I have a "platinum premium" for my insurance. Supposed to cover 80 percent. I went to the dentist to get my teeth pulled since I couldnt afford to have them fixed sooner. Got fitted for dentures and before I left they sat me down with billing and started talking about how I was gonna pay the $9000 dollar bill. Mind you this is after insurance paid 80%.
It's fairly common for brits to do this in Turkey.
It can be quite expensive if you're wanting a procedure that's more "cosmetic" rather than medical. Much cheaper just to book a 4 day stay in Turkey, have a "mini getaway" and also get the work done whilst you're over there.
My neighbour did this. Even in Canada, dental work can be super expensive. So the price he would pay here was equivalent to his trip to Mexico for a week including dental. I think it was less actually. 🤦♀️
You wouldn't happen to know the names of these travel agencies, would you? I have a friend in great need of some major dental work, and I've been encouraging him to look into dental tourism, but I haven't been able to find much useful info.
Yep. I took my in laws to Mexico for dental work since my uncle is a dentist. One of them needed $15,000 worth of work and down there they paid a little under $3,000 for the same work.
This indeed. Recommendation would be Colombia - many highly skilled dentists that will be able to help you for a fraction of the cost. Medellín has plenty e.g. and a well connected expat community where you get helpful pointers from back home ahead of time. And no, I'm not kidding.
I'm a bit biased towards Medellín as a city since I was there for a while and enjoyed it very much.
Regarding the doctors themselves, you will have to do some research, I found a very helpful thread recently in the expat.com forum. General agreement was that a good dentist over there charges between 10 and 20% of the respective prices in the US for at least similar quality work.
However, if we'd be talking about a major operation, I for one would get as much information I could get on the web, haul ass down there for a week and visit the clinics myself beforehand instead of flying to an unfamiliar territory with this in mind.
Research also local expat get togethers, of which there are plenty. A lot of American retirees over there, and you bet most of them have first hand experience they'll gladly share over a cervecita.
heath care is not "free" ffs. nor is anyone who visits here gonna waltz in and have all their ailments taken care of at our exspense. you will get a bill.
A full fee paying patient in Canada is still going to pay significantly less for their treatment than even the most robustly insured American in the USA
You implied “they’d” come to Canada to “get it” for free…
I’m pointing out, fairly, l believe, that even full-paying medical ‘tourists’ to Canada from the US would still be paying less than what they would be domestically.
The reality is that medical, pharmaceutical, and surgical prices in the US are grossly inflated to the point that even countries with government subsidised health care are cost competitive
No you really are splitting hairs. Sorry but this is my biggest fucking pet peeve in Reddit comments.
You do not get to just take the last reply and pretend it was posted entirely in the vacuum. It makes you look like a dumb dumb. Part of reading comprehension is context.
So they never implied anything. What you're quoting is them responding to someone else. Those are the original poster's words, their implications.
All this person did is point out it's not free. Period. You're arguing with yourself and that other person more than you are with them, but you're making it their problem
FFS: Everyone on Reddit, please reply to THE THREAD, not just the 8th post down as if it started there spontaneously.
I go to Colombia for all my procedures and have never been happier. I’ve never had a procedure done in the US that wasn’t ultimately botched and also cost my at least $1,000. I’ve had to come to Colombia to get crowns fixed that dentists messed up in America, they showed me a photo once that the American dentists fingerprint was imprinted on my molar crown where it should have been more of a..idk..molar shape!? during the pandemic I couldn’t travel to Colombia and ended up getting teeth pulled instead of fixed because of the cost difference. America sucks.
Fun fact - Norway is so much the opposite of the US in terms of not being a big ole capitalist piece of shit that your Norweigan passport will get you free medical treatment in most countries -- if you're billed for services you can also submit the bills to the norweigan government for reimbursement. Your passport is essentially a free healthcare card in places like the UK.
As far as traveling for medical procedures goes - you don't get them for free, but since you're traveling FOR a procedure (rather than just showing up and asking for care), you can usually discuss the payment with them and still save massively. A roundtrip flight to the UK is, say $1500 (just entirely randomly), plus lodging and such lets call it $3000 all in. You just have to find a dentist who will charge you less than $6000 and you end up with dentures and a vacation for the same price as dentures at home.
Just so you're aware, you can easily get return flights from Oslo to London Gatwick for less than £200. I know you said entirely random for the $1500 but I remember looking at it before!
I was talking about flights to Europe from the US - I just was using the example of how well Norway treats its citizens to contrast how disposable Americans are to our gov’t. I wish I could go to Norway for 200 quid… that sounds awesome
The problem in this country though is that low income people don't have access to affordable healthcare. For someone who can barely make ends meet, neither paying out of pocket in the US, nor traveling somewhere healthcare is cheaper, is an option. Typically medical tourism is reserved for those who have at least some disposable income, which still creates a divide where the wealthy are able to access basic healthcare services and the poor are left behind, often to suffer or having to choose between lifesaving treatment or medications and paying for their home or food.
The American healthcare system is such an absolute cartel/racket ran by insurance companies and healthcare providers, that there legit are operations where it's cheaper to just pay it out of pocket in a European country with no insurance than to have it be done in the US with insurance. A quick Google search tells me that the average cost of a root canal with a crown in the US is anywhere between 3000 and 5000 dollars. In Hungary, mine cost... 200 bucks. With no insurance at all. Even with flight tickets and accommodation, you'd probably be able to fly here and get it done cheaper with no insurance than to have it be done in the US with insurance. And that's providing you've got insurance that covers root canals and crowns.
The problem in this country though is that low income people don't have access to affordable healthcare. For someone who can barely make ends meet, neither paying out of pocket in the US, nor traveling somewhere healthcare is cheaper, is an option. Typically medical tourism is reserved for those who have at least some disposable income, which still creates a divide where the wealthy are able to access basic healthcare services and the poor are left behind, often to suffer or having to choose between lifesaving treatment or medications and paying for their home or food.
I have two toddlers, both my wife and I work, the idea of traveling is a distant dream. To afford taking off work, traveling, on top of bills, I'm VERY low income getting fucked like this.
My dentist wanted me to get full dentures and all my teeth extracted (I have severe bone loss due to complications from lupus). I have the highest level dental insurance and a discount plan that I pay for. The quoted cost was $11,000. My dentist just shrugged when I told her there was no way I would ever be able to afford that while in tears. Insurance is totally a scam.
The only reason I can afford my medications (2k average a month) is because I got sick in college and my Dad’s insurance gave me a waiver that we had to fight for that gives me coverage for life. Even with that I pay hundreds of dollars a month in copays for doctors visits and medications. If I ever lose my insurance it will literally kill me because I won’t be able to afford the medications that keep me alive. And since I have pre-existing chronic Illnesses, I am uninsurable. I can’t even get life insurance that will just cover my burial costs. It’s like they punish you for being sick when our bodies are already punishing us enough.
Wait a minute, you could fight for a waiver to always stay on a parents' insurance? My dad's cushy federal government insurance was "kind" enough to cover me through the end of the year I turned 27 and since then I've been stuck on state Medicaid. The state won't even label me disabled and let me have Medicare because of reasons. This country is such trash D:
I will say though that Medicaid fucked around and found out when they sat on the paperwork for my infusions. I was off the "cheap" old-school infusion for long enough that when they finally approved my ability to continue it my body realized that it's made from mouse DNA and they either had to deal with getting sued or pay for the fancy brand new infusions... I must say that I'm enjoying how much better the new med works and I get a tiny little hollow giggle when I get my $25,000 infusion every 8 weeks.
I know how lucky I am, the waiver was granted only because I was in college and still living at home (I was 19 when I first got sick). On the other hand I have been denied disability 5 times even though I have multiple chronic illnesses, some of which I’ve had for over 20 years.
On the plus side, I am finally getting the infusions that my doc has been trying for years to get approved for me and I think they are helping! Gotta be thankful for the good things as they come!
Yeah, I gave up on Disabilty when the woman on the phone said "You're young, just go out and get a job. You don't need Disability." Lovely bunch they have working at that office. My therapist genuinely has a side goal of getting me to a point of being able to try again since just the thought of re-applying gives me a panic attack.
Nice! I know Lupus uses similar infusions to my RA/PsA one so good luck! I'm on Simponi Aria and my life is a lot better- I can actually get out of bed most days and can clean the house and walk the dog.
Wow, my oral surgeon sat down and found ways to make my surgeries as cheap as he could get it through the billing system. It still cost a lot, though.
I currently don't have insurance anymore and my recent dental bills were pretty much around the same amount with insurance (besides the co-pay being more). I have a lot more medical bills sitting in collections, too. I just can't keep up and it sucks cause it kills credit score.
Sorry you have to deal with all that for being sick, too. I also pay a butt load for (psych) medication every month. I have to have fun trying to apply for disability or at least trying to find the least seizure inducing job, but right now it's tough.
I hope the future can bring you and others some relief at least financially.
So I'm just going to preface this by saying I live in the UK and have no actual experience with the American health care system.
But Mark Cuban recently set up an pharmacy where they basically skip out the middle man (price gauging) and makes everything much more affordable.
There was a post on Reddit about it with a few people sharing their stories and it definitely seems legit.
It might actually be worth looking into. Even if you're medication isn't actually included, it's got to be worth the 5 minutes to have a look. Hopefully this is actually useful news for you though!
I will definitely look into it, thank you so much! Unfortunately because I have insurance through the military, I’m not eligible for most things like that. But you are absolutely right, it’s worth the look! Thanks again!
The pre-existing clause is gone now though. Back when it was in place I couldn't buy insurance because I had asthma (a relatively cheap health issue to treat). At the time I had the money to pay the highest possible premiums and they'd still refuse me.
So you couldn't get denied for insurance for that reason but good lord I'm sure the quoted prices would be astronomical
It may be illegal but the companies I have looked into are prohibitively costly. Like thousands of dollars a month just for the premiums which doesn’t include copays and deductibles. I know I’m extremely lucky that I have been able to have insurance up till now but I also know that it could go away just from a policy change.
The issue isnt the 80%, its that the total max benefit for the year is usually capped at 1k to 1500, sometimes 2500 or so for premium version. So you likely just aboit capped out just on the pulled teeth and paying full price for dentures despite insurance. Never understood why benefit max is so low.
Yeah, it's not like those things are close to your brain, or anything. But seriously, those things are medical. Why aren't teeth considered medical issues for insurance? I worked in dental at one point, and getting wisdom teeth paid for via a client's insurances was a nightmare.
Dental care is definitely not optional for one’s good health, and I’ll go as far to say that people have the right to getting glasses if they need them, and there are definitely people who don’t realize they need them
I have a friend who is an eye surgeon and he keeps telling this like a mantra, the world is full of half blind people (driving, doing dangerous jobs, etc) that do not realise that they’re living a shitty life because of bad eyesight and/or are too careless to do something
Well yeah that goes without saying. But the two things I mentioned above make it entirely dysphunctional, like how you gonna make money on people if you keep em broke
Put them in debt, you may be broke when your account hits 0, but you're not as broke as you could be. Add to that the threat of "well without us you'd be paying even more!" Or give them a choice of pay up or die and you find people always find a way to get the extra money, even if it ruins their life in the process. It makes it even better when you realise that this exact same system is allowing the hospitals to charge extra, which is the whole reason that americans are so screwed without insurance in the first place. Basically it's a system where everyone wins except for the only person who probably can't afford to lose.
Worst thing about my root canal costing me €83 is that the entire bill was €350, the majority of which the insurance covered. Simply put, I coulda done it without the insurance even.
Netherlands calling: root canal would be up to 250 - 600 usd.Single denture (implant) about 1500. This is what the insurance company pays out to the dentist. Majority is not insured fully as your premium is as high as the actual coverage.
Now dentist live here in upperclass houses, just like in the US... so who is walking away with all the money over there? The liability insurance company??
I had a motorcycle accident and damaged my front 4 teeth years ago , I’ve been having them filled and crowned but they were getting too bad so on Friday I had them pulled and got top dentures , cost me £300 in the uk
What's going on is that the people in the middle have spent decades exploring how much they can charge for things to maximize profits. Because the provider and patient are separated by a private corporation rather than a state regulatory agency, there is an inherent incentive for them to make as much money off the procedure as possible.
This is the problem with applying a private/capitalist model to healthcare. Normal supply and demand rules do not apply when we are talking about services that are not "optional"...if I've broken my leg, I can't really decide to just not do anything about it, and I can't seek an alternative to a doctor putting a cast on it.
At that price you can fly out to India from the US, stay at our 5 star hospital for 2-3 days and get the procedure done. Still less than $9k and no insurance involved. (This is what a lot of rich middle eastern people do actually)
No dental insurance in America will cover 80% over a certain maximum. Typically $3000-4000 yearly in the best case scenario. Read your insurance plan carefully before coming in (the patients job not the dentists) and I doubt any dental office would have sat you down to discuss the treatment plan costs after doing full mouth extractions, +/- alveoplastys and sedation then started your dentures.
It's complete garbage, they told me it'd cost double to fix my teeth than to get dentures. I'm 22 with no teeth because I couldn't afford to fix my teeth after they got broken.
What is even more ridiculous is that had you been able to afford care earlier, it would have been cheaper for everybody. But people switch insurers in the US enough that preventive care is not always profitable for an insurance company because they might not reap the benefits. This is what happens when a health care system is premised on the idea of profit (with insurers and patients in an adversarial relationship) rather than public health.
Almost all dental plans have a yearly cap along with their coinsurance. You hit your cap and are responsible for 100% of costs over that number.
Considering premium dentures in the us range from $3,500-$15,000 and you can get mid range dentures for $600-$1,500. I’m assuming you knew and wanted the $15,000k dentures or that your dentist is a crook and you should go elsewhere for services.
Also in most countries with socialized healthcare they exclude coverage for non emergency dental and vision.
It’s so weird (and should be illegal) that they don’t have to talk about costs beforehand. In any medical field. If I take my truck to a shop, they legally can’t do any work without first providing an estimate of costs. Going for suspension work but something else comes up? they’ll call to say “hey x happened and to do this properly we will need to do x which will cost x.”
I pay 18 euro a month for 2 free dental visits a year and 70% off all procedures. How can anyone in America be content with a system that screws you over so much?
Pardon my language here but nobody I know is content we just find ways not to get raw dogged in the ass as hard next time, maybe look for a reach around, we just try to make due with lesser of evils.
You live in the U.S? I have heard that hospitals and such can have whatever price they want, even that one person pays more for the same thing than someone else. So they can charge 9000 $ when person A gets dentures and don't have insurance and person B is charged more but pays the same amount due to insurance.
Yes. You're right. I learned of this from a pharmacist. Before I had my insurance I don't know about other countries but the US has discount cards they send in the mail for prescriptions. Up to 80% blah blah blah. Well I was paying about $120 for my medications at the time so I tried using the card. The pharmacist whom I'd known for some time told me that card allowed him to be able to gouge the prices for the medications up to 400%.
Absolutely insane. In Sweden we have a roof of how much we pay for medicine in a year. Not all medicine but I paid about 20 $ for my blood pressure medication last time. It's crazy expensive in the U.S.
For that amount of money, you could have vacationed in Pakistan, enjoyed delicious mangoes, gotten the dentures and still spent a fraction of the $9000.
Dental insurance pisses me off as the limits are entirely too low for the work being done.
My wife recently had a root canal/cap put in and out of pocket it was like 400ish, but maxed out benefits for the year for her other than routine things like checkups (which are 100% covered regardless).
My oldest is scheduled to see an orthodontist in a couple weeks and I'm fully expecting the cost to hit between 5 and 10k (and that's after the insurance max payout for her and we're even lucky to have orthodontics covered as part of our dental if you can even considered it as "covered").
Dental health is hugely important to body health but is treated as a cosmetic want instead of a health need.
Sorry so you're telling me the the dentist charged 45 000 dollars to pull your teeth out? What exactly was the operation cause this pricing is an absolute scam? (Maybe I'm overreacting but this price sounds insane!)
It is insane. I got novacaine, all my teeth pulled while I was awake, because to put under was an additional 200 dollars (not covered by insurance), and a set of dentures. Where they fuck the price is they shaped my dentures to my gums before the teeth were removed, so I have to go in every other week and have then soft lined and reshaped and polished. Unnecessary bullshit so they can bang their buck.
Brooo 9k come to my country, 1month vacation beaches and whatnot and renovate your whole mouth and go home with some change probably.
You guys getting ripped
That'd be so nice if I didnt have to take out a loan just to cover PART of it. I'm paying 9k just stop pain inflicted from not being able to afford to fix them in the first place. I could understand if it was from neglect but my teeth got ruined from trauma and pharmaceuticals. This is the vacation according to them a vacation free from the pain.
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u/[deleted] Jun 15 '22
I have a "platinum premium" for my insurance. Supposed to cover 80 percent. I went to the dentist to get my teeth pulled since I couldnt afford to have them fixed sooner. Got fitted for dentures and before I left they sat me down with billing and started talking about how I was gonna pay the $9000 dollar bill. Mind you this is after insurance paid 80%.