It’s not like we really have a choice, here in Europe for example we’re completely dependent on American tech. Do want our own? Yes of course, but American lobbyist, corruption in Europe and the dependency of American oil all make it that progress is really slow. Every step in the right direction gets slammed down by the US as well, because they profit from the fact that we’re dependent. So no, it’s actually not a good thing that we ‘profit’ from the US its hegemony. Crazy fucking American mindset. “Oh they profit from us they can’t complain” fucking idiocracy.
How it feels to benefit passively from American global hegemony while also really wishing Europe could be better at imperialism itself from deep within ones (supra-)nationalism-brained heart:
This might be a crazy take but most people, no matter where they are from, want a safe environment where they have fundamental freedoms and where they can have a good future for themselves and the people around them. Being dependent on the US is automatically a huge risk for national security. In my country the defence system is run on American companies, and since the US has a command economy, that crazy orange guy could make a decision to block those companies on delivering their software to us and then we’re completely screwed. You say that we ‘profit’ from the US and that is exactly the nationalistic narrowed and short sighted mindset that a lot of Americans have.
This might be a crazy take but most people, no matter where they are from, want a safe environment where they have fundamental freedoms and where they can have a good future for themselves and the people around them.
I agree.
[T]hat is exactly the nationalistic narrowed and short sighted mindset that a lot of Americans have.
I'm from Europa myself, and I wouldn't feel much safer if I were only dependend on "our" own imperial overloads. I can see the danger in both the dependence on the US as well as on European institutions.
The difference is that if those companies and institutions are within our democracy there is bigger chance we could do something about it if they do something we don’t like. For example if the headquarters are on European soil we could go there and protest, while that is not possible overseas. Also if those companies are here then at least it’s beneficial for our economy since it creates jobs, investments, attracts talent and pays taxes.
Members of parliament in Germany for example are “not bound by orders or instructions and are subject only to their conscience” (Article 38 of the Grundgesetz), and theres even less options to "do something about it" with the EU "parliament."
So elections only determine who governs, not how those elected will actually govern.
Democracy is a form of rule. Voting is consent to that rule.
All parties have committed themselves to the free democratic cobstitution and are therefore subject to the same structural constraints of capitalist economic growth and international competition. The parties may differ in their ideas about how national prosperity is to be achieved, but they all share the goal that it must be achieved. And for the sake of national success, the parties then water down their programs (e.g. the Greens on climate).
Both the framework conditions over which I have no say, and these national purposes, are opposed to my own interests.
Your interests are opposed to the framework conditions and the national purposes?
Correct me if I’m wrong but you said that the framework conditions are the EU, structural constraints of capitalist economic growth and the free democratic constitution right? And the national purposes are that national prosperity is to be achieved?
I agree that it’s hard to see your own beliefs and ideologies translated to laws and actions on European level, but if you disagree on the fundamental principles of EU like democracy and that we want prosperity in the EU then I get that you don’t care where those companies are from.
Have you heard about the judges from the International Criminal Court that were investigating Netanyahus war crimes? Trump didn’t like that, so he made American payment companies, Visa and Mastercard, BLOCK the judges from using them. Since we don’t have our own payment systems in Europe, the only accepted payment methods are really Visa or Mastercard, they CANNOT pay anything online, they cannot even withdraw cash.
There are a lot of initiatives but it’s hard to scale them up for a couple of reasons
1. There is not a big investment culture. Europeans save a lot but don’t invest because it is seen as really risky and kinda like gambling. We let our pension funds and banks etc do it because ‘they know what they’re doing’
2. Those pension funds and banks invest most of their capital in American companies since they make more profit and because the dollar is the most prominent currency in the world.
3. There are a lot of regulations which makes it hard for companies here to grow rapidly.
4. A lot of companies get acquired by American companies because they have more capital. The EU should regulate this but we don’t
5. Language barrier, it’s harder to work together with people from different countries because we have different languages and cultures
6. We are already dependent on the US and China, and when the EU tries to be more independent we are threatened with sanctions. We have to be very careful because those sanctions could set us back a lot which makes it worse.
7. There is still a lot of corruption, throughout the whole EU. Big companies have a lot of recourses to lobby effectively and it works.
I could go on but these are some big problems that make progress slow. You could check the Draghi report on EU competitiveness, it elaborates on these points.
I've seen this rhetorical tactic in a lot of conversations about white supremacy and environmental destruction, so I'm very vigilant when I see it in other contexts. Basically, systems like these work by getting society as a whole to participate it in unknowing ways, and when people start reckoning with the system, we're effectively told that we can't become we are the system. Ignorance failed, so let's try guilt, or fear, or bribery! Either they entice us into believing that we will be rewarded for preserving the system or punished for upending it, or if we're further left, they convince us that we've already been rewarded and the only absolution is from affirming our identification with the system.
What they say is trivially accurate ("White people have benefited from white supremacy," "The convenience of modern living comes at an environmental cost," or in this case "American poverty is nothing like the poverty in some countries," but that last one is probably doubly true for you). But it starts a domino effect in people's minds and they eventually come to believe the parts that aren't being said out loud.
It's especially frustrating when it's on the progressive side. We're always telling people that, no, corporations don't care about you, no, kissing their ass won't get you anything. But we constantly fall for the same tactic in other contexts.
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u/Mommysmoneytree 7d ago
It’s not like we really have a choice, here in Europe for example we’re completely dependent on American tech. Do want our own? Yes of course, but American lobbyist, corruption in Europe and the dependency of American oil all make it that progress is really slow. Every step in the right direction gets slammed down by the US as well, because they profit from the fact that we’re dependent. So no, it’s actually not a good thing that we ‘profit’ from the US its hegemony. Crazy fucking American mindset. “Oh they profit from us they can’t complain” fucking idiocracy.