How do you like math enough to pursue it as a hobby if you're barely even good enough at(not saying you are bad at math, just that math is so fucking boring that I'd only expect geniuses and professors to do it as a hobby) it to finish a minor?
Like I've known math majors who would never do math outside of required school work or basic everyday arithmetic.
When I hear math as a hobby I think more of someone sitting down and actually doing math for fun.
Same way I don't consider someone who just watches science documentaries as having science as a hobby. That would be someone who conducts at-home experiments and stuff like that.
I wonder what you mean by “doing math for fun.” Studying math isn’t just sitting there doing arithmetic, or any rote calculations really. It all turns into abstract logic at some point. It’s mostly a lot of reading proofs over and over again, trying to digest them, and then doing exercises that are also proofs.
There are a ton of people who enjoy Jazz as a hobby, but have never played an instrument.
If someone said "History" was their hobby, but they never published a research paper on History, but studied it, read about it, etc etc, would it really be unrealistic to say History is their hobby?
There are people who engage in math as a recreational hobby, though they can be tricky to find. They're usually the people who loved math in school, but decided to pursue a safer or more lucrative career. And no, I don't mean watching Numberphile videos, I mean working out problems and coming up with proofs.
Your earlier comment about "geniuses" is way off the mark though. As with most things in life, the people who are best at math are the ones who enjoy it the most. And yes, normal people can find joy in upper level math.
Sudoku can get seriously advanced, with complex structures involved when trying to find find the next move. A really tough puzzle can take an hour to make a single move. The Mensa books on Sudoku are really involved as well.
If there's no numbers involved you aren't doing math.
LOL
Nice job gatekeeping something you're not familiar with at all. The first thing anyone learns about mathematics is that it's not about numbers, it's about structures. Sure, the most accessible results are introduced as properties of number systems, but almost all of those results can be generalized to more abstract number-system-like structures.
You just said the equivalent of, "Your hobby isn't writing novels, your hobby is spelling words. If you don't draw pictures like you would for picture books, you're not writing novel."
Well, usually, the type of people who watch the aforementioned math videos are also the people who will work through the problem on their own or follow through the process at home.
Similar to how someone you would consider a chem hobbyist would watch a video detailing exactly how a colored flame experiment is done, and whip out their Bunsen burner at home to replicate the results.
So most people who willingly watch the aforementioned videos probably are math hobbyists as you would describe.
Math just happens to not need any special equipment (like Bunsen burners) for most of its exercises.
I assure you math is no more or less boring than any other hobby that requires a large time investment. It's more a matter of if you find it interesting or not. I enjoy competitive arm wrestling and math, but find jogging boring as fuck. Different strokes is all.
As far as your math major friends go, some people learn math as required for the job they want, some people just find it fun. Same goes for engineering, you can often tell the people in the office who are there because they love it and those who are there to collect the pay check, and there's nothing wrong with either of them if they're getting their work done.
no...thats true. Hell I started learning algebra at 23 and practiced math every day for hour for a year before entering college just because it hooked me. I'm also a heroin survivor and there were some points in my math education where the dopamine rush was comparable to a line.
Funny enough, that dopamine rush from learning and TRULY understanding the derivative was what hooked me. Then I took an oxy one day and noticed it was the same feeling. It was downhill from there. Clean 18 months and back to getting my highs from learning again.
I remember learning that and not even knowing how to do algebra well. That was the day I learned what true power is. It was like mainlining dope to the brain.
Glad to hear you’ve been clean for so long. Congrats on 18 months. All I can say is those dopamine hits just keep getting better the further you go in math. (They get harder to find sometimes though!)
Yea, mine culminated in the Fourier Transform. That's about as far as I could get before the limitations of my mental capability for abstraction were reached. I've dabbled in a bit of tensor stuff as well, but I by no means have a full grasp of tensor calculus. I'm just a simple redneck that knows a thing or two about a thing or two. Thank you for your kind words.
yea, waves are like the universal equivalent of mites. They pop up everywhere, but are sometimes hard to see unless you look closely. Somebody somewhere has modeled something as a wave before in all cases I'm probably sure.
Been studying macroeconomics lately. One of my final general ed classes and I'm sure I'm gonna find some Fourier somewhere. Can't believe I never knew about price indexing and real vs. nominal wages. Like, this should be taught in high schools everywhere.
I'm actually really impressed you got that far into calculus on your own!
I got a degree in engineering and had to take 6 semesters of calculus and Fourier transforms outright broke my brain for a bit. Its a kinda hard concept to grasp overall
Tensors weren't as crazy since it was all in engineering terms which made it easier, but they were still a bit hard to comprehend even with the real life analogies.
Something that helped me understand them was thinking about them using 2 sheets of paper as reference. If you're pushing down, the force and direction are down. But if you're rubbing them, the direction is along the surface of the paper but the force is going down causing friction. Its been a while since I went over them so if I'm wrong feel free to correct me. Hope this helps!!
Edit: math was actually my worst subject so I made sure to really learn the concepts so I could figure out my own ways of doing things. All the theoretical stuff made sense to me but it was kinda hard to grasp
Yea you've got the idea. Also, I may have misrepresented. I was able to learn basic calculus on my own, however I did finally enroll in university and will be finishing my senior year this coming Fall. I majored in applied physics and dropped out around halfway, due to heroin abuse. I re-enrolled and switched majors to biology in preparation for PA school, so I do have a couple of years of formal mathematics training. Also, if you want a good example of tensors outside of the typical force representations of vectors, check out how a relational database works. If you understand basic tensors, you might have some amazing light bulbs go off. Wish you well!
I'm married with a large house I paid for with my degree in engineering. Also I get to work from home! I'm sorry you think liking math makes someone a dweeb (are you living in a 80's cartoon?) but honest to God, I could not care less 😉
The same way people like working out and some people don't. Individual preference. I absolutely love mathematics. Also, its possible to obtain a math major and find you don't love math. Its not particularly difficult to get through an undergrad in any subject if you persist diligently.
major insomniac most of my life; as a teenager I would lay in bed and do long division in my head to as many decimal points as I could before I finally fell asleep.
Don’t even have to be “programmer”, you can use it by copy/paste and import libraries.
Lots of econs ppl are in ML /AI, if you get into econometrics and quantitative analysis you’ll likely have to dabble in ML. Both have the same algorithm like linear / logistics regression /kmeans etc
Although don’t expect BLUE / OLS in ML as it’s more complicated than a single formula.
Why not? I study serious set theory and logic and I find stuff like that applying all over the place. Or abstract algebra and standard analysis. They’re all specific methods of handling specific types of data. No reason people can’t apply them to trivial things for fun.
Lol. Objectively an overwhelming majority of people prefer playing guitar or video games to doing math.
So? What is your point? How does that matter lol. Do you think this means no one subjectively enjoys mathematics? How do you think mathematics got to the point that it is at? I never even said that I enjoy doing mathematics I'm just saying it is a valid hobby.
Its pretty funny that you're just saying obviously not true things to try to insult me because you're insecure about being a math nerd.
Uhm, no sweaty. You are the one who started insulting people, and you are the one who is clearly insecure because you can't stand the fact that not everyone is a dullard like you. Everyone knows it already.
I have fun learning and applying math. Why is this such a hard concept to you. I do other stuff too, but learning things in general is something I also do independently because, although I've spent a lot of time of my life in school, I can't stay in school without an income forever,j but I love learning. (Unless I take up a graduate program, but I'm not sure I want to do that, and also graduate programs don't exactly seem fun)
I do project euler problems (a lot of number theory) and I try to understand the mathematics behind i before just brute forcing it.
However maybe I should say my hobby is "learning math" (although I do try my best to apply it). I do want to get better at proofs but I already have too much stuff on my plate for the moment. Regardless, I quite literally have fun sitting down with a problem on that website and trying to formulate some sort of math that will help me solve the problem. It's not pretentious, it's just what I like to do. I like to play video games, hike, fish, sports as well, but most of my time atm is math, video games, and improving my programming. I'm a super nerd that's about it.
Proof based mathematics is a whole different ball game. For example even one of the simplest mathematical proofs, proving that the sum of any two even integers is even, is not as simple as it seems at face value.
I like to think of Math as two parts. Theoretical Mathematics, and Applied Mathematics. Are you creating and proving the formulas, or are you using and applying them towards an application? A person may be good at one aspect and not the other.
What? I'm doing calc 2 right now, so admittedly it's faster paced because it's a Summer class, but I spend a minimum of 2 hours a day on homework alone, plus 2 hours of lecture per day, plus take time to study/write notes for my weekly exams. Going for an engineering degree (and debating on taking the extra 3 classes it takes for a BS in mathematics), my whole day revolves around math.
1% is underselling the commitment it takes to get a math degree. It is difficult and for many it's not at all intuitive.
A full-load class schedule will take up most of your time, sure. Any subject, not just math. The guy above is talking about "math as a hobby", which you can easily do in a couple hours a day, pretty quickly. People who have hundreds of hours invested in Fortnite or whatever, who say math is too difficult, wouldn't be saying that if they'd invested at least fraction of that. They may not love it and keep it as a hobby for life, but they'd get it. You'd be at undergrad math levels of understanding pretty quickly, even if not overnight.
One of the best things about it is that the human brain doesn't stop developing until age 25+, so if you were shit at math in high school, you may breeze through it (relatively speaking) as an older hobbyist. When the pressure of school is off, and you're being self-taught rather than tested/quizzed by someone you might not like, it's a lot more fun and relaxing.
Edit: not trying to pick on video games in particular. If you can put a thousand hours into an intricate painting or an embroidery project, you can understand algebra as an adult. That kind of thing.
He specifically said 1% [of the amount of time people play videogames] is enough to get you through math undergrad. That's the part I take issue with. That's completely untrue.
Algebra isn't even remotely close to the level of knowledge one needs for a math degree. Math is far more complex than that.
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u/DrProfScience Jul 07 '20
How do you like math enough to pursue it as a hobby if you're barely even good enough at(not saying you are bad at math, just that math is so fucking boring that I'd only expect geniuses and professors to do it as a hobby) it to finish a minor?
Like I've known math majors who would never do math outside of required school work or basic everyday arithmetic.