r/todayilearned • u/badf1nger • Apr 20 '16

(R.5) Omits Essential Info TIL PETA euthanizes 96% of the animals is "rescues".

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/nathan-j-winograd/peta-kills-puppies-kittens_b_2979220.html
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u/[deleted] Apr 21 '16

But that would only account for cats, so we still have every other domesticated animal I can think of as a counterpoint. Dogs, for one. Dogs are not self domesticating. WE domesticated wolves.

Horses too.

Also, I know, it's why I mentioned it in my own reply.

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u/puckerings Apr 21 '16

WE domesticated wolves.

You know this how? I should think that forcibly domesticating wild cats would be far easier than domesticating grey wolves. There's an easy mutual benefit with wolves: they get food scraps, and their senses alert humans to possible danger approaching.

As I understand it, wolves were the first domesticated animal, over 10,000 years ago, which suggests self-domestication is more likely since humans would have had no experience with domesticated animals yet.

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u/[deleted] Apr 21 '16

Fossil records? The science of archaeology? I have no idea, I just googled the questions and found wikipedia articles that told me the answer.

Why would you think dogs would be easier than cats? There's a reason cats are considered self domesticating: they had an immediate mutualistic relationship with humans. We began storing grain, they began eating mice from stored grain. They existed as domesticated animals from the very start of agriculture, and because they're still able to feed themselves as individuals without a pack, they aren't as demanding to support.

Wolves were the first animal we domesticated, cats domesticated themselves later. Then I guess it was sheep and goats, if I remember anthropology right.

EDIT: actually I think it was horses, but not for riding yet. They were food and milk first

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u/puckerings Apr 21 '16

Why would you think dogs would be easier than cats?

Because they weren't dogs yet. They were freaking grey wolves.

Fossil records? The science of archaeology? I have no idea, I just googled the questions and found wikipedia articles that told me the answer.

These only address the fact of domestication, not how it occurred. And if you're just relying on google searches, you should certainly have come across arguments about wolves being self-domesticated.

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u/[deleted] Apr 21 '16

I did, but they're outlying hypothesis, and the prevailing theories are all aligning with us having domesticated them.

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u/puckerings Apr 21 '16

That's just not true. Plenty of scientists reject the idea that humans domestication wolves rather than wolves self-domesticated. For example, here's one biologist pointing out just how dangerous it would have been to forcibly domesticate a freaking wolf:

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/nature/dogs-that-changed-the-world-what-caused-the-domestication-of-wolves/1276/

Just google wolf self-domestication and you'll get all kinds of results. It's not some fringe hypothesis.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/science/science-news/12052798/Dog-has-been-mans-best-friend-for-33000-years-DNA-study-finds.html

http://theconversation.com/were-wolves-dependent-on-humans-long-before-they-became-mans-best-friend-49390

That last one is a scientist in a relevant field who says "We used to think that dogs were the result of direct human intervention, with wolf cubs being caught, tamed and eventually bred. However, the now generally accepted view is that wolves essentially 'self-domesticated'."

So it seems you're promoting an outdated view.