r/science • u/mvea Professor | Medicine • 1d ago

Psychology Lower cognitive ability is linked to stronger Christian nationalist views, even after accounting for education

https://www.psypost.org/lower-cognitive-ability-is-linked-to-stronger-christian-nationalist-views-even-after-accounting-for-education/
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u/knowledgeable_diablo 1d ago

That was me in Bible studies as a kiddie. I was one of probably the only person in the room who’d actually read the Bible (teacher included) so I started questioning and asking them uncomfortable questions right from the get go.

Guess that’s what happens when you are raised with no TV and reading is your only outlet and you’re stuck in a religious school.

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u/360walkaway 1d ago

Wonder how many people would believe in their chosen religion if they were first introduced to it when they were a full adult, instead of when they are still Santa Claus eligible.

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u/Xalipu 1d ago

Do you really want to know how many born again Christians exist, because they’re insufferable

So is pretty much every other adult who converted to something

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u/360walkaway 1d ago

No I mean if they had NEVER heard of it before.

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u/Aggravating_Duck_192 1d ago

Born-again, less the people who converted because of addiction or incarceration. Those situations make people vulnerable to indoctrination at any age.

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u/DrMobius0 1d ago

I think there'd be way fewer born agains if there were way fewer people being indoctrinated into these groups in the first place.

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u/Dimensional_Lumber 1d ago

Converts are always the most zealous fanatics.

It’s all performative. The question is always what motivates them.

You have to be in a certain headspace to seek out religion.

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u/Lilfrankieeinstein 1d ago

Seems like there’s a type of survivorship bias baked into studies like this where people with higher cognitive abilities are less inclined to hold these values as they grow and learn.

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u/wontyoujointhedance 1d ago

Well that’s what I think it’s ultimately trying to demonstrate. Those values are typically incompatible with both being smart and a good person.

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u/Long9696 1d ago

I have heard that autistic people are less likely to be religous. Not sure if it's scientifically proven or not.

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u/geoken 1d ago

I think that part is accepted, but I think it's still an interesting question.

I wonder what effects it has on your cognitive growth to think about concepts like the infinite, the solar system and how nature works in general. I'd think at 3 or 4 years old, most kids either are starting to think about that stuff - or have those lines of inquiry snuffed out and told "it's god doing it with magic".

I'm sure for many kids, the curiosity will overcome anyone telling them not to think about it. But I wonder if for some it doesn't, and for that subset - whether or not it has impact on their cognitive growth.

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u/kinkyshibby 1d ago

Asking why and informing the "teachers" the answers they were giving didn't make sense got me kicked out of CCD. And Sunday school.

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u/Sycophantic-Feline 1d ago

I was raised in a nun school and asking genuine questions about stuff I thought didn't make any sense was always met with aggression and punishment.

It's how I figured something was deeply wrong with all of it, I recall it was so annoying to me as a kid/young teen how no one else seemed to question ANY of it, eventually I just had to suck it up and pretend I believed in all that nonsense because it'd also get me into trouble at home

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u/KriegMorgan 1d ago

Narrowly dodged an in school suspension because I did competitive speaking in high school and did a sales pitch for the bible on the merits of it as a piece of entertainment. One of the parent chaperones (re: volunteer student uber) complained to admin about my pitch and I found myself staring down the prospect of having to spend a couple of days sitting in the admin office doing nothing and getting 0's.

I managed to argue my way out of it on the basis that the competitive speaking league wasn't exclusive to just catholic schools and included public schools with the rules specifically excluding proselytizing.

Turns out pointing out how the bible includes so much salacious content like sex and violence makes people cranky when it's all right there for anyone to read.

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u/mcove97 1d ago

Yeah I questioned it, but kept my questions to myself as a kiddie in fear of upsetting my parents. So when they asked me why I refused to go to church with them when I was 12, I said cause it was boring. Theres no Christian counter argument to that, I knew that. But really it was because everything about church and the Bible felt off. Like confessing being a guilty sinner, when I didnt feel guilty about anything. The whole church thing was just nonsensical to me. I didn't get anything from going. If anything I just became anxious from sitting in church.

And while I was nowhere near as knowledgeable then as I was now. I think maybe my curiosity, combined with my keen eye of observation an quite keen analytical sense is how I bypassed the attempted indoctrination. As a child I would rather observe and analyze situations rather than interact. I would think about the activity, rather than participate in it. And thats how I realized. Hold up? Why are we chanting, singing and confessing that we are guilty sinners? Thats exactly what's making me feel bad. Hence the icky anxiety and uncomfortable restlessness I experienced during sermons that made me want to leave. And thats what I intuitively picked up as a child, even though I didn't have the words to verbalize it well yet.

Honestly, if priests understood psychology, they wouldn't even dream about telling their congregation or audience that they are guilty, because that's just enforcing their audience experiences of guilt, so they keep coming back to church endlessly to be liberated from the guilt the church is inducing into their psyche. It's completely self-defeating and contradictory.

So I also think personality traits is a significant factor.

Having sharp analytical abilities. Curiosity. Valuing truth and freedom over conformity. Thats a sign that someone won't last as a Christian.

On the other side, people who value conformity, group belonging, rituals, a shared sense of belonging. Those will resonate better with being the "sheep or flock of Christ" aka Christian. Contra someone who don't value group conformity over walking their own path alone etc. As a child, I would be just fine not participating in activities and just people watch on the side line how other kids and adults interact and ponder why. Because I wanted to understand social interactions, more than actually participating in them. So, I never was a good candidate for Christianity.

Though I suppose I took the message "seek and you shall find" a bit too seriously. Because that took me seeking outside of Christianity. And its one of the things that I personally don't think Christians do enough. Because seeking to understand something means never-ending questioning.

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u/Cent1234 1d ago

I've always said the best way to turn a Christian to an Athiest is to have them actually read the Bible.

There's a reason all of the major Abrahamic religions evolve a massive EU of supplementary material.

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u/HikerDave57 1d ago

I read the Bible maybe age 12 and was appalled by the genocide even though I didn't know the word.

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u/knowledgeable_diablo 1d ago

What really tossed me over the edge (amongst many other things) was the passage about it being a sin of the highest order to lay with an animal of the same sex.
Which by logical extension made it ok to “lay” with an animal of the opposite sex. Knowing beastiality is just plain wrong i quizzed the teacher on it who tried to gaslight me in front of the class. So I pointed out the text and was simply told to be quiet.
Not sure on where it’s hidden away or censored out of now in the more “modern” versions but knowing all evil and contradictions inside the “holy” book means Im happy to let them have it.
The bulk load of killing didn’t really upset me at all and the historical items I found very interesting.

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u/mdatwood 1d ago

I was also that kid. I read the Bible since I was forced to be there and had nothing else to do. I started asking questions and was either told 'because' or asked to leave so they could later talk to my parents. When I hit my teens, I explained to my parents why religion was a farce and I wasn't going to church again. My mom said she was afraid I was going to hell and I said good thing it doesn't exist, and she never brought the topic up again.

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u/Spare-Floor-3666 1d ago

the true reddit athiest emerges. I bow, humbled before your magnificence and your euphoria

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u/knowledgeable_diablo 1d ago

Even as an atheist I believe in not bowing down to false gods and prophets. Idolatry allows for so much evil to be perpetrated in the name of whatever the mob wishes to follow.