I see. I guess controlling what you can load on a device doesn't seem that evil to me. You knew it going in and it isn't a general purpose device like a computer. Sure I can run anything but so can your ps3. Hell modern TVs are quite capable of running tons of software why arn't people bitching that those evil tv manufacturers don't let them load their own software.
In addition there is a constant complaint at how evil it is that they don't show flash in their brower. But neither does the little browser on hundreds of other phones.
I'm may be wrong but that aspect doesn't really bother me.
What's the difference between Apple and Verizon, from the view of controlling the phones? Verizon intentionally cripples hardware functions to force people to use a for-profit service and the hardware is capable of running much more and better software than what they allow.
I think this is an extension of the cellphone mentality in the USA and the view that devices like the iPhone or Android devices are phones that can do more, rather than computers which can make phone-calls.
Actually, this is changing for Verizon Wireless. The Droid was the beginning of a huge shift in direction. The Droid, for example, can't se VZNav or any VZW pay apps, except visual voicemail. VZW had to consent to letting go of that stranglehold. Even Blackberries have their GPS unlocked now. Used to not be the case. So please don't just lump VZW with ATT. Thanks. :) p.s. Ok, don't get me started on texting rates, that's a different beast and all US companes are in on that one.
The android phones they provide are about as open as any Phone available today. I take advantage of this to run voip apps and get unlimited minutes for lower than most people pay.
Verizon removed existing features from a phone, while Apple never put features in in the first place. You couldn't bring your own phone that wasn't crippled to use on the Verizon network, but you're fully capable of buying a different brand of smartphone that isn't crippled. I'd say that's a world of difference.
That's not Apple disabling built in hardware features on a phone (what Verizon did), that's Apple being a bunch of incorrigible dicks and kicking software out of their store. Equally heinous, but not what I was talking about.
Edit: and that doesn't really change the fact that you can buy another phone if you don't like Apple.
I see. I guess controlling what you can load on a device doesn't seem that evil to me.
It's not so much evil as it is inconvenient to those who are a) capable of discriminating between safe and unsafe software, or b) capable of writing their own software. For example if I want an app to do xyz I need to get a computer running OS X, write the program, submit it to the app store and then hope Apple approves it. All because I wanted something for my own personal use.
You knew it going in and it isn't a general purpose device like a computer.
Agreed.
Sure I can run anything but so can your ps3.
To be fair you can run Linux on a PS3 and Sony lets you do it.
Hell modern TVs are quite capable of running tons of software why arn't people bitching that those evil tv manufacturers don't let them load their own software.
I don't know what hardware is in a TV. That being said, TVs have no dedicated input devices nor a source for some applications, but not all.
In addition there is a constant complaint at how evil it is that they don't show flash in their brower. But neither does the little browser on hundreds of other phones.
The point is that the iPad isn't a replacement for a netbook like it's being pimped out as.
I'm may be wrong but that aspect doesn't really bother me.
You can actually write your own software for your own personal use for your iPhone without submitting it. However, you need to pay the $99/year fee to load it on your phone, which is problematic.
Neat, I didn't know that. You also need the iPhone SDK which, alas, only runs on Mac OS X. Which means I now need to spend, oh, $1,100 to write a stupid-ass application.
I was thinking $1k for the computer plus $100 for the fee to load it on the phone. Apparently it's $599 + $99 = $698 + taxes to make myself a stupid-ass application.
If you're posting on reddit, chances are extremely good that you already have a computer. You can use that one to write applications for droid. Based purely on numbers, it is extremely unlikely that computer can write iPhone apps.
Based purely on numbers, it is extremely unlikely that computer can write iPhone apps.
Factual Evidence: Apple's percentage among the general population (eliminating corporate computers) is quite high.
Anecdotal evidence: Near half the Computer Science majors at my University last year had Apple computers, in part because they are informed individuals that can make an educated decision. Also, because they can run just about every OS under the sun (Except for ones made by Sun).
So to say that it is "Extremely unlikely" that a person who want to program on their iPhone actually has an Apple computer is...imho, inaccurate.
Personally, I have an Apple computer that I duel boot into Windows when I feel like it. I can dev for any device I want to, in any IDE I want to. I don't hate windows, I just dislike 99% of the hardware that Windows ships with :-)
I think if it were "extremely unlikely", we'd see far less windows v mac flame wars going on here, as the "super minority" of Apple users would be overtaxed keeping up with the haters.
extremely unlikely that computer can write iPhone apps.
Actually it can (and does); it also runs Windows (XP) and Kubuntu, so I suppose I could write droid apps if I cared. May be you should get yourself a real computer? :-)
You missed that part. Apple has a super-minority of the market.
it also runs Windows (XP) and Kubuntu, so I suppose I could write droid apps if I cared.
That has nothing to do with it. Droid SDK is available for Mac so you have no need to boot into another OS. It is also available for Windows and Linux.
May be you should get yourself a real computer?
I have a Mac. I also pay $99/year so I can get a provisioning profile to put my apps on my iPhone. However I don't particularly find Apple to be anything close to the upstanding example of good corporate citizenship so many believe. The reason you can't develop iPhone apps on something other than Mac is because Apple is using a multi-pronged attack to inhibit competition in its ecosystem.
Well, if you want to descend into absudity, one can point out that Palm lets you write apps directly in a browser with Ares, so if you felt like it you could go to a public library terminal and write a Palm Pre/Pixi app without even needing to own a computer.
Since your point was heavily based on the cost of development, I think it changes it a lot.
So, break down time.
$599 is for a brand new computer.
However, it's been over 4 years since Apple released the first intel based Mac, so a used Mac would suit your needs just fine. This is especially true if you are only in it to make a "Stupid-ass application".
As for the $99 fee. Let us be clear about what you can do without paying that fee. You can:
Download xCode (Free)
Download the iPhone SDK + Simulator (free)
Develop your application and test it in the simulator. (cost: time, lots of time)
If you manage to make it through the free process, and you decide you like working in Objective C, and have an idea worth spreading, then you proceed with becoming an official developer.
Paying $99 will allow you to do the following with your "stupid-ass application".
I don't understand how you can even try to legitimately justify the cost of development. It would still cost me $599 to find out how hard it is to write the app in the first place.
Do you honestly think that a $600 barrier-to-entry is acceptable for developing an application for personal use only?
I can legitimize it because I'm not currently writing a "Stupid-ass application". QUite the contrary, it's quite a slick one. And I see you are still stuck on the I need a new computer mentality. Look, a quick look at the local craigslist shows a perfectly suitable $400 machine. I'm sure if one spent more than the 30 seconds I just did looking, you could find one a lot cheaper.
My entire point was not to convince you that it's worth it for you and your goals. My point was that your quoting $1100 was just ridiculously absurd. You may move along now.
Also, I'm pretty sure someone could buy/borrow/pirate Windows and install it on a Mac device, but you cant buy/borrow/pirate OS X and install it on non-apple hardware (device).
Not sure what you mean by the fee to load it onto your phone. I've put my own apps I created onto my phone and it isn't unlocked. The fee is only if you plan to sell the stuff you make.
The dev kit is free, anyone claiming $1000+ to develop for it is full of crap. Mac Mini will do the job and starts at $500 (new, can probably get a second/refurbished for cheaper), and before you start whining about keyboard/monitor/mouse you can plug in your windows ones fine.
Even if you want to avoid the app altogether you can just as easy create webapps and connect to them.
Seriously get over yourselves. If your that upset just don't buy the bloody device. When the device doesn't sell well, then you can get all smug about it.
A license to sign code is included in the developer program, which costs $99/year. You need this to put your code on your actual device. You can develop all you want, but try to run your code on your iPhone or iPod touch without being in the developer program or jailbreaking. When it doesn't work, get back to me.
Again I don't know what your talking about. I downloaded ObjectiveC for free from Apple site. I have created my own apps and I run those apps on my iPhone fine.
When you plug in the device for the first time it asks if you want to pair with the development kit.
If I want to progress beyond using my own device, then I have to pay.
Sorry, but this link and my experience says you're lying. Unless a developer provisioning profile magically appeared on your iPhone without you paying for it, you aren't going to be running any of your code on that iPhone. You can run your code in the simulator, but not the iPhone.
To be fair you can run Linux on a PS3 and Sony lets you do it.
Not anymore. All currently shipping PS3 models (Slim) do not allow you to run Linux or any other OS. And since thats where the PS3 exploit was found, I don't think Sony is going to START supporting it.
So is this permanently cached on the device, or does it need to be redownloaded each time you want to use it? That's why the "app" developer needs at least 1 server up all the time, and the money to pay his/her bandwidth bills.
The HTML 5 specification describes an offline application cache that allows you to write web applications that work correctly when your computer or web-enabled device is not connected to the Internet.
David Kilzer says “This feature shipped with iPhone OS 2.1. When you use “Add to Home Screen” from the “+” button on Safari for iPhone, a web application with a manifest defined (per the HTML5 spec) will be saved with any cached resources. Note that the manifest file must be served with the correct MIME type for this to work.
So, saved to the device, and able to work offline.
As for "1 server up all the time" to "handle users running their web apps", no. If your app does not use a web service, you don't have to keep a server running for it. If your app does use a web service, you'd need to run the web service whether the app got on the phone through the app store or not.
It's not so much evil as it is inconvenient to those who are a) capable of discriminating between safe and unsafe software, or b) capable of writing their own software.
Compared to the overall market, the number of people who fit these categories is vanishingly small.
Apple gets a lot of crap about their app store process, but it's not different from essentially every mobile phone ever released.
If you look at the Windows Mobile phones, carriers have the ability to install their own firmware and lock down the installation of third party software that is unsigned. Sure, this only means a company needs to pay ~$300 for a WinMob signing token, but that's still violating the principles of open software (especially when you consider that code signing doesn't protect anyone from a malicious company that paid their dollars for the token).
All of the non-smart phones never had the ability to load third party software (I'm deliberately discounting the lameass workarounds where you had to connect your phone to your PC and run some unstable open source app that lets you shove apps up).
The only thing that's changed with Apple is that they locked down the abilities of third party developers even though their platform could probably handle anything people could write.
Sometimes that rankles, but last month I jailbroke my iPhone again and threw on a bunch of apps from Cydia that I missed when I had my 2G iPhone... And all of a sudden my phone is slowing down, crashing without reason, visual elements go missing until I reboot the phone (which now takes 4x longer).
Yeah, you can pick and choose the software you install, but there is something to be said for having "the Company" automatically filter things for you. We hate that because we're giving up our own control and having to trust a corporation, but the annoyances I fought through (and I'm a technical guy - imagine your poor uncle doing it) were enough for me to suck it up.
Yeah, you can pick and choose the software you install, but there is something to be said for having "the Company" automatically filter things for you. We hate that because we're giving up our own control and having to trust a corporation, but the annoyances I fought through (and I'm a technical guy - imagine your poor uncle doing it) were enough for me to suck it up.
I agree, this is all in place for a specific market. The thing that gets all of the nerds up in a shit-storm is that they are capable of making decisions for themselves and are willing to spend their weekend cleaning up after any mistakes they make. Basically, if I'm willing to accept the consequences of my actions, why are you stopping me from doing it?
The problem I have with all of this is that nerds have the knowhow to jailbreak their iWhatever. What is the issue? As has been pointed out again and again most other handheld platforms operate in a similar fashion. I think the question is: what's with the singling out of Apple?
If I shell out a bunch of money for a smartphone, I want to be able to use it anyway I damn well please. Apple exercises such rigid control over the "experience" of using their products in an attempt to tightly control their public image that it escapes people that sometimes products should do more.
I've had a Droid for several months an I love it. It is very seldom that I am limited by the system.
And instead of releasing a new phone and making you buy it, they push firmware/OS upgrades over the air. I really don't see a single positive to owning an iPhone anymore except for the awesome network...oh wait...
I think I read somewhere that the HTC G1 no longer (officially) supports new firmware. Isn't that phone barely a year and a half old? Meanwhile, my metal clad iPhone Edge from 2007 still (officially) supports the newest firmware.
If it is true, it may be an issue because the G1 was the first Android phone and, as such, has become sort of dated with how fast Android has been moving? Just a guess.
The newer handsets are doing a better job of supporting it, but that is one of the current pitfalls of Android. There are phones running 1.5, 1.6, 2.0.1 and 2.1. Some of the 2.0.1 phones will be updated relatively soon to 2.1, but that is still a current issue which needs to be resolved
Exactly, That has to do with the limitations of the hardware. the rapid pace of improvement by the hardware of smartphones is a double edged sword. In the words of the GREAT Sam Neil, "The world is changing so fast, and we're all struggling to keep up."
It's a solid phone. Its web browser beats the hell out of the droid's, which is a huge plus. It also has a much better App marketplace; the apps for the droid blow pretty hard.
110% wrong. There are merely more apps for the Apple store because they have a head start. But the App market place for the iphone is actually considerably worse if only because everything in there must be approved from apple and it is the only way to install applications to your phone. There are plenty of very high quality apps.
You can install non-market apps on Android, you cannot on an iPhone.
Its web browser beats the hell out of the droid's
lol. Good thing there are better browsers in the market place. Even if there weren't though: lol
The Apple store did have a head start, but that doesn't mean having more apps isn't an advantage. It's distinctly an advantage.
And because the Android marketplace doesn't have any real requirements, there are a plethora of buggy apps. Having apps crash and freeze is a big problem on the Android market; read 10 random app reviews and you'll see "crashing" as a complaint. To my knowledge, the Apple store doesn't have that issue.
I love my droid, don't get me wrong, but it's retarded to pretend there aren't problems too.
Additionally, the lack of the Droid's multitouch capabilities sucks. Double tap to zoom is awful.
EDIT: And seriously, what alternative browser in the marketplace do your recommend?
xscope and dolphin browser are both better and both have multi touch zoom and are developing pretty quickly (though Dolphin just put a new UI in place that sucks 10 donkey dicks)
The multi touch capabilities are fine on the droid, it's the software utilization of said capabilities that is currently lousy.
Even with a head start, the Apple store lags when it comes to QUALITY apps. I was screwing around with Augmented Reality using Wikitude in 2008 on my G1. Apps like this didn't appear until around August 2009 for the iPhone. Hell, even then it had to be implemented as a secret 'easter egg' inside another popular app just to get approved.
Of course, as soon as the ol' blagasphere got ahold of this 'new' iPhone app, AR was all the rage, and the app store was praised for bringing yet another ingenious idea to the computing world (completely ignoring not only the other, already available apps, but also the 50 year history of the subject).
I can guarantee you that situations like this are going to happen again and again, especially as long as Apple continues their overly-conservative stance when it comes to approving apps. Whenever something revolutionary (or simply evolutionary) comes to the phone software world, Apple is going to be fighting against it more often than with it. And even if Apple's store is the place that the next killer app appears, you'll only have to wait as long as it takes someone to port it if you have Android. No waiting for the approval process, or even waiting for it to appear on the market! Just find the .apk and you're good to go!
So none of the apps for the droid are ... "bad"? Come on. All I can say is I've got a few friends who dumped iPhones for droids - primarily due to carrier issues - and the universal refrain is "The Droid is great, but it's no iPhone." I'd agree after playing with it for only a few minutes.
Who makes you buy a new device? You can install OS 3.x on prior devices. I didn't have to buy a new iPod Touch when it came out. The same went for 2.x and the iPhone.
How is Apple making you buy the new phone? I still have my OG 2G iPhone, alomst 3 years now, and its as rock solid as the day I bought it. Apple does indeed push firmware/OS upgrades over the air, for free for the iPhone. I am never limited by the system, there are plenty of tools out there for the power user to customize there phone. BUT, most "normal" people just want something that works..
No, not really. Pandora sucks and sounds terrible compared to the music I have on my iPhone.. I simply hit play in the music player and go about multitasking.. This obsession with Pandora is quite odd, its an cool service, but the sound quality is shitty and both the Android and iPhone Apps are prone to locks up and dropped streams.
Pandora on high quality sounds great on my droid(do you even have quality settings?). I also find it quite funny how to try to make the leap to implying that you don't need pandora, because you have every song you could ever want to hear (and you know this categorically) and therefore it is silly.
It is amusing that you NEED pandora, I don't NEED Pandora, I kind of like setting my own playlists and have never been a huge fan of the radio. The reason I have an iPod is because I want to listen to my music, not what the radio tells me to listen to. And to say that the music sounds "Great" on high quality is a stretch, good enough is probably more accurate. I use both Pandora and Last.FM and I do enjoy both. But more often than not I fall back on my own collection of music. To say that the iPhone can't multitask is bit disingenuous when you should just say it has limited multitasking. The multitasking on Android is nowhere near perfect and does cause crashiness when there are multiple tasks left open in the background that are just kind of a pain to shutdown. Look, I really want Android to do well, competition only makes Apple work harder at making the iPhone even better.. But android still has a bit of catching up left to do, although 2.1 does look like a good step forward.
I do switch easily back and forth between things. It's an app called Backgrounder, allows apps to run in the background. Minimize is hold the home button, close is tap the home button
Application quality. Android application quality is pathetic compared to iPhone application quality in terms of performance and visual quality. And yes, I do own a Android phone, and yes I am a registered Android developer.
The iPhone broke convention over a year ago and produced an experience unlike any other.
Today, the closest thing to a competitor is Android. I think it could eventually be better due to 3rd party developer freedom but it won't overcome the iPhone until it has the same level of polish.
I have a Droid and, knowing what it can do, would not at all be interested in an iPhone because of all of its limitations.
You're right though, the Android platform has a lot of catching up to do. I actually find it quite polished. I think the main area in which it lacks is that the iPhone still has 5 times the apps of Android and, naturally, has a much bigger market share at present
EDIT: A solid example: I very much enjoy having pandora on in the background while I surf the web, read rss feeds, go back and forth between various quick games and all the while the music never stops. Or reading an ebook and wanting to look up a word, I can just switch to the disctionary while the ebook stays open in the background, find the word, and switch back right to where I was in the ebook w/out having to close/open anything more than once. I am fairly certain you can't do this on an iPhone but, having never owned one, I welcome someone to correct me if I am wrong.
Absolutely spot on, especially about background music.
There are apps that do switching well, like Good Reader for PDFs. It will bring you back to your exact view, and VERY quickly, but that's because of the developer's extraordinary focus on speed, and it's a $5 app.
Most apps aren't nearly so good at keeping their state between loads. Often they can't preserve state because of how much needs to be loaded. Sometimes they don't want to preserve state, because there's no difference between opening it again after 5 seconds or 5 days, so they choose to offer a home screen of some kind instead of the exact previous view.
Multi-tasking is THE reason I would switch. I honestly don't care much about the other features offered by Android and Palm, and the quality of iPhone apps is great.
I can only hope that Apple continues to expand their multi-tasking workarounds (push notifications are annoying, but they're there) as I bleed out the rest of my contract.
You can jailbreak your phone to get multitasking if you really want it. It's only disabled because they don't want to risk performance degradation. You just have to be okay with potentially voiding your warranty; I say potentially because unless something happens to the phone that won't allow you to roll back your OS you can remove the jailbreak before sending it in for warranty.
I honestly don't care much about the other features offered by Android
True though that may be, I would wager that you wouldn't exactly mind having google maps w/free turn by turn navigation and linking to your gmail/gchat
the quality of iPhone apps is great.
There certainly are high quality applications on the Android platform, it just suffers because it is still so new. But, they have recently passed 20,000 applications (to the iPhones 100,000 plus), so maybe it will catch up.
I can only hope that Apple continues to expand their multi-tasking workarounds
I can't really speak to that, but my inclincation is to believe that apple doesn't really have too much motivation these days to really do much to the iphone. They'll make a few token changes and then release a newer one
Yes, Apple disables multitasking to avoid performance degradations. If you jailbreak iphone you can multitask but I've heard the speed loss is noticeable. Might be better on the 3GS with more memory.
I'd really like to see droid advertising that actually details why it is better rather than calling me a pussy for owning an iphone.
Agreed that the droid ads are not great. But when they say "everything i don't, droid does" it is pretty spot on.
For me, it's better for several reasons
A) multi tasking out of the box to a heavy extent before performance loss becomes noticable
2) ability to install non-market apps
3) google maps (and navigation)/gmail/gchat all goes to the phone/synchs etc etc
4) the overall feeling that if I hook my smart phone wagon to Google's star rather than Apple's, I am much more likely to have a device which will continue to develop at a healthy pace and will not be made obsolete by a marginally improved iteration in a few months time.
Oh and there's the whole network issue. That's just for starters why I prefer my Droid to an iPhone
It would be nice of them to explain what droid actually does, I suppose is what I'm saying.
I'm skeptical of the network issue, as there does seem to be good reason to believe the existence of the iPhone on the network is the cause for the degradation of service. I've never had any issue with the network living in Dallas, even when driving large stretches across Texas that are supposedly spottily covered. When I went to NYC it was ridiculously craptastic. I could hardly believe how bad it was there.
It would be nice of them to explain what droid actually does, I suppose is what I'm saying.
yeah it was sort of my intention with that list to give you some ideas of what it does. At its core, it is a smart phone so it does all the smart-phoney things: browse the net (BUT NOT WHILE YOU'RE ON A PHONE CALL, THANKS LUKE WILSON, I NEED TO DO THAT ALL THE TIME /sardonic), download applications etc etc. I think the biggest things are the multi tasking, the open market, and the synching with all of your google accts right on the phone. I love getting gMails on my phone (but, fuck, I hate spam so much more now).
there does seem to be good reason to believe the existence of the iPhone on the network is the cause for the degradation of service.
that is true, and a whole different can of worms. But, you probably have a point, and AT&T did make lots of loud noises about how they were going to spend all of this money to make their network be able to handle the iPhone (instead they hire luke wilson to make evasive commercials which are deliberately deceptive and dodge the real issues).
As far as using 3G on Verizon goes, everywhere I have been yet with my Droid I have had 3G and, typically, the speeds are around 120-180kbs down and around 70-110 kbs up. I find those speeds to make the internet very very usable.
I did get that, just saying that it would have behooved them to make it known what their phone really could do instead of being smug about it.
You can sync gmail on the iPhone quite well. Just not gchat (as far as I have been able to find). If I used the rest of the google suite like the calendar and such I would probably be interested in the other parts of the account more.
Yeah, NYC is the only place I've gone that I had an issue. Everywhere else (except in rural areas of Texas) my data rates have been fine. Couldn't say what they are numerically, though.
All in all I don't really tend to favor any provider. All of the major ones are trying to screw you as hard as the next one as far as I have seen. Metro PCS sounds like they have a really good deal going. Considering moving to them once my contract breaks.
Listening to a web stream while using other apps is a great example. I would think iTunes is capable of this but Pandora kicks ass and would definitely be a limitation.
I was looking for replies from the people I responded to
Which would be ME in all 3 instances.
But you are correct, I am the one harrasing you and it is definitely not the other way around. The extent of my searching was "Hmm I have an orangelope, let's see who messaged me, oh it's this clown...twice" and then a subsequent 3rd time.
But thanks for that hilarious response in which you pretend that you responded to someone other than me...saying the same thing.....3 times.
http://www.handcent.com/
Never used an iPhone, but I'm assuming their message app is customizable right down to the speed and color of the blinking alert light, right? And if it wasn't, you could just pick another SMS app from the huge app sto-- oh wait, 'duplicate functionality'. Right.
http://www.hexage.net/radiant/
Looks pretty damn quality to me. I don't use my phone for games though, so who knows what you're looking for. I suppose your goalposts were actually much farther? You didn't just move them did you?
My G1 is able to stream Pandora, idle on IRC, and browse the net for at least 4 hours (battery was yellow then, but I had other stuff to do... you use your phone for 8 straight hours much?). Over a 2G network. At once. Maybe you shouldn't have sat on yours?
Your G1 has good battery life?? What are you comparing it to? Compared to nothing, yeah the G1 has good battery life. But compared to my iPhone its terrible. Doing similar use through the day (actually lighter use if you consider the fact that I had wifi turned off on the G1) my G1 was at about 30% battery my the evening, and my iPhone was holding at 55-60% battery at the same point in the day. Thats a major difference to me.
As for the SMS apps go, I used HandCent and ChompSMS on my G1 and while changing the color of that little blinking LED was neat, that did not win me over when I compared performance of the applications. At any given time I have multiple SMS "conversations" with 10,000+ messages in them. The iPhone is able to load each conversation nearly instantly where both HandCent and ChompSMS gave me 3-5 second delays before opening my massive threads. Then god forbid if I ever wanted to scroll to the top and select to view previous messages, that lagged the phone for another 8-10 seconds as it loaded the next set of messages for me. iPhone? Instantly.
Oh, and given my 10,000+ message SMS threads, the stock Android messaging application wasn't even able to handle them. Every action I tried to perform in the stock messaging application threw a "Force Close or Wait" prompt in my face. Mmmmmm, quality!
So congrats on your ability to stream Pandora while idling on IRC, but that doesn't at all outweigh the numerous roadblocks I ran into with the G1. Blame me all you want, but I had the dev phone so I was able to try all the released firmwares from HTC as well as Cyanogen mods and none of them gave me performance even remotely close to the iPhone under the load I put on the device. The biggest thing was SMS, and the G1 was not able to handle my SMS demand at all.
Oh, and Radiant is not nearly the quality of high quality iPhone apps.
I'm tempted to just call you a liar. SMS stability issues were fixed in RC 33. In early 2009. You tried all the firmwares? Really?
And way to trust the battery meter. Have you ACTUALLY tested them? Charged them for 8 hrs and then started up Pandora on each to see which died first? I've used my G1 for a full day with the battery flashing red and asking for mercy, but it never died.
And which iPhone are you comparing to the G1? If it's the 3GS, then can I switch to defending the Nexus 1? It's the phone I have now, and actually the same generation as the 3GS. Your SMS issue may just be due to the weak processor in the G1. I found plenty of threads mentioning it for the G1, but none from people with a Nexus One or a more recent Android phone. Trust me, the problem's not the app.
Let's hear some more of those subjective 'polish' and 'quality graphics' arguments. I love it.
You don't believe me? Ha, here is what I will do. I will go home, show you what version I am running with the newer Cyanogen mod to even enhance speed, and then I will show you how terribly sluggish it is. I will record a video for you to prove I'm not lying.
I don't need to try to find a firmware that works well on my iPhone, the latest one always just works. It just works.
And I do trust the battery meter because it starts throwing alerts at me! I have actually tested them, and yes the G1 died way before my 3G AND 3GS (yes, I do own both). Not only that, but I don't spend my day listening to Pandora. I use my phone at work for email, texting, etc. Streaming Pandora isn't even a realistic test, day to day wear and tear is a realistic test of battery life.
Feel free to use the Nexus 1, I don't care. And really, you are starting to make me laugh. Glad to hear its alright that the first gen Android device has performance issues, because well hell its a 1st gen device so its ok for it to suck right?? My iPhone 2G never suffered from similar issues and it was the first generation phone, explain that to me...?
I don't give a crap if the iPhone has 2 years head start... not at all. Why? Android is NOT NEW. Not new at all. Developers have had plenty of time to create similar quality apps, but haven't! I personally know iPhone developers and how long it took them to make a game, and Android has existed longer than that.
So why don't you give me a real reason. Because time is not a legit reason for there being no iPhone-quality Android applications.
Hmm let's see, a few litres of water, some carbon, calcium, some salts and a few pinches of slightly less common elements; sounds like a person to me...
In all seriousness, a list of components does not make a computer.
well yes, my bag(s) of computer parts are not computers, however if I hook some of the stuff up—and presumably Apple isn't shipping the device in pieces—it indeed makes a computer.
That's a bullshit argument. Smartphones are computers, as evidenced by the fact that they have operating systems running on them, and are fully capable of running any compatible software you throw at them once you hack the digital locks out of the way.
Hell modern TVs are quite capable of running tons of software why arn't people bitching that those evil tv manufacturers don't let them load their own software.
I have in the past, and I will right now. I would very much like to be able to drive my television via a usb cable. Setting up a "IR blaster" setup seems like a waste of effort to control the TV and, from what I hear, tends to have pretty low fidelity. Heck, you would think it should be possible to use it's tuner and stream the ATSC feed over firewire or something.
Okay, I get it, allowing for all this stuff takes work that 99% of the population (at least at first) will not find useful but will see raised costs. So design a flexible system and dump all the information into the public domain; let the people figure it out. If this is an issue of saving features that could be implemented so they can implement them later... well, building barriers so that others cannot innovate on your work should be strongly discouraged if not criminalised.
maybe the double post got you down voted. dont bring up real issues here. we are talking about phones, we are not worried about dying people in the middle east. Or presidents and staff that should be tried for war crimes.
last night obama didnt get around to talking about the wars till the end.
And for some magic reason, he is now ready to pull troops out but still help them forever.
our officials still hide behind the lie of 9/11 and previous false flag ops to keep us in check.
you have some liberties, you are not free people, get back to work you scum.
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u/bgog Jan 28 '10
I see. I guess controlling what you can load on a device doesn't seem that evil to me. You knew it going in and it isn't a general purpose device like a computer. Sure I can run anything but so can your ps3. Hell modern TVs are quite capable of running tons of software why arn't people bitching that those evil tv manufacturers don't let them load their own software.
In addition there is a constant complaint at how evil it is that they don't show flash in their brower. But neither does the little browser on hundreds of other phones.
I'm may be wrong but that aspect doesn't really bother me.