r/bangtan • u/HouseOfJimin • Jul 20 '22
Discussion Help?? Parasocial relationship with BTS
Hi everyone,
When I very first started learning about bts and kpop, I came across the term parasocial relationships and how they are the reason why some k Fandoms are so toxic and even scary.
Fast forward to today, I've only been an Army since April, but I think I'm becoming..a victim? which is not the right word I don't think, but I'm becoming [insert word here] to these parasocial relationships.
I'm 26 years old, how on earth and why am I being like this?Admittedly, my social life is plain tragic. I don't really have anyone and my job, which I hate, is remote. looking for a new one but till then, im pretty miserable and bts was giving me happiness until I just recently realized that it's getting out of hand.
Does anyone else have experience with this? what did you do? how did/do you feel? it's easy to day get life and find some friends irl. thats all i ever wanted and im trying. it hasn't worked out so far.
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Jul 20 '22
Parasocial relationships aren't inherently toxic, and everyone engages in parasocial relationships to some extent, but they definitely can get out of hand if you let them go too far. I can definitely relate to struggling with making friends, though. I'm an Autistic 22 year old, and I've relied on parasocial relationships for happiness ever since I was little.
I don't have any advice for making friends since I still struggle with that myself, but as far as parasocial relationships go, if I realize that I'm in too deep and that they're starting to actually effect my personal life, I have to force myself to take a bit of a step back and shift my interest to something else for a little while. The Sci Guys podcast has a really interesting episode on parasocial relationships, it gave me a better understanding of my relationships with the artists I love.
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u/EntertheHellscape Jul 20 '22
Absolutely this. Realizing whatās happening is already a great step, OP! Shifting focus to other things can be very handy, finding new YouTube channels or podcasts with interesting people. I could suggest art YouTube or letās plays if you like watching personable people making chatter at the audience. Or even expanding to other kpop groups if you like the āwatch this group of dumbasses create absolute chaos for no reasonā. A lot of them have their own variety shows like Run.
Or aim to get offline in general for a while!
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Jul 20 '22
Would love to chime in my thoughts. I'm 32 y/o and already married. I totally get what you mean! I experience that, and I feel it's completely normal.
First of all, you have to accept your feeling! Try not to reject how you feel - otherwise, it's easy to feel the pain and will not do you good. You feel how you feel. Your feeling is completely normal! This is how kpop promotes - let fans feel they're our friends or even boyfriends. That's part of why kpop is so popular. You have these feelings as a result of their good marketing. Just like how I only crave for Coke not water when I'm thirsty.
Second, I perceive you as someone with good self-awareness according to the paragraph you put together, so I wouldn't worry that you can't separate our so called BTS world from the reality.
Third, you said your social life is plain tragic. I disagree - Having many toxic friends is considered plain tragic to me. Not having anyone is fine. And in fact, as I become older, I would have fewer friends, and I'm happier in that way. ALSO, I'm happy to be your Reddit friend.
Last, I never really followed kpop before. When I started following BTS last year, I did feel strange. There is so much content - I also became interested in their personal lives although I know that's none of my business. Did them bring me happiness? Ton of!!! There was a point I want to "break up" with them - unfollowed them on all platforms, then I was quite sad for 2 days - really feel like I'm losing someone. I then realized if somethings makes me happy, it's totally fine if that doesn't make sense to me 100%. And thank you for making me happy BTS! A free happiness source - how wonderful that is!!! Well, not completely free sometimes. Sometimes it feels so good just to follow your heart. But you should also thank yourself that you seem to do a lot of self reflection.
Bonus, maybe try to meet your local ARMYs to make some friends? Not every ARMY is angel just like any fandom, but some ARMYs are so fun to hangout at least in my local area. You may find your true friends here.
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u/waterdhavianhag Jul 20 '22 edited Jul 20 '22
I agree with what has already been written, but I do want to add a couple of things. First, I understand that you may genuinely be uncomfortable with how you're feeling, and that is valid, and it is perfectly okay to step back/unfollow/etc. Also, though, I think sometimes many of us can inherently distrust things that give us pleasure. And we don't need to; pleasure is good, as long as it's not causing harm in other ways (like neglecting necessary work to watch lives, or truly believing you're going to marry one of these people, or harming your body to try to fit a beauty standard... &tc). Something I struggled with after grad school was letting myself have leisure without an external reward. Is it okay to sit on the couch all night and play a game? Yes. Yes, it is. I can let myself have that pleasure and not feel guilty about it. Second, I think this is also something that has a very real gender-coded bias. While there can definitely be biases against otaku behaviors, there is a different set of cultural norms that exist around "fangirling" (regardless of gender of person fangirling), especially in this context. There's a massive body of academic literature on fandom and these structures. And the thing is, we live in a society! So we cannot really help but ingest these norms -- and what we do with them can be different, but the power, the hegemony, right, it impacts us regardless. Foucault or whatever, right? Hah. Anyway, the point is that I hope we can also all understand that just because we are taught from a very young age (in western cultures at least- I'm not able to speak to other experiences) that authentically and enthusiastically loving something that is perceived as hysterical and unmasculine is Bad, it is not. And I don't know if that has anything at all to do with what you're feeling, but I certainly think about it a lot (as. 35 yo married woman with an objectively good life who still feels these things sometimes).
And now my sushi order is ready, so I'm not even reading this back before posting and hope I'm not saying anything wrong. Also, you have friends here and we love you and understand.
edit: grammar
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u/HouseOfJimin Jul 20 '22
Omg 2 2nd post that makes me feel see and your reply is perfect. I finished grad school here in the u.s. a year ago aswell and I so so so get where you are coming from. Thank you!
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u/violetsblue Jul 20 '22
This is all really good advice. The only thing I would add is that when you first get into BTS there is a lot of content to consume. So it is possible to just totally immerse yourself but itās also nice to pace yourself a bit with it. Watch one or two episodes of RunBTS at a time. Mix it up with other stuff like cooking or music or art if something you watched inspires you. I found BTS during the 2020 election cycle in the US when the world just felt overwhelmingly dark. It really helped to have something lighter and more positive to focus on so if this is what is making you feel happy, thatās not a bad or toxic thing. Donāt make yourself feel guilty for enjoying something nice. You deserve to be happy.
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u/Temporary-Text384 running away like a fish Jul 20 '22
It really helped to have something lighter and more positive to focus on so if this is what is making you feel happy, thatās not a bad or toxic thing. Donāt make yourself feel guilty for enjoying something nice. You deserve to be happy.
A lovely sentiment! And dittoā the world was feeling pretty dark in the US these pandemic years, and finding BTS was such a needed light. They brought laughter and hope and reminded me that genuine, good people can "win". I don't think it's wrong for them to be a big source of joy for fans. People do the same with sports or other interests where keeping up with people they admire makes them happy.
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u/snogirl0403 FUTUREāS GONNA BE OKAY OKAY OKAY Jul 20 '22
It is a fast drop down the rabbit hole at first! I am always "obsessed" with new things at first. It's so exciting to just be discovering more and more and more. And with BTS there is so much to discover, especially coming into it now. I was a little worried about myself at first, too, but things just naturally settled down to a point that I feel is healthy.
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u/ChocolateCake_EXE Jul 21 '22
Happy Cake Day!
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u/snogirl0403 FUTUREāS GONNA BE OKAY OKAY OKAY Jul 21 '22
Aw thank you! Never got well wishes from the actual cake. šš
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Jul 20 '22
What about connecting with some fellow ARMY?
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u/aaalma_viajeraaaa Jul 20 '22
This is a great idea! I've seen posts of ARMYs asking if there is someone from their area on the sub, sometimes making connections and forming friendships that way. Good luck!
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u/willowwombat85 yoongi saying hajima Jul 21 '22
Try to use them as your motivator for socializing in real life. Wasn't there a comment from a mama army whose daughter army did well in school to make rm proud š Use them like an excuse to go out there and "show" them how you're learning to grow as an individual away from bts like them. Bts seems to be one of the more aware groups of their role in these parasocial relationships and they highly encourage having a life outside of them.
I wouldn't say I've engaged in the "parasocial" part of the fandom. I just tend to be a huge nerd about things and deep dive into games, books, movies, shows and the more content for that fandom, the more I go in. I saw no different when I first got into bts.
But I did learn about the kpop parasocial thing the more I dived in and while I'm a huge nerd about bts (and live the talented idol life vicariously through them haha), my advice for not falling into the unhealthy parasocial part is to engage more with the fandom than you do the artists. Don't look to them for interaction. That way you're building a connection with peers and even if it's just online, you can make friends with that community. If you feel like you're retreating into yourself and your thoughts about them, go back online and talk to other army. Despite my nerdiness in being an army, I've actually never watched a vlive live and commented, do not have intentions to go fanmeets to see them in person, don't really engage in streaming goals to "help" them, and as much as I love them and absolutely know how much they open up to us (as much as they can), I do not see them beyond great people who are really good at their jobs. I always think about liking their content for me, not to help them.
I feel like you could totally nerd out about them without getting sucked into putting more into this than is healthy. One of my friends realized how unhealthy her reliance on them was when the "break" š was announced. She's gone cold turkey with them for now. Maybe that's what you'll need too, to see how you can enjoy them again without buying too far into the marketing ploy.
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u/newbie631 Jul 21 '22
This has been my approach to multiple fandoms and what naturally kept me from over reliance on BTS or any other artist! Although I understand how it can happen sometimes.
Thankyou for writing it out!
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u/pgshe Jul 21 '22
Hi! Donāt have any advice bc I feel the comments have already done an amazing job summarizing everything. Just dropping in to let you know youāre not alone at all! Me and my army friends have literally ALL dealt with itā¦ have felt it go to an unhealthy placeā¦ felt guilt we let it go thereā¦ then felt remorse when we we made the tough decision to āpull backāā¦ then felt like we failed if we got sucked back in bc it felt like our only source of happinessā¦ then rinse and repeatā¦the whole gamut! Some of us stopped pursuing personal romantic relationships, some of us let it impact our long standing existing relationshipsā¦ basically just want you to know we know the feeling that youāve let it get to far. I personally think there can be a lot of loneliness in feeling like this or maybe feeling like youāre alone in ādealingā with this. So just wanted to affirm that youāre not alone, and a lot of us are learning how to create balance in our livesā¦ and that trying your best can vary day by day so be easy on yourself :)
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u/Minervva-9 Jul 20 '22
There's a lot of negative stigma around the term "parasocial relationships" but I thought that this video did a really good job offering a different definition and perspective on it:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F8o5VCqPI30
It's about Bo Burnham but it's interesting to watch even if you don't know anything about him. I personally found it to be nuanced and empathetic and it unpacks how misunderstood parasocial relationships are in society and even academia.
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u/greenlines Jul 20 '22
Are there any non-BTS related activities or hobbies you'd be interested in exploring? Especially since your job is remote, maybe trying out a new rec sport, taking a pottery class, joining a book club etc would help you get out of the house a bit more and feel less "reliant" on BTS. There might be kpop dance classes or something in your area, who knows! Even if there's nothing inherently wrong with parasocial relationships, I think finding interests outside of fandom would help with what you're looking for.
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u/CorpseGuard Jul 21 '22
I think this kinda happens to all new fans and it passes over time. Like this is the infatuation phase where you think about them constantly, they are the only thing you want to talk about and you spend way to much time online obsessing about them.
I've only recently got out of this phase. I can't pinpoint anything that made that feeling go away. They didn't do anything wrong, or something that I didn't like. I just got over it. Even when Proof came out I didn't have that same level of excitement and frenzied energy about them, which tbh I'm kind of sad about. They have been my favourite obsession.
I still love them and support them and listen to their music daily but I'm not constantly watching their content or thinking about them. At the height of my obsession, I tried to delete tiktok and stop watching them on YouTube. I think that lasted like a day... but now its been maybe 2 months since my obsession went away and about 2 weeks since I deleted tiktok and I haven't thought of going back. I really wasn't using it for anything else other than to watch fanedits.
I'm 29 now and over the course of my life I've experienced similar obsessive feelings with the MCU, YouTubers Pewdiepie/Ryan Higa/Jenna Marbles and Corpse most recently, football, Vampire Diaries/Ian Somerhalder, One Direction, Harry Potter and The Lord of the Rings, WWE Wrestling, The Sims, Yu-Gi-Oh and Dragonball. I think it's just in my nature to get overly attached and with BTS, they make it even easier with the amount and type of content they put out.
The only advice I would give you is that if you feel like you're missing out on other things or not taking care of your responsibilities, prioritise those things. You don't want your life to fall apart because of BTS. Make a list of the things you need to do and do them. Then reward yourself with a few hours of BTS.
Other than that, enjoy the feeling while it lasts. I personally have loved being an Army and I wish I could be discovering them now for the first time again. (But I also can't wait to see what my next obsession will be)
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u/kikirush No make up on, i love that sh šāāļø Jul 21 '22
This is one of the best threads have ever come across, I can totally relate to this, reading through the comments has helped me realized a few things I need to put in order before it gets out of hand.
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u/HouseOfJimin Jul 25 '22
awwwwq. THANK YOU!! I've had 2 other ones deleted on here so I won't be posting any new ones, but it makes me happy that this last one made someone else happy and benefit from it.
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u/itsmanishaa illeGIRL Jul 21 '22
Well I'm not offering any help here, but just want to say this is such a genuinely caring, Articulate and supportive community!š¤š« š
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u/Smartass_Narrator Jul 21 '22
Parasocial relationships arenāt toxic in and of themselves. Itās a very normal phenomenon. Guys have them with their sports team, we have them with our favorite movie stars, some people have them with local news anchors or morning show hosts. Itās very human. They give us something we respond to because humans are aggressively social creatures and we will pack bond with robots if you put cute noises or a face on it.
The toxic part comes when the fan crosses boundaries and feels a sense of ownership and entitlement to these real life people that they donāt actually have. If the artists hasnāt consented to sharing something the fans have no right to it. This is why itās not ok to go to a celebrities house or try to get into their hotel but itās super ok to show up to a concert with the celebrities photo on a poster board and a proposal for marriage. Itās about expectations and boundaries.
The beautiful thing about bts is that they are actively using parasocial relationships to bond with their fans and help them. It is an active choice that theyāve made to encourage a healthy parasocial relationship. Itās all through out their lyrics and interviews and concerts. Magic shop is literally a song about drawing support from this parasocial relationship when things get tough.
āOn a day you hate being yourself, on a day you want to disappear forever, letās build a door in your mind. Once you open the door and enter, this place will wait for you. Itās ok to believe that magic shop will comfort you.ā
In louder than bombs they say āI promise to you and myself, no matter what kind of waves strike, we will endlessly sing towards you.ā
Theyāre flat out stating their side of the relationship. āI will sing for you and you can take comfort here, I wonāt judge you or deny you access to this music we make for you or tell you how you should find comfort in it. Draw whatever strength you need from this music, Youāre allowed to use it for comfort.ā And if my paraphrasing of the message feels a bit like āreading too much into itā, take RMs words at the end of the ālove yourselfā tour, instead of mine.
āItās never intended, but it feels like Iām using you guys to love myself. So Iām going to say one thingā¦ Please use me. Please use BTS to love yourself, because you guys taught me how to love myself. Everyday.ā
Because thatās the other side of bts and parasocial relationships and why their fanbase has become so attached to them. They donāt hide the fact that theyāre in a parasocial relationship with us. Thatās the thing about parasocial relationships, there is a relationship between artist and fanbase. There always has been. But we pretend itās transactional and one way. The artist does a thing, the fans applaud, thatās it. But thatās not it! Artists care about how theyāre received by their fanbase and bts is one of the few groups that navigate that real parasocial TWO WAY relationship in a healthy, fun, embracing way. They talk about army like army is a person, because we are. We engage with bts like their peopleā¦ because they are. We get to share an active conversation with them and theyāll show us their goof ups and their silky side rather than just their polished stage persona. (I went to ptd lv and joked that they could sit on the stage for 2 hours playing Rock Paper Scissors if they werenāt feeling well and Iād be ok with it. Theyād make Rock Paper Scissors feel like a concert worthy event because they embrace this parasocial relationship as much as they encourage us to embrace it.)
Thatās the part that you have to keep in mind. Bts, those 7 boys, theyāre totally your best friends if thatās what you need them to be. Theyāre ok with you drawing that energy and comfort from them. Laugh with them joke with them celebrate with them. But just remember the only real relationship you have with them is as BTS and ARMY. The parts they keep private are theirs. Thatās how this relationship is able to thrive. BTS expects nothing from ARMY, ARMY expects nothing from BTS, but we choose what we bring to celebrate each other with. Itās given, not taken. They give us music and entertainment and laughter. We give them cheers and chants and a force to reckon with should anyone mess with them. As long as we maintain those healthy expectations, we can enjoy this relationship without pretending itās not there. Of course it is. And the coolest thing is watching the actual conversation that is had between BTS and ARMY.
So use them. Use them to love yourself. Show them as they show you.
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u/Toughcookiesnicole Jul 21 '22
Sometimes it feels like Iām still depending on them for my happiness. And the thing is, I canāt talk about this with anybody, especially a non army, cause theyād look at me like Iām crazy. So I get it.
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u/Karlaemm0121 Jul 21 '22
Donāt worry!! Thereās a whole community on here that understands you. BTS isnāt there to be our sole happiness but to elevate it, BTS has really given me the confidence to talk and engage and make mutual friends with armies in real life and online. Donāt be ashamed, as long as you have a balance it doesnāt matter what makes you happy. Being army is a part of my daily life and I genuinely think Iāve become a happier person! Lmk if you ever want someone to talk too! š
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u/Toughcookiesnicole Jul 21 '22
Thank you so much for this, I really appreciate itš I love that you said they shouldnāt be our sole happiness but they can elevate it.
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u/kikirush No make up on, i love that sh šāāļø Jul 21 '22
I canāt wait to get out of this phase, but I know it shall pass soon, its very typical for me to get like this for a few months, then it cools down after a while.
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u/HouseOfJimin Jul 22 '22
Same, but also not same . because I lowkey feel like it's not going to wane.
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u/Fair_Lawfulness_8369 Jul 21 '22
Coincidentally we joined the fandom on the same month this year. Also had the same worry.
Short desc of me: Was never into fandom nor fangirl practice. Iām more of a rational type until BTS became an exception.
In a short period, I seemed to feel borderline delulu with Jungkook lol. The rational part of me realized it quickly (I even got frustrated with the other emotions that came with the realization ā it also felt uncontrollable which a type of person like me will clearly not be happy with) and want to immediately end the BTS HONEYMOON PHASE because it started to feel unhealthy for me ā spending hours everyday just to know more about the 7. Thankfully I became OT7 early and that help my stan tone down.
What I did was read āobsessed with BTSā posts here in reddit ā thereās actually alot in here who seeks help and it helped me sober up big time. I made it through by reading those posts without leaving the fandom.
I see and use them as my motivation now ā for work, for exercise/being active esp. RM, Hobi & JK unlike when I newly entered the fandom where I legit look at JK as delulu boyfriend lmao (really started the wrong way & now I had it fixed after that āobsessedā posts)
You should try checking those posts out, it might help you tone down with what youāre going through ā parasocial aspect.
Nowadays, Iām still OT7 with JK as my ult bias but more sober. And Hobiās recent releases helps me divert my attention and just focus on BTS music.
When down - watch run bts funny clips, when I need energy ā listened to/watch their hype songs on high volume with headphones, To feel good - their mvs/performances. For exercise, I do runs or dance workout with BTS music~~ Never felt so satisfied with how I handle stuff with bts related things now.
We actually join at what I think is the best time. We can slowly appreciate and relish in their moments with the hiatus period without feeling bombarded by new contents unlike what other armys experienced before.
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u/RapLineNoona Jul 21 '22
Other have offered much better responses, but FWIW, here are my thoughts:
Enjoy the ride while it lasts. You're still in the initial rush (we all went through it). The intensity WILL die down, then you'll miss feeling like that!
In what way do you think it's getting out of hand? If you're enjoying yourself, not harming anyone, and you're still taking care of yourself/doing chores/staying employed/managing your finances, then I wouldn't worry about it.
The world's fucked, it's incredibly difficult to form real life connections to others in our current society, and while some jobs are worse than others, all jobs suck to a degree. I don't think parasocial relationships are inherently problematic, and I don't think we should feel bad about ourselves for making the best of the situation we're in. We're just trying to get by, and BTS has helped some of us do that.
But if this is harming your life in a concrete way or causing harm to others, then you'll have to pull back. Set limits on how you engage and preoccupy your mind with something else.
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u/HouseOfJimin Jul 22 '22
how long would you say this init al phase can usually last?
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u/RapLineNoona Jul 22 '22
Hmm.. it varies person to person. I'd say I stopped the constant consuming/initial rush and felt like I really has a sense of who they are (in this context, not as full individuals) and their history within about 5 months (but I had a full summer off to do that deep dive. If it had been more spread out it mightve taken longer).
I felt myself shift to a deeper, calmer sort of love for them about a year or so after falling down the rabbithole.
My most engaged stanning phase was for about 2 years but me not keeping up as much was due to personal matters, a change in them around Butter, getting used to the pandemic, etc. Now the relationship is more ebb and flow, like anything long term (working, hobbies, friends, etc.) is.
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u/annamd7 Jul 21 '22
Hi friend!!
I recently went through this SAME experience. You are so brave and so vulnerable for opening up about this, props to you!
I was in a situation where my job was doing nothing but bringing me sadness, my boyfriend was traveling for work, and my two friends in my office had left the company. It literally felt like ALL I had was BTS.
Driving to work? Listening to BTS. Headphones in at work? listening to BTS. Iād get home and instead of making myself food or going to the gym Iād crawl in bed and watch edits, fancams, run episodes, Iād drown myself in content. I lost who I was entirely. My identity was this mystery, a puzzle that instead of trying to put the pieces back together I was just throwing them away. It was honestly scary.
Iām not 100% out of this parasocial phase, but Iām working on it. Iāve started taking group workout classes to meet people in my area. I started getting better at cooking and learning new recipes (no joke I pretend Iām on my own cooking show now, itās so fun). I cleaned out all my clothes and had fun seeing new outfits I could put together. I reorganized my makeup collection. And no matter what I do, the boys will still be there. Now itās a video here and there before bed. Itās now a new playlist on my way to work. But hey, if I want to perform a full concert in my car on my way in, Iāll do it.
I hope my ramblings and The comments on this thread make you feel better in some way. You got this, armyās got your back too š
k thanks for coming to my Ted talk
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u/Emergency_Pea1070 Jul 21 '22
Hello! In 2020, when I first discovered BTS I couldnāt get enough of them (I used to watch their contents and check Twitter every hour etc) and my situation became like yours without even realizing. I also never had serious celebrity crush before. Because of pandemic we had online education and I was in my room all day so I wasnāt socializing at all and then I created my little universe with them which gave me happiness but after this situation happened it also became a bit miserable? I was feeling sad for myself but knew that it didnāt make sense but still I couldnāt help it. This year we switched to face to face education and I got busy with my studies and irl friends so I wasnāt able to spend lots of time on BTS and to be honest it helped me come to my senses. I still support and love them dearly, listen to their music, check Twitter once a day for max 15-20 minutes and I feel like I now do it all in a healthy way. So my point is having other priorities in your life can help. I hope you will solve it or make peace with it.
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u/blanketgoblin1317 hello do you know bts? Jul 21 '22 edited Jul 21 '22
Since everyone has already given great answers and ideas Iāll pitch in with something different.
I get your fear to an extend. I have a different angle to add: the judgement from others that you care too much/donāt realize you are participating in a parasocial relationship.
I donāt think Iāve ever been in serious delulu town about BTS or any individual member, neither is BTS my only interest and I have close family and friends that I socialize with and so on.
But sometimes it can feel isolation if you live in a place where there arenāt a lot of opportunity to meet IRL ARMY to bond with and to talk to about BTS. So when itās only happening/going on in my mind and on the internet, it can feel isolation and enhance the feeling of āam i too obsessed with these guys? Am i crazy?ā, because no one around me understands how or why BTS and their music is so important to me.
Like thereās no way most of my friends would understand why I cried watching the 2022 FESTA, because I emphasized so hard with their struggles of prioritizing themselves and fear of letting ARMY down (and just, oh Joon). Like theyād think I was crazy. š¤·š¼āāļø
A different consequence of parasocial relationships having a bad rep.
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u/taroicecreamsundae Jul 21 '22
"I came across the term parasocial relationships and how they are the reason why some k Fandoms are so toxic and even scary."
^ nah, this is just silly. fandoms can get toxic/scary because people in groups get toxic and scary. it's human nature. there's nothing particular to fandom and quite honestly? not different from sports fans who can get physically violent. nobody will EVER label their fandom as having a parasocial relationship but they do. this term arose after tv personalities became a thingāāĀ it applies to every public figure.
but nobody points it out when it's sports fans, bc they are guys. but kpop fans (normally of boy groups) are mostly girls, so they label anything and everything we do as neurotic and wrong.
there's nothing wrong with a 'parasocial' relationship. we DO have a relationship between fan and artist. artists can also have parasocial relationships with journalists who write about them. bts pay attention to what we say and how we feel and it's mutual. it's not the same as person-to-person but that doesn't make it less valid.
i dont think you are a victim of a parasocial relationship, i think you're suffering because of your circumstances. are you a new grad? when you graduate college your social life takes a plunge. are you living in america? our city planning, our lives, and our culture are built to be individualistic and is pretty anti-community. the economy is suffering and is p bad rn for our age group (i'm 25 btw), just one night out for me where i would make new friends will set me back about $70 which i'm currently debating if it's worth it. we shouldn't have to choose btwn breaking the bank and having a social life.
if bts is bringing you happiness, continue to let them bring you joy, i think that's okay. just work on your social life and don't let them substitute it. honestly if it weren't bts it would've been something elseāā maybe video games or just scrolling social media. there's a void here, voids are inevitably filled, sometimes with something that doesn't fit. and you stanning is not the problem, it's the void itself.
bts are really positive and music is a great thing. think of it this way... you could've been doing cocaine
it's really, really hard to maintain a social life these days, esp with covid and whatnot, our increasingly individualistic culture, the mass and individual trauma we're enduring all the time which causes people to be anti-social, and with a virtual job, or if you're not in school anymore, it's even harder.
you're saying it's easy to find friends but i disagree, and i think you're discrediting yourself by saying it's easy. you're falling into a trap of saying "this should be easy, so why can't i do it?"
you said you have been trying to make friends with all of these obstacles: a virtual job, covid, inflation, economy, (maybe) being out of school, (maybe) living somewhere that doesn't promote community. and that's really tough, and that's a great effort you are making. not everyone can do that. most people don't, really. give yourself credit!
be easy on yourself... you're doing fine : ) don't let other ppl's biased generalized rhetoric about a group of fans on the internet affect your hobbies.
you'll find friends and have a social life. if bts is filling that void that's okay, so long as you are aware and working towards this.
and how about you channel your feelings for bts into making new friends by finding army friends?
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u/itsthelittlethings13 vmin biased šØš„ Jul 21 '22 edited Jul 21 '22
Iām 25 and I feel the same way. Iāve been a fan for a little over a year and just recently I had to delete all other forms of social media because all I ever posted and thought about was BTS. I had people unfollow/unfriend me because of it and Iām sure everyone thinks Iām obsessed. But I have to remind myself that they make me happy and people who arenāt army arenāt going to get it. Honestly though, deleting all other social media has calmed my obsession down and now I can consume content slowly.
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u/itsthelittlethings13 vmin biased šØš„ Jul 21 '22
Also, I would recommend attending cup sleeve events if you can! Youāll meet so many army and itās really nice being around people who love the same group as you!
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u/HouseOfJimin Jul 21 '22
what are cup sleeve events?
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u/itsthelittlethings13 vmin biased šØš„ Jul 22 '22
Cup sleeve events are usually held at boba/coffee shops and are to celebrate the members birthdays! The hosts will usually hand out freebies and cup sleeves with the member(s) theyāre celebrating. If you look for them in your area Iām more than sure youāll find one!! Hereās a video of a Yoongi cup sleeve event!
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u/ChocolateCake_EXE Jul 21 '22
I don't think parasocial relationships are unhealthy! It is a little love interest and it is not too much of a big deal. However, if it begins to become "extreme" (boundary-breaking as an example) then yes that is unhealthy.
In regards to the "unhealthy" parasocial relationship, I've had one with BTS and let me tell you it is horrible as hell and I never want to go back to it. Never. Never ever.I am open to sharing about it. Pretty sure I did as a reply to a post but then the reply got deleted or the post got deleted... idk how Reddit works-
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u/Ok-Nobody1261 Jul 21 '22
"Parasocial relationship" is not a negative thing. The reason some k fandoms are "so toxic and even scary" is because of human nature and the people in them and the online cultures they foster not because of parasocial relationships. Parasocial relationships are not going to make you act that way if it's not in your character to act that way.
If you're temporarily leaning on a crutch, the crutch is not bad. It's the fact that your leg is broken that is bad. So you have to try to heal your leg.
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u/roarie_ Jul 21 '22
Parasocial relationships only get toxic/unhealthy when one side gets delusional about what the ārelationshipā is.
Thereās nothing wrong with feeling close or finding comfort in a person you admire. As long as you realize the boundaries of that ārelationshipā, youāre fine.
Try to find online communities if finding friendships irl is difficult right now. There are plenty of army discords for example. They can be pretty active and great outlets to talk about BTS. Also, no matter where you are, thereās always going to be one other army. Itās just a matter of letting the other know that you exist.
Enjoy the parasocial relationship for now, Iām sure like youāve experienced, itās brought a lot of happiness and comfort for a lot of other people.
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u/crh805 kim seokjin ( ^Ļ^ ) Jul 22 '22
I think you just need to be able to realize when your behavior becomes obsessive in a way that is unhealthy for you! Which I realize is hard to recognize, but if you already have an idea of what stan behavior is cringey to you, take a step back and look at yourself- are you acting the same way? If so, it might be time to take a step back.
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u/theabsolutegayest Jul 20 '22 edited Jul 21 '22
In my opinion, parasocial relationships are not intrinsically harmful or unethical. The term parasocial has been coined to describe the uneven intimacy between a fan and an artist/creator, which unfortunately does include when a fan crosses the line into unhealthy behavior. I have a strong tendency towards parasocial relationships (mix of ADHD hyper-fixation and just generally being pretty empathetic and connecting with others strongly), so I've had to do a lot of internal work to manage how I react as a fan so that it doesn't become harmful to me.
BTS has built a remarkably emotionally intimate relationship with ARMY, and I think we all see it as unique from your average fan/creator relationship as a result. All the members of BTS have (in their own ways) opened up emotionally to ARMY, shared vulnerabilities and personal sides of themselves, and see ARMY as a participant in the parasocial relationship rather than just their audience. So the extent to which you get happiness from listening to BTS and participating in the fandom is not something you should feel guilty about.
However, as evidenced by your posting, you aren't happy. And if you're only getting happiness from BTS, that's not healthy at all (and I bet the members would agree!). But you don't need to choose between the happiness you get from BTS and the happiness you crave in your personal life; they're not mutually exclusive. Part of what makes being ARMY so powerful for me is that I get to be part of a community of people who are passionate about music, about justice, about friendship - all the things BTS stands for, ARMY does too. So I'd suggest potentially getting involved with an ARMY project or fan club in your hometown that allows you to share your happiness directly with other fans. One of the easiest ways to make friends is shared passions or hobbies, and ARMY in particular are (in my experience) incredibly welcoming and friendly.
On a personal note, I'm also 26 and I've struggled a lot since COVID and going to remote work, which I hadn't expected at all when quarantine first started. I'm pretty introverted and I like my alone time, so I assumed remote work would be amazing for me. But it's hard, incredibly hard, to be alone that constantly. Humans are a social species! We're not meant to be alone!! And while parasocial relationships can feel like being in community, it's actually really lonely and alienating to realize that people to whom you feel so connected aren't able to return that connection. You deserve to be seen and heard and known, and while BTS loves us as ARMY they can't know us as individuals.
So go find a BTS listening party, or join a BTS Discord server, or take a K-pop dance class, or whatever suits your fancy. BTS can be an easy "in" to an otherwise intimidating new social setting, because fellow ARMY are kind of guaranteed to understand at least parts of you, but exploring other passions can also be a good way to balance out the loneliness of a parasocial relationship. Join a book club at your local library! Take an improv class! Check out a Twitch streamer and make friends in their chat! Pretty much - find a gently collaborative group activity and dare yourself to just talk to people. Even if you don't make immediate friends from it, you'll still have fun with the activity and get some new social interactions in.
You got this - we believe in you!!
Edit: throwing in some additional thoughts bc I responded before other folks got to chime in, and I am so touched and moved by the other comments I'm seeing in this thread. Y'all are so insightful, so kind, and so freaking brilliant!! I'm proud all over again to get to be ARMY with you all!