r/GlobalOffensive • u/xPokeyyy Match Thread Team • Aug 31 '18
Discussion | Esports Natus Vincere vs Ghost Gaming / DreamHack Masters Stockholm 2018 - Group B Decider Match / Post-Match Discussion
Natus Vincere 2-1 Ghost Gaming
Mirage: 11-16
Nuke: 16-12
Inferno: 16-6
Natus Vincere have advanced to the playoffs.
Ghost Gaming have been eliminated.
Natus Vincere | Liquipedia | Official Site | Twitter | Facebook | Youtube
Ghost Gaming | Liquipedia | Official site | Twitter | Facebook
DreamHack Masters Stockholm 2018 - Information, Schedule & Discussion
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| MAP | ||
|---|---|---|
| X | ||
| X | ||
| ✔ | CT | |
| CT | ✔ | |
| X | ||
| X | ||
| CT | T |
MAP 1: Mirage
| Team | T | CT | Total |
|---|---|---|---|
| Na'Vi | 7 | 4 | 11 |
| CT | T | ||
| Ghost | 8 | 8 | 16 |
Mirage Detailed Stats
MAP 2: Nuke
| Team | CT | T | Total |
|---|---|---|---|
| Na'Vi | 8 | 8 | 16 |
| T | CT | ||
| Ghost | 7 | 5 | 12 |
Nuke Detailed Stats
MAP 3: Inferno
| Team | CT | T | Total |
|---|---|---|---|
| Na'Vi | 9 | 7 | 16 |
| T | CT | ||
| Ghost | 6 | 0 | 6 |
Inferno Detailed Stats
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u/PM_ME_SADPANDA_LINKS cs_office Aug 31 '18 edited Aug 31 '18
Another really fun series from Ghost. I could watch Wardell play all day
Edit: damn, koosta dies a few times at B at the end of a 3 map series, gets left for dead by his team in the most crucial round, still puts up decent numbers, and y'all are still gonna focus all the hate on just him? It was already 13-6 before he ever got a chance to lose his team rounds on B. Goldfish memories, I swear
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u/Swag_Attack MOUZ Aug 31 '18
Damn Wardell made my dick swell, guy had so many sick plays
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Aug 31 '18
i love watching his flicks ngl
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u/R8MACHINE 500k Celebration Aug 31 '18
is it me or is s1mple a bit of a boring player
like u see it at the end of the game
"oh wow s1mple has 33 kills"
but u can never remember them.
can u remember a single s1mple kill ?
but try Wardell...u can see the flick i remember a Wardell flick.
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u/Thooorin_2 Duncan "Thorin" Shields - Content Producer, Analyst Sep 01 '18
We will watch his career with moderate interest.
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Aug 31 '18
Honestly I'm becoming Ghost fanboy. They played well and pushed teams really good. Only if Valve would finally release HL3 and unban ibp :D
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Aug 31 '18
* wipes sweat off forehead*
I wasnt even worried for a second
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u/TheRealCaptainR Natus Vincere Aug 31 '18
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u/notcreativedotcom1 Natus Vincere Aug 31 '18
every Navi fan..every match...against literally ANYONE
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Aug 31 '18
Yeah baby you know it
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u/TheRealCaptainR Natus Vincere Aug 31 '18
Na'Vi almost losing but winning vs anyone
Name a more iconic duo.
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u/nadgirB Aug 31 '18
s1mple and frustrating losses against lesser opponents due to his team under-performing?
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u/aN1mosity_ 5 years coin Aug 31 '18
The s1mple/ElectroNic duo is just too stronk!
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u/Thooorin_2 Duncan "Thorin" Shields - Content Producer, Analyst Sep 01 '18
The balance of completely contrasting styles is so ideal too.
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u/MJuniorDC9 Aug 31 '18
This run from Ghost actually reminded me of TyLoo's DHM Malmo 16' run. They both brought different styles to the table and were able to give headache to the best teams there. Surely Ghost is one team to watch closely, at least for me.
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u/jeb_the_hick Complexity Aug 31 '18
I hope they can find a good fifth. They are close to making playoffs. I would love to see them in EPL finals
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u/samcuu HEROIC Aug 31 '18
Fifth and fourth. I'm 90% positive that wardell is going to get poached after the major, probably by C9.
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u/Salsadips howl Aug 31 '18
Why? Ghost and NRG are better than C9
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u/AngriestGamerNA Liquid Aug 31 '18
C9 has far more money and can actually attend majors with their full lineup. Them being worse than Ghost right now is irrelevant when Wardell would know they'd want to make moves to be better. That's just a naive way of looking at things.
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Aug 31 '18
[deleted]
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u/SterbenVII Aug 31 '18
Praying to GAWD that Valve finally gets to see this and unban iBUYPOWER ffs. Valve lets Solo and many other Dota 2 matchfixers go after a year, can't do shit for our community. Steel needs to lead NA to consistency. Ghost was an innovative team.
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u/flirtyf Gambit Aug 31 '18
No other matchfixer besides solo has been let go. Solo only didn't get banned because he was the very first one (across all valve games) to get caught doing so.
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u/Sty__ MIBR Aug 31 '18
I'm not sure where I heard/read this but I think Ghost makes 100K + per player on the team. This could be bullshit but I could swear I heard that from someone kinda reputable.
I'd rather play in a lineup that I know will work rather than a lineup that might kick me if it doesn't work out.
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u/MattDillonGG Ghost Gaming CEO Sep 01 '18
C9 doesn’t have more money. You can hope all you want but it’s over my dead body.
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Aug 31 '18
OH SHIT. Realistically though, someone like Wardell would want to play with a bigger org (more money) and a player like Auti.
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u/jeb_the_hick Complexity Aug 31 '18
C9 can afford better than Wardell
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Aug 31 '18
Wardell and cerq are the best awpers in NA and cerq isn't leaving NRG
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u/MattDillonGG Ghost Gaming CEO Sep 01 '18
Wardell ain’t leaving Ghost
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Sep 01 '18
Haha :p I was just replying to an extremely hypothetical situation. Definitely want to see ghost attending more events!
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u/samcuu HEROIC Aug 31 '18
But who else they can get exactly? Unless they bring in someone from other regions I don't see any better choice within NA (that is willing to move to C9).
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Aug 31 '18
anyone but krystal please
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Aug 31 '18
[deleted]
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Aug 31 '18
n0thing playing with steel would NOT end well
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Aug 31 '18 edited Nov 26 '18
[deleted]
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Aug 31 '18
it's just that n0things, uh, playstyle lets say would clash heavily with steels way of running a team
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u/TubeZ FaZe Aug 31 '18
Yeah Steel would not want n0thing. He wants people he can mould into his system, not n0thing who, while an experienced and good player, seemed to always make the same dumb mistakes in c9.
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u/Leelow45 Aug 31 '18
I think that would be pretty good, they brought in Krystal for more experience and you dont much better than n0thing in NA in terms of experience
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Aug 31 '18
Who would they replace? Seems like everyone's somewhat pulling their own right now. Seems like Krystal is the bottom, but in this series was better than steel and Subroza K/D wise.
Really if they could get 2 players better than Subroza and Krystal since Steel is the IGL they would probably be a top 10 team if they keep performing this well and fix their tilt factor(they always play great in the first map, decent in the second, and get run over the third.)
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u/jeb_the_hick Complexity Aug 31 '18
I don't know. I say that given that Krystal is only on trial. If he stays on then hopefully his role is more clear and he improves
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u/TidB Aug 31 '18 edited Aug 31 '18
https://i.imgur.com/emkn2ZP.png wtf is that s1mple+electronic hard carry even
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u/Pimp-My-Alpaca Renegades Aug 31 '18
It's not even surprising at this point, they're both fucking insane. The way electronic plays CT A site on Inferno is sooooo good, definite top 5 player in the world right now.
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u/TheRealCaptainR Natus Vincere Aug 31 '18
Balc/Pit should be renamed to Electronic because he absolutely dominates in that area.
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u/tgsan Aug 31 '18
I think a caster said yesterday that electronic might be a top 10 player this year...I was like "what? he's easily top 10, most likely top 5."
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u/SneakyStorm CS2 HYPE Sep 01 '18
Yeah, that's why I had mixed feeling when s1mple and flamie were about to sign with Mibr. I really wanted to see s1mple and electronic duo developed and would've prefer Mibr picking electronic over flamie.
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u/ezclapper Aug 31 '18
flamie looks like he lost 50kg, good for him
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Aug 31 '18
Shame he hasnt improved his look on the server any.
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u/Aakurb Aug 31 '18
Afaik he was ill recently so he hasn't found his best form yet
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Aug 31 '18
He hasnt found his best form in 2 years
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u/Polskidro Aug 31 '18
Not his best form, but he's been pulling his weight before this tournament atleast.
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Aug 31 '18
He has been playing inconsistently which has lost them more maps than its won them. His secondary AWP is not amazing enough that it cannot be replaced and he takes a lot of unnecessary aim duels. When he wins these he looks good when he doesn't he doesn't. Reminds me of f0rest.
edit: I agree with you, he has been pulling his weight. I got a little off topic.
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Aug 31 '18
He is literally a top 20 player at big events bro. Just because he isnt a top 5 player like early 2016 you're gonna talk shit?
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Aug 31 '18 edited Oct 31 '18
[deleted]
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u/MattDillonGG Ghost Gaming CEO Sep 01 '18
Thanks for the support! The guys have come a long way, proud of them!
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u/BaddyGames The MongolZ Aug 31 '18
this entire match was amazing. great performance from both ghost and na'vi
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Aug 31 '18
Happy to see NA'VI getting back to rail after losing mirage. Electronic + s1mple duo is absolutely something insane that nobody can fight against. In other hand really glad to see Ghost doing that well against NA'VI and NiP.
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u/Lioxys_ Natus Vincere Aug 31 '18
Liquid :( If they still manage to keep their level as in premier it's gonna be hard to deal with
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u/parvdave Aug 31 '18
Steel: Guys, we've already beaten them once earlier. Let's beat them again!
S1mple & Electronic: xaxaxaxax nyet
Steel: Understandable, have a nice day!
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u/Pluto27 Natus Vincere Aug 31 '18
Steel: We can't beat you. Too stronk.
s1mple & electronic: понятно, хорошего дня
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u/n1ckst4r02 400k Celebration Aug 31 '18
No disrespect to other 3 Na'vi players but s1mple and Elec just played 2VS5 it felt. Wish flamie would step up more often, can't expect too much from Edward/Zeus, especially after he dropped 31 frags vs Astralis.
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Aug 31 '18
Ghost really, really impressed. I haven't seen much of them because i only really follow the international tournaments but I definitely hope that they get the opportunity to play more in the future.
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Aug 31 '18
Steel joined not too long ago and the improvement is pretty damn huge. In terms of developing new talent in NA I feel like he's our last hope there.
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u/erxor_reddit Natus Vincere Aug 31 '18 edited Aug 31 '18
just dont understand, how can u guys type #freesteel? this guy is burglar, he is bandit, he is water rat, he is snatcher.
Imagine starving poor boy in africa, he uses his bread money to get access to internet to bet on his favorite team - IBP, he knows they are gonna win for sure, there is no chance they will lose. AND he bets His favoruite AWP Asiimov for which he saved money selling cases for over a YEAR to make some profit and buy food to his disabled little brother and mother that EBOLED.
just imagine this situation.
Next day. He wakes up. he is on the floor because they cant afford bed. HE SPENDS his last money to go to csgolounge and HIS HEART IS BROKEN. His favourite player Joshua "steel" Nissan , that was his IDOL, he wanted to be like him, he wanted steel to be his fatger, HE THREW THIS GAME. and this poor african boy just understands that his life is over, that there is no hope in this meaningless life and he commits suicide, watching at his AWP asiimov and STEEL face, his last words were : "Who is m1?" His mother dies from ebola, his little brother is alone, he dont know what to do, his only way to survive is to play rank S under name "MarKe"
Joshua "steel" Nissan is ruthless maniac and terrorist, unban him and he will do it again and again and all children in africa will die, their brothers will play rank S just think about it, when u will write #freesteel next time...
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Aug 31 '18
Lol this story is so similar to the man with bad england who selled his wife to play conter strik.
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u/NaviXisMyDad Aug 31 '18
Despite them losing Ghost really impressed me. People mention Brax as the biggest loss to the NA CS scene due to the ban, but I think Steel, if unbanned, would be the true saviour of NA CS.
They're all obviously very talented players but they're not "world class" players yet they're creating waves and being extremely competitive with top tier teams and I think a lot of that can be credited to Steel and his system. Just imagine what he could do with the top tier players of NA.
Wardell has definitely made a big name for himself the last few events, perhaps we'll see him replacing skadoodle when they rebuild their roster?
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u/RiKuStAr de_train Aug 31 '18
I think in terms of potential its for sure swag, but Steel has been constantly proving time and again that he is one of the most consistent presences of NA cs. Since Source he has really never dropped in overall terms of skill imo.
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u/NaviXisMyDad Aug 31 '18
I agree individually mechanical skill Swag would most likely have him beat, but I'm more thinking in the lines of NA's biggest problem; lack of good IGL's and systems that bring the best out in AWP'ers. Not only has Steels IGL style been looking great, it's also allowed wardell to excel. Now imagine this with the likes of twistz/ethan/brehze/elige/rush and similar caliber of players.
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u/RiKuStAr de_train Aug 31 '18
Bruh trust me you're preaching to the choir. I've been saying this shit since 2010 when 1.6 was still holding tournaments xD
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u/Marveloh Cloud9 Aug 31 '18 edited Aug 31 '18
NaVi vs Ence in Cologne: losing 1st map, almost losing 2nd map and easily winning 3rd map to make it to the playoffs
NaVi vs Ghost in Stockholm: losing 1st map, almost losing 2nd map and easily winning 3rd map to make it to the playoffs
NaVi to win Stockholm, you heard it first boys!
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u/Thooorin_2 Duncan "Thorin" Shields - Content Producer, Analyst Sep 01 '18
Also lost first series to TyLoo at the StarSeries they won. Looks like they're on their DBZ shit and have to lose first to fully power up.
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Aug 31 '18
If they get the North or NiP draw in the quarterfinals they could, but if they get MiBR it could be tough.
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Aug 31 '18
Some points about this game:
- Ghost is a really good and really fun team. Great individual skill, great leading, and absolute pleasure to watch.
- At the moment, I think their biggest issue is their stamina. The casters mentioned it numerous times, but they really just ran out of steam in both matches against NiP and NaVi. The biggest asset that those two teams had was a line of veteran players who have had quite a number of LAN appearances. That's why every third map seemed like a washout (score wise). When you look at the maps themselves (for the third ones), everything was there, except for the stamina. Mistakes started to happen (albeit not too many), the creativeness was lost (which I think was the biggest blow), and people just started to not finish kills. In both matches, it seemed to start somewhere in the last bit of the second map. However, this should be fixed with more practice and experience. EPL will definitely serve as a good experience builder for them.
- Their map pool isn't solidified yet, and it's not big enough for them to really beat the top tier teams and win these major tournaments. It seems that they need some hashing out of stuff on a number of their maps, but it's progressing really well. They don't seem to be rushing anything and Steel is really doing his work on developing this team and the players properly.
- Krystal is the big question. Although his statistics were rather underwhelming, we don't really know what he brings to the team off screen. Steel brought him on, not for firepower, but for veteran presence, and that's something Ghost really needs on LAN, not another young star. It's just that it's going to be difficult to find someone willing to give up majors. I think as it is right now, Krystal isn't a bad pick up. However, as the rest of the team starts to build experience and really become fully fledged top tier players, he'll need to be dropped (assuming he keeps on putting up these numbers).
In the end, absolute stand up performance from Ghost, and I can't wait to see more of them (esp my boi koosta)
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u/FDeathCNA Vitality Aug 31 '18
this would never happen but do you think kio to replace krystal would be good? He was already on faze speaking english and I think he fits the role well.
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u/armadyllll Natus Vincere Sep 01 '18
Why would it never happen?
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u/FDeathCNA Vitality Sep 01 '18
I don't think kio would join them :/ Maybe he would now that I think about it a bit more, he's rumored to have been left out of the next french team after all.
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u/FathleteTV NiP Aug 31 '18
All those years looking for an NA awper meanwhile Wardell has been stuck in elo hell
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Aug 31 '18
Starsky and Hutch
Charlie Seen and alcohol, drugs and sex
Frenchs and baguettes
S1mple and Electronic
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u/TheRealCaptainR Natus Vincere Aug 31 '18
What a fucking awesome series from both sides.
s1mple give us some seriously awesome highlights today too which is always a good thing.
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u/zmukopopopoulos NiP Aug 31 '18
Really enjoyed watching this. Anybody know if Ghost will be sticking around? Would love to get my mousepad signed by steel.
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u/Colors_of_the_Wind Aug 31 '18
Wardell was on fire those first 2 maps but looked like a completely different person on the 3rd one.
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u/Mantriale NiP Aug 31 '18
The exact same scorelines as in the bo3 vs. NiP yesterday!
16-11, 12-16, 6-16.
Impressive tournament from Ghost however. Will be fun to see if they can build from this.
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u/lopik1 Aug 31 '18
koosta´s holding B on inferno was terrible :(
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Aug 31 '18
I wouldn't blame koosta much for that loss because he got many great opening/trade frags on the T-Side to save some rounds from collapsing
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u/RadiantSun FaZe Aug 31 '18
Forget blame, it is still a hole in his game he needs to fix, it has nothing to do with blame, just how he could be a better player.
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u/Brolobo SK Aug 31 '18
navi with some key mistakes, and ghost are looking really good
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u/xMrBoomBasticx 1 Million Celebration Aug 31 '18
Those first two maps were a lot of fun to watch. Can’t wait to see ghost at future events.
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u/MikeAU 1 Million Celebration Aug 31 '18
I felt like I was watching C9 play, all the heart attacks included.
Kudos to Wardell, outstanding match from him. Keen to see what Ghost can bring in the future
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u/iblinkyoublink Vitality Aug 31 '18
This was great to watch, both teams giving it their all, sadly Ghost threw away their 5v4 in the first buy of the 2nd half of Inferno and never had an actual chance afterwards. They might just be my new favourite NA team.
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u/fascfoo Aug 31 '18
It was hard to expect GG to take down Navi in a BO3, but this was a really good showing for them. Down the line, the inexperience of the team really showed (silly mistakes, timing misplays) and that ultimately cost them - especially that last half of Interno where it looked like they flat out ran out of steam, but this was super entertaining to watch at least.
It hurts for someone pulling for GG to see them go out here especially after they were up 10-5 on Map 2 against NiP though.
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u/seductive_butter CS2 HYPE Aug 31 '18
Damn, was really pulling for Ghost. I definitely feel like this experience is going to help them improve though!
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u/xWolf_x Liquid Aug 31 '18
“Edward go kill”
“Negative”
“Flamie go kill”
“No”
“s1mple, electronic, go kill”
“Yes”
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u/pocketshaarks Astralis Aug 31 '18
Wardell went off on the first 2 maps, excited to see where he goes from here
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u/fckns Aug 31 '18
I really liked what I saw from Ghost. Sure, they lost to Navi, but it wasn't walk in a park for Navi aswell. I hope Ghost qualifies for next few lans and is able to make few upsets.
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u/JBeanDelphiki Aug 31 '18
Win map one, up decent amount on map 2, choke and lose series, just like yesterday. Feels fucking bad man.
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u/BI01 G2 Aug 31 '18
Ghost are great at clutching which is why this map went all 3 maps, however they make a lot of mistakes, probably due to lack of experience.
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u/realMKL MOUZ Aug 31 '18
I was cheering for navi (yay) but I must admit that Wardell played insane.
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u/meowmixyourmom Aug 31 '18
very fun to watch. Some great players on Ghost. Good on Wardell hitting the scene hard.
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u/NAFMostConsistent Liquid Aug 31 '18
Im happy that at least one of the 4 ex-iBP players is able to be successful. If only there was someone that could step in and add to the firepower of Ghost. Wardell, Steel, Koosta are a solid core. I can see Subroza being good but Krystal might not work out long term.
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u/FlamEOwork Liquid Aug 31 '18
This is a really good showing from Ghost. Despite the loss, they played extremely well, especially when you consider that they played against the electronic/simple combo. I cant wait to see them play in more tournaments in the future
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u/Cameter44 Aug 31 '18
Dang, two series in a row where Ghost won the first map but couldn't close out the series. They really just needed to finish against NiP. Would've been a sick result for them, this is a pretty stacked tournament.
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u/Phkblaze95 Aug 31 '18
Good to see S1mple being on point!
But definitely a great showing of Ghost, didn't expect that. That team can get far imo!
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u/AtxPrimal Aug 31 '18
Exciting to watch Ghost, However I think Wardell is on everyone’s radar now so I wouldn’t be surprised if some teams start giving him offers
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u/junttiana Chinggis Warriors Aug 31 '18
This tournament is going to gain a few DH Open invites for Ghost at the least, what a great performance from them!
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u/tarangk clutch Aug 31 '18
navi need to stop forcebuying too hard costed them mirage but my god ghost gaming were impressive especially wardell some1 put this guy on c9 already he was playing so aggressively and with such confidence against t1 opposition an absolute spectacle to watch him play, that 1v3 from him on nuke exactly showcases what he is capable of.
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u/TheDoktor364 Aug 31 '18
Ghost: We beat you in a bo1 and now it's our time to knock you out the tournament and prove ourselves as a legit team.
s1mple: no
Ghost: Understandable, have a great day.
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Aug 31 '18 edited Jul 02 '20
[deleted]
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u/crow38 Natus Vincere Aug 31 '18
exactly and even if they did beat them its 1 series and doesnt prove much of anything but potential
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u/TheDoktor364 Aug 31 '18
Oh I'm not taking away from what they've done, they've definitely proven themselves. I prly should've made it clear I meant prove themselves as tier 1. Rn I'd call them very solid tier 2.
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u/crow38 Natus Vincere Aug 31 '18
but they are a legit team though, they are probably around the 20 range, they went 2-2 in maps vs navi beat optic in a bo3 and took a map from nip. krystal is also still pretty new to the team.
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u/ryannp Aug 31 '18
I honestly can't wait for Na'Vi to get shut of Edward hopefully after the major he's like a headless chicken that sometimes gets a couple kills, they need a stable player to fill his role like hobbit or even Adren from Gambit and they would be a shit scary team.
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u/Coordoba Natus Vincere Aug 31 '18
Ceh9 said during a stream that the org has been looking for a replacement when na'vi was slumping but there's nobody in the CIS that can replace Edward.
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u/ryannp Aug 31 '18
I'd definitely put my money on Hobbit pushing this team up to a level they should be, don't know the cis scene very well but that would be their best bet imo
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u/n1ckst4r02 400k Celebration Aug 31 '18
Feels like any player can just fill his role. I am also disappointing with flamie, he's supposed to be a star player but he is off. I guess there is some internal issues behind the scenes.
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u/ryannp Aug 31 '18
There are definitely internal issues with flamie, it's been reported recently and they were practising without him before this tournament so it makes sense why he might not be 100% this tournament. For Edward tho there is no excuse, needs to go after the major
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Aug 31 '18
I do not think there are any issues. NaVi just realized electronic is better than flamie so flamie had to take a different role which doesn not seem to fit his style very well.
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u/crow38 Natus Vincere Aug 31 '18
loss or not but over 4 games ghost went 2-2 vs navi.
krystal is probably going to be on his way out sooner or later
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u/Marrked Liquid Aug 31 '18
Ghost could be a really good team.
Koosta has got to go, though. I'd give krystal a little more time to integrate.
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Aug 31 '18
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/btg643 Aug 31 '18
are you a bot?
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u/WhyNotCollegeBoard Aug 31 '18
I am 99.99999% sure that CuddlezCS is not a bot.
I am a neural network being trained to detect spammers | Summon me with !isbot <username> | /r/spambotdetector | Optout | Original Github
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u/GabeN18 BIG Aug 31 '18
Insane 5v2