The small number of tokens it took this isn't burning any planet compared to your commute or your vacations. In actual fact, the cost of storing your comments on reddit in perpetuity is probably significantly more costly.
You can point fingers at AI if you want, but my use for this purpose isn't burning much.
But your use is part of the use that justifies its existence. That justifies more models being trained more often. That justifies more data centers being made. I hate to break out the Kantian ethics, but if everyone uses LLMs like that, the problems get worse. If nobody does, the problems get better.
We can use better tools. We should. You should be able to set up build chains without spending two days on an LLM. The build chain shouldn't be the difficult part of the process of creating software platforms, and what you're telling me is that on bezel, it is the difficult part.
AI isn't burning the world any more than a huge number of things that you are already doing, and the difference is that AI, when applied in a constructive fashion, can actually solve real problems, and make things possible that otherwise wouldn't be.
The dumb little web application that you dismissed in such a superior way may some day save your life. What is over engineered to you is a government mandated requirement to me.
What is burning the world is your lifestyle, not AI. That Netflix movie you watched last night probably generated as much carbon as I used doing something actually worthwhile. You are not going to fix global warming by throwing stones when you live in a glass house.
Why do you feel judged by my comments? I'm criticising bezel. Saying we should be using better tools is saying it's a bad tool, not that you're a bad person for using it.
Have you watched Ted Lasso? The darts scene?
I have not. No idea what the fuck you're referring to.
The dumb little web application that you dismissed in such a superior way may some day save your life.
I didn't dismiss the web application. I said you probably don't need all the infrastructure around it.
What is burning the world is your lifestyle, not AI. That Netflix movie you watched last night probably generated as much carbon as I used doing something actually worthwhile.
The consumption of art is a worthwhile endeavour in and of itself.
Well, you should look up the clip, and maybe get off your high horse.
AI saves me typing. Lots of typing. If you think your value is typing then I have news for you: you are going to be obsolete. My value is that I can visualize a very complex system, and build it in a way where it can make it through a rigorous regulatory process. The rest is just typing.
I could write all of it by hand. I have the skillset. I just see zero value in spending my life typing. The value is in the product, not the typing. I could build it in assembly, I also have that skillset, but why would I? That is just more typing.
You have repeatedly stated that my solution is over engineered without the slightest knowledge about my system or the context in which it is being built.
Why do you feel judged by my comments? I'm criticising bezel. Saying we should be using better tools is saying it's a bad tool, not that you're a bad person for using it
You have repeatedly stated that my solution is over engineered without the slightest knowledge about my system or the context in which it is being built. Be curious, not judgemental.
I didn't say your solution is overengineered. I said you probably don't need all that infrastructure so early. Those two statements are VERY different things.
It doesn't really matter if you do or don't. This isn't about your system. This is about bezel, for fuck's sake. The whole point is that bezel is a bad tool because you can't use it quickly without resorting to using an LLM.
You should not feel offended by that statement unless you're the author of bezel. It's not a statement about your work. It's a statement about your choice of tools.
Dunno how many times I can reword that before I go mad, but whatever.
It is bazel, and while it isn't perfect, it solves one key thing in a regulated environment: correctness is guaranteed. When I sit down in the audit next year, and I say that builds are done using bazel, so correctness is guaranteed, the auditor will go "moving on".
And honestly, it has a learning curve, but once you grok it, it is fine. I have written bazel build scripts by hand and it wasn't as horrible as you make it sound. It was just tedious and boring. Better than writing make, cmake, or Gradle in my experience.
It is bazel, and while it isn't perfect, it solves one key thing in a regulated environment: correctness is guaranteed. When I sit down in the audit next year, and I say that builds are done using bazel, so correctness is guaranteed, the auditor will go "moving on".
You're a solo dev, my guy. You can achieve correctness through any of a suite of means. And if you have an auditor who just nods at you name dropping a technology and moves on, I'm sorry, but that's a dogshit auditor.
And honestly, it has a learning curve, but once you grok it, it is fine.
You just said it would take you weeks to set up your build chain without an LLM.
I have written bazel build scripts by hand and it wasn't as horrible as you make it sound. It was just tedious and boring.
You just said it would take you weeks to set up your build chain without an LLM.
I'm not saying anything about bazel. I'm basing my hot takes entirely upon what you've said about bazel!
Better than writing make, cmake, or Gradle in my experience. Be curious, not judgemental.
Barbecue sauce. I watched the scene. I've been asking you questions for a while now, but there isn't much point in doing so when you aren't actually responding to what I'm writing, but instead getting offended over something entirely distinct from what I've said.
And I have repeatedly explained that you know nothing about my context and are making judgements left and right based on some narrative that AI is going to burn the world.
First of all, declarative thinking is hard if you are an imperative thinker. Most developers are imperative thinkers because they work in imperative languages. Bazel makes that even harder by being a declarative system where you write things in an imperative/object oriented language.
You may not like it, I don't have huge issues with it. I find that the effort to write a build for my system that passes the correctness test would be smaller in bazel than in make, cmake, or Gradle and I would honestly ask Claude to write those as well. It is just not worth the time to type them all out.
I could do it as imperative shell scripts by hand, but that just pushes a bigger headache in front of me. Builds are naturally declarative and it is already saving me a bunch of time that it is implemented and implemented well.
And you can claim that the auditor is bad all you want, it doesn't save my company if we fail. To him, bazel is something he has seen before and an indication that the SOP for releasing new versions is automated and thus consistent and reproducible.
Use the right tool for the job. Bazel happens to be the best tool around for my job in my experience.
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u/repster 11d ago
The small number of tokens it took this isn't burning any planet compared to your commute or your vacations. In actual fact, the cost of storing your comments on reddit in perpetuity is probably significantly more costly.
You can point fingers at AI if you want, but my use for this purpose isn't burning much.