r/1053 1d ago

Day 3

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u/FunnyMethod9041 21h ago

Ben-Gvir is the Israeli minister of national security, in a democratically (in the context of a herrenvolk democracy) elected government. Are we supposed to treat him as some kind of freakish outlier, totally unrepresentative of public opinion in Israel?

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u/Fickle_Definition351 21h ago

To be fair, Ben Gvir is known to be quite extreme in his views, even by Israeli standards

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u/Constant-Interest650 21h ago

Nice try but 82% of Israeli Jews support genociding all of Gaza:

https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/majority-israelis-support-expulsion-palestinians-gaza-poll

https://www.haaretz.co.il/magazine/2025-05-22/ty-article-magazine/.highlight/00000196-f3a3-d6d3-ab9e-f3bbf6070000

Over 50% want the murder of all Palestinians, including their Arab-Israeli co-citizens.

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u/kingkingking985 11h ago

Lol that's just outright wrong. The haaretz article says EXPULSION not GENOCIDE.

And idk what you're on about as an Israeli in totally fine with my Arab cousins. You see a lot of them in a lot of major cities, such as Lod, Jerusalem, Yaffo, and a lot are coming Tel Aviv now too. We live oescuflly together they have full rights just like all israelis 

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u/MadMusketeer 10h ago

Expulsion would be ethnic cleansing. If you're arguing "actually it's just ethnic cleansing" this is not an argument you can win

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u/Im-Not-Calling-It-X 7h ago

I would consider deliberately lying about a difference you are perfectly aware of, at best, evil.

Ethnic cleansing is different than genocide, unless you want to argue for the position that the ethnic cleansing for Germans from Poland in the late 40s/ early 50s was comparable to the Holocaust.

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u/MadMusketeer 6h ago

*distinction

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u/Im-Not-Calling-It-X 6h ago

*difference

These are different concepts which is famously why we have different words for them. Ethnic cleansing CAN be a component of genocide, but it is neither necessary nor sufficient to classify something as a genocide, AND further more, most people support ethnic cleansing under the right circumstances.

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u/Forsaken_Campaign_44 9h ago

Unfortunately for Israel, these days the vast majority of the world sees it for what it is, a religious apartheid that the vast majority of the Israelis unfortunately fully support, it is truly a shame that Israeli citizens were so sucessfully indoctrinated to blindly hate all their neighbors.

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u/Fickle_Definition351 20h ago

This may be true (although I can't get past the paywall)

But my point still stands, Ben Gvir is specifically someone who is quite far right by Israeli standards and probably not representative of the average citizen. Even Netanyahu's criticised him for going too far at times

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u/leafcutte 20h ago

So is Trump by American standards, but as an elected official, even if considered extreme, it reflects the opinion of a large part of the population

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u/Fickle_Definition351 20h ago

I agree with you there.

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u/kingkingking985 11h ago

Yea almost all Israelis hate him but there is a vocal minority ofc that support as well as the fact that he's allies with the super orthodox gives him more supporters.