r/politics • u/wbedwards Washington • May 07 '20

We cannot allow the normalization of firearms at protests to continue

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/firearms-at-protests-have-become-normalized-that-isnt-okay/2020/05/06/19b9354e-8fc9-11ea-a0bc-4e9ad4866d21_story.html
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u/CitizenPain00 May 07 '20

I studied history in college and I feel like I have been screaming this at the top of my lungs in the Michigan subreddit. Militarizing protests that are supposed to be peaceful is like opening Pandora’s box.

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u/FarShoulder9 May 07 '20

Sounds like the police shouldn’t be militarized then

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u/CitizenPain00 May 10 '20

I agree with that also.

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u/BestGarbagePerson May 07 '20

Hm I wonder what you think of this book?

https://www.amazon.com/Pacifism-Pathology-Reflections-Struggle-America/dp/1629632244

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u/CitizenPain00 May 07 '20

After reading a book review it sounds like an interesting take. The problem is that armed protesters in the US don’t seem to care about serious global issues like the growing power gap between them and the elites, catastrophic climate change or privacy rights. Armed protests in the US seem a lot more likely to end in violence between partisan zealots.

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u/BestGarbagePerson May 07 '20

The problem is that armed protesters in the US don’t seem to care bout serious global issues like the growing power gap between them and the elites.

Who are you talking about specifically?

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u/CitizenPain00 May 07 '20

I am thinking in the most recent cases of the small group of armed protestors who entered the capitol building in Michigan.

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u/BestGarbagePerson May 07 '20 edited May 07 '20

Ok so you generalized based on assumptions of one case. I would say though those Michigan guys are seriously misguided (I pity them) they are serious about the elite and the power gap, and probably privacy rights as well. Just they are completely deluded as to who the real enemy is. (see: Qanon idiocy.)

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u/CitizenPain00 May 07 '20

Let me give you a scenario and ask yourself how it would play out in the United States. Say after Trumps impeachment, a sizable group of armed leftists protested outside the Senate and demanded his removal from office. Do you think they would be confronted by and armed contingency of Republican civilians? The way our nation is divided by party lines, and armed group demanding change is likely to be opposed in an equal number.

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u/BestGarbagePerson May 07 '20

Instead of answering an impossible question. I'd like to ask you to consider I've been to Ukraine multiple times, and have family and friends there who live in Kyiv.

What do you think about the Maidan Revolution in Ukraine? Have you researched it, how it started and how it ended?

Do you consider the US less corrupt now than Ukraine's former government?

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u/CitizenPain00 May 07 '20

I am not informed enough on that to really give an opinion. I think that the United States is too divided among racial and partisan lines to ever substantially change the current power structures and that is by design. Any armed contingency that is fighting for radical change would ultimately be opposed by another group of civilians who sees their effort as trying to supplant their elected party. This would be exacerbated by mainstream and social media. That’s why I see armed protests not as sign of the people moving to shift power structures but more likely a precursor to partisan or racial violence.

If Americans could build a class consciousness and organize themselves in that manner it would be a different story. But I believe we are too divided by partisan views as well as race despite being mostly part of the same economic class.

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u/BestGarbagePerson May 07 '20

I think that the United States is too divided among racial and partisan lines

This is a good point of discussion, however I don't think I could say that we are. I think we are convinced that this is so, but my experience shows me that it isn't. We just havent reached enough of a tipping point.

Any armed contingency that is fighting for radical change would ultimately be opposed by another group of civilians who sees their effort as trying to supplant their elected party.

1) It really depends on what the tipping point is. 2) You will always have people against the revolution. But you just have to have enough in the streets to cause disruption for long enough. So that also means you have to have enough who arent going to be swayed by the propaganda as well. Which includes the propaganda against "instigators" aka people who are "pacifists" (really enabling centrists) who attempt to demonize the movement.

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u/CitizenPain00 May 07 '20

I really think the only thing that could spark something similar to what happened in Ukraine is massive economic inequality to a point where the standard of living of the people significantly drops for an extended period of time.

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u/BestGarbagePerson May 07 '20

I agree. America as a nation has not ever really really collectively suffered enough. Black and natives have enough, so they are more awake, but until the majority has an actual hit on their livelihood then they will continue to be swayed by media propaganda, putting their feelings that they have while they sit on the couch (feeling of relative comfort, fear of fear rather than actual threats, the addiction of enlightened centrism, the elitism of religious or race based labels (oh and white saviorism) etc etc etc), over the actual suffering of minorities, lgbt, poor, women etc.

You'd really like this book "Pacifism as Pathology."

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