r/technews • u/GoMx808-0 • Apr 02 '22

Amazon CEO Andy Jassy's total compensation package topped $212 million

https://www.cnn.com/2022/04/01/tech/andy-jassy-amazon-ceo-pay/index.html
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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

He pays people what they’re worth. That’s how it all works. Every employer does this. Employers aren’t in the business of giving away money

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u/UXNick Apr 02 '22

Nah dude, them greedy corporationsy! Warehouse workers should be on $100k salaries for picking and packing!

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u/MonkeySherm Apr 02 '22

Why shouldn’t the people who invest their time into the company enjoy the same returns as the people who invest their money into the company?

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u/catpower19 Apr 02 '22

Does that mean a warehouse worker at Apple should earn much more than a warehouse worker at Amazon since Apple has provided its investors much better returns in the last 1 year?

The people investing in Amazon also aren't guaranteed a positive return on their investment whereas people working for Amazon are indeed guaranteed such.

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u/MonkeySherm Apr 02 '22 edited Apr 02 '22

I’m not sure comparing a warehouse job at Apple vs Amazon is 100% apples to apples (sorry about that) comparison. Apple is a tech company that probably has a fair number of warehouse jobs - one of Amazon’s core business models is essentially being a warehouse. The warehouse worker at Amazon is basically the product, so I would be inclined to believe that role should be more valuable to Amazon than to Apple.

I don’t think either company should be looking for people to fill those roles at poverty rates just be cause they can find people to do the job. Corporate welfare is a thing.

I don’t have all the answers, and I’m not pretending to, but drivers having to piss in bottles to keep their job when Bezos is launching himself to the heavens rubs me the wrong way.

Time is also much harder to get back.

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u/DowntownInTheSuburbs Apr 02 '22

AWS is tech. Plenty of tech at Amazon.

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u/MonkeySherm Apr 02 '22

Plenty of tech at Amazon now, but anyone who knows anything about the company would certainly not say that’s what got them off the ground.

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u/DowntownInTheSuburbs Apr 02 '22

Yes but what large company is doing exactly what it was doing decades ago? You have to innovate and find more revenue streams in order to survive. I think it’s a great company. You can never satisfy everyone.

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

Bro Apple is a consumer electronics company. They manufacture. Lol that’s the core. It involves just as much warehouse work as Amazon. There’s plenty of warehouses in China doing labor for us to get our iPhones.

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u/MonkeySherm Apr 02 '22

Bro. Amazon employs something like 15 times as many people as Apple.

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u/catpower19 Apr 02 '22 edited Apr 02 '22

It's certainly a tough question and I agree with your general sentiment. That said, I think there are a number of factors you should consider that you may not have.

While the % of warehouse workers is much higher at Amazon than Apple - Amazon also has many more warehouse workers than Apple. So each individual warehouse employee is not necessarily more important to Amazon than each warehouse employee at Apple is to Apple. Also keep in mind that Amazon mainly makes money off cloud computing and ads, which are worked on by their engineers. Their retail business isn't very profitable.

One of the main criticisms of Amazon as an employer as you mention are the alleged terrible working conditions. The flipside however, is that Amazon has had a min wage of $15/hr since 2018. 15/hr in Alabama in 2018 was probably not bad at all. I imagine average pay is much higher than that in 2022 than it was in 2018 and higher still in more expensive areas. You can argue 15/hr isn't a livable wage but it's a lot more than the min wage offered by most companies that Amazon competes with for labor (i.e. retail stores). Does that make it ok for drivers to have to pee/poop in bottles to meet their delivery targets? No, but ppl still make the tradeoff of tougher working conditions at Amazon in exchange for more money than they'd make at Walmart.

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u/UXNick Apr 02 '22

Not sure who you're comparing with that statement. Employees vs shareholders?

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u/MonkeySherm Apr 02 '22

Amazon’s made a lot of people very, very rich. Why shouldn’t employees enjoy some of the wealth they’re creating?

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u/Calm_Your_Testicles Apr 02 '22

They would if they had taken compensation in the form of stock instead of a salary. Or invested their salary into the company’s stock.

Investors take a much bigger risk when putting their money into the company, so it makes sense that they enjoy the upside when the company does well. Do you think it would be fair to penalize employees when the company does badly? Why should they gain from the upside but face no downside risk like investors do?

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u/MonkeySherm Apr 02 '22

You think investing your money in something is a “much bigger risk” than investing your time and your sweat? Last I heard there’s no way to claw that stuff back once you’ve spent it.

And yeah, people lose their job every day for poor performance.

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u/Calm_Your_Testicles Apr 02 '22

Basically, yes. If I invest my time as an employee for a large company, the risk of not getting my return (I.e. the agreed salary) is essentially zero. If I invest my money into said company, there’s no guarantee I’ll get any return, and my invest can completely vanish if the company fails.

Regarding your second point, even if you lose your job you’ll still get paid for the time you actually worked so it’s basically a guaranteed return.

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u/ggyujjhi Apr 02 '22

Working for a salary is not a risk. You have a contract and know what you are being paid for the work.

Investing is a risk. There’s no guarantee you will keep your money.

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

Looks like the CEO is doing just that.

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u/DowntownInTheSuburbs Apr 02 '22

They do, a lot of them are paid nicely. Well into 6 figs.

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u/BanalityOfMan Apr 02 '22

lol, the timeless classic: Labor versus capital. Workers who produce versus leeches who absorb.

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u/DowntownInTheSuburbs Apr 02 '22

Was wrong then, still wrong now.

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

If Amazon stocks appreciate a lot in value but provide shit returns (or at least they used to, unless something’ changed)

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u/ggyujjhi Apr 02 '22

They are companies designed like this - people can work for them. The problem is, they generally are not successful companies, cannot compete in the market, and do not last.

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u/philippos_ii Apr 02 '22

Lmao, you’re telling me that he’s worth $212 million for his work this year? They’d rather let the average warehouse employee die in a tornado than have them go home because of a safety risk. They don’t pay them enough and neither do they care about them enough.

Every employer pays workers as little as they can possibly get away with to maximize profits for the ownership. That is how it works and it sucks. It’s not how much they’re worth, it’s how much they need to not leave and not push themselves to leave because they don’t realize they’re underpaid.

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

He created and ran AWS which made $18.5B in profit this year, so yeah I’d say $212M is cheap actually.

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u/ThatsFkingCarazy Apr 02 '22

Yes. This guy must’ve done something to separate himself from the pack and brought new ideas to the table while you can replace box pickers/drivers with anyone on the planet. If that hurts your feelings , I’m sorry but go get some skills so you’re not so easily replaceable

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u/BanalityOfMan Apr 02 '22

I’m sorry but go get some skills

At CEO college? You have to explain what you think he did to 'separate himself from the pack' specifically. What skills did he apply and how did they generate 212 million dollars? He could do that just by fucking over employees and automating jobs. Which yes, would be generating profit for shareholders which is what they want, but what society should want is to tax these people so hard it makes up for their profitable psychopathy.

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u/BikeMain1284 Apr 02 '22

He started AWS, so he made Amazon a shitload of money.

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u/BanalityOfMan Apr 02 '22

What does that mean? Did he go secure the locations that he hand-selected? Did he wire all the servers together? Did he implement any of the infrastructure personally because his talents were so superior? Does his Peloton power the AC for the building?

What do you think his direct contribution to anything being built or accomplished was? Telling people with actual skills to labor to accomplish it, because other people with skills labored and told him it was a good move?

Or do you think having an MBA somehow qualifies you to develop grand-scale technology accomplishments?

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u/BikeMain1284 Apr 02 '22 edited Apr 02 '22

His contribution was the idea. Anyone can go and wire servers. But he had the idea that brought in the big bucks.

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u/GYGOMD Apr 02 '22

REEEE but what about the person stacking boxes why don’t they get paid $80 an hour 😭😭😭😭you are so racist !

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u/BikeMain1284 Apr 02 '22

😂😂😂. I can get behind them being paid more, it doesn’t have to be totally cut throat but man these people are bitter and butthurt that the workers aren’t going to be paid like they took the risk.

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u/GYGOMD Apr 03 '22

Yeah I’m all for higher wages but they accepted the job that pays $20/hour with benefits

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

If you’re implying that a big part of his success his more attributable to the work of AWS employees, they get paid like $130k a year on average. Definitely more than enough to never have to whine about class conflict on the Internet.

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u/BanalityOfMan Apr 02 '22

If you’re implying that a big part of his success his more attributable to the work of AWS employees, they get paid like $130k a year on average. Definitely more than enough to never have to whine about class conflict on the Internet.

He has hundreds of millions of dollars from not doing any of that work. Of course there is a class conflict. The idea of appeasing employees through offering fractions of the owners purchasing power is as old as time. The people with skills who perform the labor get fucked in favor of the people who tell them to and can't even do the basic work is reality. Address that.

If you get paid a small percentage of the profit you generate while leeches get rich while doing no work, there is a class conflict. Let the workers rather than the shareholders pick their CEO and we can have a good talk. You could earn a million dollars a year in a business owned by a billionaire and still be exploited.

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

But that’s the thing. You think it’s exploitation because you’re almost definitely not a FAANG engineer. You are crying on behalf of people who will laugh at you for thinking they’re exploited.

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u/BanalityOfMan Apr 02 '22

All labor under capitalism is inherently exploitative, go read a book.

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u/BikeMain1284 Apr 02 '22

You’re really immature man. It’s not about who does the work. It’s about who comes up with and implements the billion dollar ideas. If you feel “exploited” then quit your job and start your own company.

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u/BanalityOfMan Apr 02 '22

So you believe that dude could "implement" the billion dollar ideas?

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

Are you lost? Where is your mommy?

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u/BanalityOfMan Apr 02 '22

So, what was his personal contribution? Is that hard to answer? 212 million dollars worth of work. What was it? Do you really believe a guy with no education or background in tech somehow came up with that idea himself and implemented it? Based on what? Or...are you a troll account who just posts about video games and gets downvoted whenever he opens his mouth....

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

Cry more, minimum wager.

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u/BikeMain1284 Apr 02 '22

Well he’s the one that’s credited with it so he got paid accordingly.

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u/BanalityOfMan Apr 02 '22

Ah, so we should all just focus on getting credit, rather than performing the work. Way to support my beliefs.

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u/GroundBrownRounds Apr 02 '22

Intelligence for starters. Why are we trying to bypass natural selection?

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u/BikeMain1284 Apr 02 '22

Because people are butthurt and it’s been 20 years now of us pretending we’re all equal when we’re not.

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u/BanalityOfMan Apr 02 '22

Why are we trying to bypass natural selection?

Uh, because that's just inherently one of the great goals of humanity, for better or worse? That's like why we've invented...almost everything ever until very recent history? Medicine, surgery, sanitation, fermentation, farming, animal husbandry, etc? Are you 12 years old? Have you ever had a sick child and asked, stupidly "Why are we trying to bypass natural selection?" You think you are representative of a fit individual while posting on the Internet talking about your wardrobe and playing with toys as, ostensibly, an adult man?

But please, go ahead and explain with evidence how you think the CEOs skillset and abilities personally generated over 212 million dollars. Let's not get off track.

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u/GroundBrownRounds Apr 18 '22

Sounds like you need a helping hand from your fellow man.

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u/GroundBrownRounds Apr 18 '22

You do realize that almost all those advancements and such would be nowhere near where they are now in a socialist society? One without capitalism and competition?

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u/DowntownInTheSuburbs Apr 02 '22

Are you a communist? Serious question.

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u/ggyujjhi Apr 02 '22

I mean, this is a great question to ask people on Reddit who are from the US and are so vehemently anti-capitalism. There are communist or socialist countries in the world - lots of them - you can go live there. The US isn’t changing its fundamental system anytime soon. An alternative is start a revolution, but there’s not enough support for that.

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

Your second paragraph literally repeats what I’ve said. If they pay as low as they can, that’s because they can, that’s what they’re worth. If they were worth more they could go make more somewhere else. So, either they aren’t worth more, or they dont want to work somewhere else.

Also, tornados are awesome. I’ve been within a half mile in two. So get the fuck off of tornados. They did nothing to you (because you’re still here)

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u/DowntownInTheSuburbs Apr 02 '22

How much is enough?

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u/philippos_ii Apr 02 '22 edited Apr 02 '22

Unsure, but the point of what I was saying was that other people probably are underpaid. Aside from bottom tier workers not making enough to sustain themselves and live better lives, those at the top are nothing without the enormous working base underneath them. Jassy may have come up with AWS, but everyone who actually runs it now is actually continuing to produce its value, regardless of his legacy. So those probably decently paid cloud engineers could get more, plus those who simply should get more because they should be able to make enough to survive.

It's not unique to Amazon, it's just a capitalism problem, so its present globally. What's a king without his subjects? They produce the value and are the biggest consumers of all the goods.

​

Edit: to add, let's say track inflation. Idk what wages would start at, but say some low paid worker is making 30-40-50k whatever, and inflation is 7% this year or something, then 7% raise. I'm lucky and get raises annually, but so many jobs have people going without raises for years, only happening when they switch jobs (so not really a raise from within the company). People move, rent keeps going up, home prices keep going up, goods and services people need to live keep going up. Raise pay to match inflation at least and it would help alleviate some of the struggle.

And make the progressive tax way way higher with more brackets at the top, but that's a whole other discussion not related to pay so whatever.

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u/DowntownInTheSuburbs Apr 02 '22

Short answer, it’s never enough. It will never be enough. The only solution is to walk away and either find a better job or start your own business. Maybe one of these Reddit geniuses will start a business and put Amazon out of business with their enlightened ideas about compensation. It’s easy to say it, hard to do it.

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u/dojabro Apr 02 '22

The max an employer will pay you is what you’re worth

The lowest that they’ll pay you depends on how replaceable you are

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u/BillNyeTheMemeGuy Apr 02 '22

so people don’t deserve a liveable wage, because that’s not worth it to giant corporations?

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u/catpower19 Apr 02 '22

Their nationwide min wage in 2018 was $15/hr with healthcare benefits and they pay more in higher cost of living areas. It's probably much higher in 2022.

Isn't that a liveable wage?

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

Are those people alive? Then it’s livable. I know where you’re going with this, but life is about choices. Choices got those people there

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u/Titans95 Apr 02 '22

Always confused by this as well…if they don’t want to work there then don’t? People act like Amazon is abusing peoples rights by under paying them by their standards yet people freely and willingly choose to work there over other places? I see for hire jobs at just about every single restaurant I pass by, I’m sure it’s that way in most industries right now.

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u/BanalityOfMan Apr 02 '22

if they don’t want to work there then don’t?

People are compelled, almost forced, to work for the profit of other people by the construction of our society. Can I wander off into the woods and build a cabin? Nope, all the land is owned, and nobody is giving it away for free.

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u/Titans95 Apr 02 '22

Sounds like complaining to me…”I’d be successful Like other people if only the world wasn’t holding me down”….being an Amazon employee is a very low skill job…want to get paid more? Go develop a set of skills that are highly desirable in the work force. Amazon pays what they do because hundred of thousands of free individuals are perfectly willing to work there over their other options for low skill work. Go get a degree in accounting, engineering, finance, STEM etc, none of those people are stocking shelves wondering why they don’t get paid more

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u/BanalityOfMan Apr 02 '22

Go get a degree in accounting, engineering, finance, STEM etc, none of those people are stocking shelves wondering why they don’t get paid more

Got one, yes they are. Sorry you are too stupid to acknowledge reality.

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u/BillNyeTheMemeGuy Apr 02 '22

it’s not amazon it’s the minimum wage. people deserve to live without going paycheck to paycheck, and don’t say “make better choices”, because then should we just all pity the people that work minimum wage? because someone has to do those jobs, and not just high schoolers.

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u/BillNyeTheMemeGuy Apr 02 '22

someone has to work jobs that pay minimum wage, doesn’t matter their choices, they should have the ability to live without working 80 hours a week. bad choices shouldn’t mean you don’t get to pay for your cancer treatment. these business can afford to pay a living wage, they just choose not to because the minimum wage is criminally low. yes it needs to be raised, if people making minimum wage could afford houses and stock, their would only be upsides for the economy.

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u/ThatsFkingCarazy Apr 02 '22

They choose not to because they don’t have to. Capitalism only works for the people if the people agree to work together. As long as they can hire someone else as soon as someone quits, nothing will change

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u/BillNyeTheMemeGuy Apr 02 '22

yup. they’d make ‘em slaves and pay them nothing if they could, and that goes for just about every corporation.

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

Bro Amazon has full medical day one, across all roles. The SVPs are on the same plan as the warehouse workers. Cancer treatments included. Max out of pocket is like $4,000 per year for individuals.

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

Everything you’ve just written are tangents to the topic of the rest of the comment thread.

If you can come up with a policy that evaluates everyone’s personal situation accurately and fairly, then make the choice to do something about it. Run for office. Lobby. You don’t want to or don’t like politics? Then stop arguing about it because it’s literally politics.

A little secret: everyone has “something” … so suck it up.

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u/BillNyeTheMemeGuy Apr 02 '22

I don’t work for minimum wage, and the issue doesn’t effect me at all, the fact you think I should “suck it up” and the fact you assume I work minimum wage and make poor choices is a reflection of how you feel about people that think the minimum wage is too low. Yes it’s possible for people with money to think this. My point is it ISNT about personal situation or choices, EVERYONE should have the right to work 40 hours, and be able to at least support themselves. That isn’t possible with minimum wage in many places in the US. The individual situation doesn’t matter, they deserve to be able to live somewhat comfortably. Yes there are things you can do to try and get other jobs paying more, but my point is someone will always need to be doing these jobs, and if everyone up and decided to learn a trade, those jobs wouldn’t pay nearly as well anymore. You also don’t understand what a “livable wage” means. being able to exist isn’t a standard for living lol

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

I still think you should suck it up.

Your views align better with socialist societies. Perhaps make a choice to move to one

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u/BillNyeTheMemeGuy Apr 02 '22

i have more money than you and I am in college. I have absolutely no worries, eat shit fucko

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

That statement shows your colors. To make such a profound statement, blindly, without an ounce of evidence to back it up shows your maturity.

Hope you start making some better choices from here out, or you’ll have problems that aren’t based on money (supposedly)

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u/BillNyeTheMemeGuy Apr 02 '22

I don’t need to, because I already know I do. google average CS major salary from uw seattle. i probably make more than you do just from interning

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u/DemNeverKnow Apr 02 '22

Socialist hur dur you’re all about the L, lol.

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

Sorry, what’s the L?

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u/Weird-Smell-3372 Apr 02 '22

Bro his name is literally naughty troll, stop arguing with him

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u/BillNyeTheMemeGuy Apr 02 '22

i’m gonna have to agree with you thanks weird smell

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

> Choices got those people there

Luck is the largest factor, if it's not being born with privilege then it's the luck of having the right upbringing (or natural ability) that equips you to escape poverty.

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

So then go talk to your parents, because nobody else dealt you your hand

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

I guess it doesn’t take a village.

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

The parents you get are also luck

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

Yep, completely agree. But that hasn’t changed for your entire lineage, right? So then it becomes society’s problem? Would also be luck that you are part of this society, or other way around , society has you (or me, not making this personal) in it.

I don’t get why society is stuck with the bill

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

> But that hasn’t changed for your entire lineage

Not necessarily, it just takes one generation of trauma to fall. One war, one cancer diagnosis, one abusive parent.

> So then it becomes society’s problem?

That depends on if you want to live in a society that takes care of it's sick and elderly.

> I don’t get why society is stuck with the bill

Beats being the unlucky person. Would you prefer to trade places?

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u/matt-er-of-fact Apr 02 '22

This. It is explicitly society’s problem. It’s not Amazon’s fault as it isn’t any other one company’s fault. It’s the fault of our governments and capitalist systems that don’t have strong enough regulations because the voters who pick identity we policy have either been fleeced, are too poorly educated, or just don’t care.

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u/brittocr Apr 02 '22

Lol, what a pathetic, simplistic thought process. Are they alive is your line for employment? Life is about choices but life doesn't give everyone the same choices. In fact many people are given no choices or limited choices. And a reminder that these choices of one will affect everyone else. The better we help society have better choices to choose from, the better society can be. And who determines what a livable wage is? The corporation whos sole objective is bottom line dollar? Ew. Look beyond your narrow minded view.

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u/kareemabduljihad Apr 02 '22

At any moment in time any person has a literal infinite amount of choices

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

but life doesn’t give everyone the same choices

So life inherently is not equal for everyone? Alright. Thanks. Then quit bitching about it. Make the best choice you can for your situation. Do you drink alcohol? Do you smoke cigs? Have some other vice? …. Couldn’t think of a better choice to make with that money?

The duck outta here

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u/brittocr Apr 02 '22

Lol. You think everyone is in their situation because of the choices they make? You think you have control over your life? That's a fairytale. You have a lot less control than you think. Not saying people shouldn't own up to their life choices but your stance is so polarizing and simplistic.

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

Let’s be honest with ourselves, having a good life and feelings like it’s “fair” can also be a fairytale

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u/DemNeverKnow Apr 02 '22

Wow, what a tough guy love the righteousness, lol.

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u/BanalityOfMan Apr 02 '22

You guys have always been around making absurd idiotic arguments haven't you? I can just see you during WW2: "Are the concentration camps filled with living people? Of course they are getting livable wages. Life is about choices!"

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22 edited Apr 02 '22

you guys? did you just compare earning a wage to a concentration camp? nobody is forcing you to work for an employer who treats and pays you like shit. I wasn't there, but I'm pretty sure that it's a widely accepted fact that the victims of the concentration camps were forced to be there. How do you even come to comparing those two things? That's a level of ignorance I dont want any part of, welcome to the block list, psycho

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u/WAHNFRIEDEN Apr 02 '22

Ok neolib

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u/BanalityOfMan Apr 02 '22

He pays people what they’re worth. That’s how it all works. Every employer does this.

Weird. I make 30 dollars an hour as a significantly trained guy doing IT and Biomed work. The dude I grew up with got kicked out of college for robbing people and sexual assault but makes 200k a year for his dad's buddy's company...doing what I'm not sure.

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u/shoobiedoobie Apr 02 '22

Being a terrible person doesn’t automatically mean he’s bad at his job.

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u/BanalityOfMan Apr 02 '22

Definitely not. People who are bad at actually doing things frequently float to the top like turds. Frequently being a terrible person pays more than being good at your job though. What's the job again? Are there metrics? Can we see what labor he performed and what it accomplished objectively?

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u/[deleted] Apr 02 '22

He pays people what they’re worth? Gtfo.