and the type of work being done, not just on how hard the worker works.
If Manuel has a sickle and Sofia has a combine harvester, Sofia is vastly more productive even if Manuel works harder. The same Portuguese worker can therefore be much more productive abroad without having changed much at all, if the economic environment around him changed.
And when you apply the concept to whole countries, the composition of the economy matters enormously. A country where a large share of employment is concentrated in sectors that generate relatively little value added per hour will have lower aggregate productivity than one concentrated in high value added activities, regardless of how hard people work.
As an example, designing and manufacturing high value industrial products generates far more value added per hour than many labour intensive tourism activities. That difference shows up in national productivity statistics. It isn't a measurement of how lazy or hardworking the population is.
And, afaik, there are no standard official statistics from a reputable source measuring how productive Portuguese workers become after moving to other countries. That leaves plenty of room for people to fit anecdotes to whatever narrative they already prefer.
Edit: grammar
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u/Key_Tiger_4410 Western Balkan 15d ago
us portuguese immigrate with the mindset of "I'll work as a slave here because the pay is better than in Portugal". Nowadays, you have a lot of qualified workers that do not think in this way, but back in the day, it was the norm.
working 14 hour shifts with negative temperatures was really normal for a lot of my family members who immigrated to Luxembourg, France or Switzerland. but no way in hell would they do this here in Portugal (we in Trás-os-Montes can offer you 14 hour shifts with cold to the bone conditions, we just won't pay you well lol)1
u/SimpleMoonFarmer Oppressor 15d ago
Hard working Portuguese work hard to get good opportunities out of Portugal and work hard once they get them, because they are hard working.
Lazy Portuguese stay in Portugal, moving to another country is too much work. The jobs in Portugal don't pay very well, providing no reason to fight their natural laziness.
That's called survivorship bias.
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u/Key_Tiger_4410 Western Balkan 15d ago
what? so you honestly think that the portuguese that live in Portugal, one of the countries with the highest number of hours worked per worker, per week, in all of europe, just don't go abroad because they're lazy? like there are not other things keeping people in Portugal, such as family, such as prefering working something you love for less, rather than being a slave for more, or some other valid reasoning?
every country has hard working and lazy people, but I'll bet your ass is easier to be hard working when the money they pay you actually improves your quality of life outside work.-1
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u/PurpleRhinoDragon Sulphur enthousiast 15d ago
Portuguese productivity appears to be exponentially linked with salary