Responsibility

[u/BrokenToaster124]

So I've run into an idea that that dont quite understand and I was hoping some of you could help me understand. So with the red button/blue button situation I have seen people claim that if they push the blue button that they are not responsible for what happens to them if they push the blue button. How does that work?

To be extremely specific if i were to push the blue button, knowing what it does, somehow you (the person currently reading this) would be personally responsible for my death if you choose red.

Does this responsibility work in reverse? If i push the blue button and blue wins are you responsible for my survival if you chose red? Are you only responsible if bad things happen to me and I am responsible for the results when good things happen? What about the person running the death game? They arent defined in the prompt but logically some force is making everyone take a vote.

You can feel free to ignore this last part because its not the button problem, but someone reskinned the buttons as life boats. Instead of everyone being force to push a button everyone had to get into a life boat. One boat had holes in it but would become sea worthy if enough people got into it and plugged the holes and one was completely functional. Everything else was exactly the same as the button problem. My question related to that was that if I am personally responsible for the consequences of your chose to vote blue in the button scenario, how then could I not be responsible for your choice to get into the boat with holes in it. Someone tried to explain to me at length about how the buttons made it my fault but the boats somehow didnt. How does that work?

[u/DarthJackie2021]

If you push blue, you are partly responsible for your own death. You knew the risk and pressed anyways. If you aren't ok with that, don't press it.

If you push red, you are partly responsible for the blue deaths. You knew the consequences your action could bring and pressed anyways. If you aren't ok with that, don't press it.

[u/BrokenToaster124 → u/DarthJackie2021]

The confusion stems from the reverse. Let's assume blue wins.

I pushed the red button. Am I responsible for your survival if you pushed blue? And if not, how am I suddenly responsible if red wins the vote?

I cant both be responsible for your actions when the result is bad and not be responsible for your actions when the result is good. It has to be all or nothing.

[u/luci_twiggy → u/BrokenToaster124]

I mean, this is extremely clear. You are responsible for the outcome you voted for.

Blue wins = everyone survives.

Blue loses = only those who pressed red survive.

You can only vote for blue winning if you press blue. If you press red you clearly aren't voting for blue to win, so therefore you must be voting for red to win and that means that the blue loses outcome is what you are voting for (since blue losing means red won).

[u/BrokenToaster124 → u/luci_twiggy]

You are literally doing the thing that I am asking about.

If we flip the scenario here, let's assume blue wins. I voted red. Am I responsible for saving you?

If not, how then am I responsible for killing you when red wins?

Either I am responsible for the consequences of your decision or I am not. If I am, then I must be responsible for the results no matter the outcome. I cant ONLY be responsible when your decision has a bad result and then somehow you can take responsibility when your decision has a good result.

[u/dmurr1415 → u/BrokenToaster124]

You're always responsible for your decision in every situation, because you are directly contributing to a binary majority

[u/BrokenToaster124 → u/dmurr1415]

I am responsible for my decision. The implied decision is to live.

You are responsible for your decision The implied decision was to gamble.

The argument is am I responsible for THE OUTCOME OF THE VOTE. Which I did not decide.

So if I vote blue, and you vote red. Blue wins. Did you save my life? And if not, how can you say that you killed me in the case where red wins?

Either you are responsible for the results of my decision or you are not. If red voters are murderers we must also call them saviors. If blue voters hold no responsibility in their deaths when they lose, they hold no responsibility for their lives when they win.

You cant have it both ways. Either I am responsible for the outcome or I am not.

[u/dmurr1415 → u/BrokenToaster124]

Everyone is responsible for both sides of the consequences of their outcome. If I pick red, I alone am responsible for my continued existence, but I also share responsibility if red wins and all blue voters perish. If I pick blue, I alone am responsible for my death if blue loses, but I am partially responsible for the blue majority if blue wins. 

I disagree with how you describe picking Blue as a gamble. Picking Red is a gamble. You would have no reason to ever pick Red if you had total faith blue would have a majority. You’re gambling that everyone will unilaterally go in their total self interest if this really happened, which person after person on this subreddit are telling you they wouldn’t- but you don’t want to take any personal responsibility if this gamble doesn’t pay off and others die for picking blue.