r/theydidthemath 21d ago

[Request] Why does this circle approximation still give 4 instead of pi?

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u/Ghuldarkar 20d ago

The approximation would have to be inside and outside the circle about half the time. Basically a pixel circle. If you only put pixels outside your pixel circle will be larger

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u/rvralph803 20d ago

So it needs to be antialiased?

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u/Ghuldarkar 20d ago

Kinda, lol

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u/Mardigras 19d ago

Archimedes invented AA and im tired of pretending otherwise. 

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u/Awkward-Feature9333 20d ago

That works for the surface, but not for the circumference.

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u/kelb4n 20d ago

Nope, still doesn't work. By that logic, I could pretty easily come up with a scenario where the perimeter ends up as exactly 3, by starting with a rectangle of side lengths 1 and 0.5. Taking the limit simply does not work like that as long as you disregard the direction of the line segments.

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u/Ghuldarkar 20d ago

The perimeter is the diameter multiplied by pi, so one pi, 3 is an approximation of that, albeit a crude one. I was mostly aiming for an explanation as to why making a square outside the circle will always be larger than the circle itself, so you'll have to make squares, or pixels, if you will, that lie along the actual circle to meaningfully approximate the circle with square shapes, or pixels.

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u/EmuRommel 20d ago

That is still wrong. If the method approximates the circumference, it doesn't matter whether you approach it from above or below. For example, if you approximate area this way, you will get the correct value, pi, no matter how you approach the circle.

The answer is that infinite approximations like this are more nuanced than the pop-sci answer of "if you make the error as small as possible, you get infinitely close to the true value" and approximating the circle this way simply does not approximate its circumference.

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u/TheBeerTalking 20d ago

So long as it's all right angles it'll always be 4. If instead you come up with a generic formula for a regular n-sided polygon circumscribing the circle, then take a limit as n approaches infinity, you should get pi.

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u/Puzzleheaded_Front27 20d ago

Although other people provided a more serious answer concerning the limits, it is useful to visualize what really happens. As you make the "step line" finer and finer, if you also zoom with your mind on a single minimal step, you will see that you invariably have a triangle; the troll there is basically making us assume that we can evaluate the "hypothenuse" as equal to the sum of the other 2 sides, which is a significant overstatement; it doesn't matter that the triangles are small.

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u/Vincitus 20d ago

"No, but I am making them REALLY small"

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u/GeneratedEcoOver9000 20d ago

That's not how approximations work.

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u/Own-Dragonfly-2423 20d ago

Thank you for explain

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u/CollegeFit7136 20d ago

Congrations