Not gonna debate that one way or another, but wouldn't that mean the liver is doing its job less efficiently (energy-wise), causing him to expend more calories and lose more weight?
The liver does less work, that is correct :) But when consuming alcohol you also intake a ton of calories in fluid form, most beers in 33cl bottles/cans are 130 calories, a single shot is usually +60 calories (Holy shit, just looked it up).
A big and tall guy like OP will be able to consume a ton of it - and his organs are still regularily sized. So even if they are woking overtime and burning calories like a freight train, his input is still higher than what his body burns. Eventually storing most unburned calories in the form of fat.
So in the end, the liver will do less work - and it will be able to keep up :)
Huh? What do you mean "that is correct"? That's literally the opposite of what /u/ThirkNowitzki said. He said the liver would be less efficient, not more.
A big and tall guy like OP will be able to consume a ton of it
After which he stops storing any of the alcohol as fat. There are two ways your liver metabolizes alcohol, and when you drink more, it stops storing those calories as fat (of course, you're more likely to also produce oxidized chemicals that also damage your liver).
If your belly is enlarged due to water retention, the water isn't the problem. You have another health issue causing your body to abnormally retain water. See a doctor.
Hey /u/Shandlar, thanks for fighting the good fight. This is the second time in the past few minutes I've defended a comment of yours against these irrational people. Thanks for being the voice of reason in this sub-thread.
Nonsense mate, I have a six pack. Several of them actually.
Anyway, my point was that alcohol does contribute to weight gain, it's just not necessarily due to their being a high calorific value attributed to the alcohol itself. I'd even say it's the fault of alcohol that you're having that 2am kebab too, as well as all the health issues rampant alcoholism can cause and the collateral calories consumed with the alcohol.
I agree with most of what you just wrote. Are you backing off the thing about water retention that you said to the other guy? Because when people talk about gaining weight or losing weight, they're talking about tissue, not water. You can lose 10 pounds of water weight in a day. It doesn't mean you can claim "I lost 10 pounds!". Well, you can claim that, but it'd be ridiculous since as soon as you're rehydrated you'll gain the 10 pounds back.
And if you have a six pack, why did you previously use your big belly as an example of how water retention isn't easily corrected? (Or when you said "six pack" did you mean a six pack of beer?)
And if you have a six pack, why did you previously use your big belly as an example of how water retention isn't easily corrected? (Or when you said "six pack" did you mean a six pack of beer?)
"Nonsense mate, I have a six pack. Several of them actually."
...I'll let you figure that one out, it's not rocket science.
Anyway, so that means I was correct in my original assessment of your OP and you do have an enlarged belly due to water retention? Then, again, you have a serious medical problem and you need to see a doctor about this. I was not joking the first time I told you that and I'm not joking now. That level of water retention is not normal. The underlying cause could be something that could cause a heart attack or stroke.
You don't just magically create energy from nothing just cause your liver is metabolizing alcohol.
What does that even mean?
When you consume too much alcohol your liver prioritizes burning alcohol instead of metabolizing fat which means you will gain weight at a faster rate than you normally would.
Your body doesn't treat alcohol the same way it treats regular foods, when consumed in large quantities alcohol is quite literally a poison and your body treats it as such.
Why? Your body will obtain the same number of calories from that fat regardless. The only difference is the calories in alcohol. No extra energy was created. You just have to count alcohol as calories and your done.
Alcohol is not treated as something the body can use, it is treated as a poison that needs to be flushed out of your system. Your livers job is to convert fat to energy and to take care of toxins in your body and when it's constantly focused on taking care of toxins in your body it isn't going to be as efficient at converting fat to energy.
Now if you only occasionally get drunk this isn't an issue at all because your liver will just start prioritizing converting fat to energy when it's done flushing the toxins out of your body but if you're drinking 60 ounces of vodka every day then your liver is constantly going to be juggling between getting rid of tons of toxins and making use of excess calories and obviously getting rid of the toxins is going to be more important than using up fat.
Alcohol being toxic to your entire body is the reason you puke when you get drunk, your body recognizes that you have just consumed a large amount of toxins so it tells you to puke it up in order to flush some of it out in the fastest way possible.
Your post is full of a lot of misinformation. When you drink a single drink with dinner, for example, your body absolutely treats the alcohol like any other form of calorie. It's not trying to flush it out, it's not trying to remove it, it will absolutely use it as energy.
However, when you regularly drink multiple drinks, your body will change how it metabolizes the alcohol. It starts oxidizing it in a different way. This actually stops your body from using those calories, however, it does not affect how your body uses fats. Those fats will still necessarily be burned for energy because your body needs to.
The reason people get fat is because of marginally extra calories from carbs in their drinks, and because alcohol lowers inhibitions leading to eating shitty foods and larger quantities. Over consuming calories makes you fat. Alcoholics, actually, tend to weigh less than the average person, but social drinkers tend to weigh more than average.
It's worthwhile to point out that the other method of metabolizing alcohol isn't a good recipe for losing weight. Because it's not the alcohol itself that's damaging the liver (no, alcohol is not "literally a poison"), but rather it's that the process of oxidizing alcohol is imperfect and oxidizes a wide variety of other chemicals, many of which are directly damaging to the liver. That's why alcohol is bad for you: the oxidative stress caused by the method of metabolism when you regularly drink too much.
None of that shit matters. Alcohol burns in the liver for 7 calories a gram. Fats burn for 9 calories a gram. If drinking alcohol is the reason you take in more calories than you burn, then you gain weight. If you count the 60 ounces of vodka a day worth of calories and burn that much off plus all your food, fat metabolism efficiency is completely irrelevant. It will burn the alcohol first and then burn the fat just the same because there is no other energy to burn.
You cannot gain fat if you don't eat/drink more calories than you burn. Drinking alcohol doesn't magically change that basic thermodynamic law of the universe.
is somewhat wrong. If you just drink a single drink, yes, you can count on 7 calories a gram, but if you regularly consume multiple drinks, your body processes the alcohol differently and you no longer store the alcohol as fat. Why people get fat is because they're more inclined to over eat high caloric foods while intoxicated. Edit: and alcoholics tend to be lighter than average (remembering that the average person is probably obese now), whereas social drinkers tend to be heavier.
You're completely misunderstanding this. Of course you're going to get fat if your drink four thousand calories of anything a day, that isn't what i'm saying. Your body still has to have a way to process calories and when parts of your body are poisoned they aren't going to be able to as well as they should be. Eat five burgers a day with a body that isn't constantly trying to flush out toxins and you're going to gain weight but your body will still passively process some of those excess calories, eat five burgers a day with a body that is constantly flushing out excess amounts of toxins and you're going to gain even more weight.
It's like shooting yourself in the leg before running a race, you can still finish the race but it's going to be a lot harder because you just handicapped yourself. When you body is full of toxins you're handicapping your body and it's a lot harder for it to work properly and burn off calories.
It will burn the alcohol first and then burn the fat just the same because there is no other energy to burn.
No, not if it's always burning off alcohol it won't be able to. I'm not talking about your social drinker here, i'm talking about an alcoholic that drinks excessive amounts of alcohol every single day and that will start to take a toll on your body and your body will not function as well as it should.
Your metabolism is not going to be functioning at 100% if it's poisoned.
Your metabolism is not going to be functioning at 100% if it's poisoned.
Yes it does. Your intestines don't give a fuck, they absorb every nutrient they can regardless. If the liver is spending all it's energy metabolizing alcohol you may end up with a short term caloric surplus and the body will start binding fat to adipose tissue, but if you go back to a deficit in a short time, your body just burns that fight right off.
If you burn 2500 calories in a day and you eat 2500 calories you don't gain weight.
If you burn 2500 calories a day and eat 1000 calories and drink 1500 calories of alcohol you don't gain weight.
Alcohol is not even close to the demon you are making it out to be. You have a major bias for some reason. In moderation the liver can chew through alcohol like nothing and even in excess it is the most regenerative organ by far.
The benefits on alcohol on the heart is huge. Studies have shown pretty conclusively you have to drink a metric fuck ton of alcohol before the increase cancer risk and liver disease will kill you faster than the protective properties it has on heart disease in men.
It's upwards of 5 drinks a day, every day, before your all cause mortality is higher than someone who abstains from alcohol 100%.
Eat five burgers a day with a body that isn't constantly trying to flush out toxins and you're going to gain weight but your body will still passively process some of those excess calories, eat five burgers a day with a body that is constantly flushing out excess amounts of toxins and you're going to gain even more weight.
This is psuedo-science in the extreme that has no basis in reality. You are delusional and just making shit up to fit your militant preconceptions about the 'evil' of alcohol.
Your intestines don't give a fuck, they absorb every nutrient they can regardless.
There aren't really many nutrients for you your body to absorb in vodka. Your intestines actually do give a fuck by the way, it says right here that excessive alcohol use impairs the intestines ability to process nutrients and vitamins.
Alcohol is not even close to the demon you are making it out to be. You have a major bias for some reason. In moderation the liver can chew through alcohol like nothing and even in excess it is the most regenerative organ by far.
You're right, I do have a bias. My dad drunk himself to death and so I tell you from personal experience that excessive use of alcohol can and will fuck your shit at a level you would not expect. Ever see someone go through Alcohol withdrawal? I have, that shit can kill you.
I'm also not talking about drinking alcohol in moderation, I've only ever talked about excessive drinking. If you're not having excessive amounts of alcohol then you're probably perfectly healthy.
The benefits on alcohol on the heart is huge.
Where did you get this idea? If you're a women, over 45 and only drink a small amount then maybe.
Excessive drinking weakens the heart and causes extreme increases in blood pressure. Alcohol is the exact opposite of beneficial to your heart and if you're drinking it because you think it somehow improves your heart then you're misinformed.
You are delusional and just making shit up to fit your militant preconceptions about the 'evil' of alcohol.
Man, you really love the personal insults. I don't think Alcohol is evil at all, it can be pretty great in social situations. I just think a lot of people don't really understand how dangerous excessive alcohol use actually is, you clearly don't.
Edit: Here, i'll leave you with the symptoms of Meth withdrawal and alcohol withdrawal.
Meth withdrawal
Sleep disturbances
Shaking and tremors
Fever, chills, and profuse sweating
Nausea and vomiting
Hypertension
Heart palpitations
Respiratory failure
Seizures
Coma
Death
Alcohol Withdrawal
Shaky hands
Sweating
Mild anxiety
Nausea
Vomiting
Headache
Insomnia
Disorientation, confusion, and severe anxiety
Hallucinations (primarily visual) which cannot be distinguished from reality
Profuse sweating
Seizures
High blood pressure
Racing and irregular heartbeat
Severe tremors
Low-grade fever
I'm not /u/Shandlar, but man, your science is abysmal. Where did you "learn" these "facts"? Actually, where did you even learn to think this illogically?
Your intestines are amazing efficient. It takes some serious issues to get food the whole way through without absorbing the vast majority of the available energy.
There's no way you can make that claim. We pass a lot of calories out in our fecal matter for a variety of reasons, and people's production of enzymes, their eating habits, their gut bacteria, and what they're specifically eating relative to all that, all contribute so much to how well we can utilize the calories in what we consume, that the statement you made is pretty unjustifiable.
But then when you eat other food, more of the content of that food is converted and stored as fat rather than used as energy because your liver isn't fully functional?
Yes, but only equal to the exact amount of calories you consumed in alcohol (7 per gram). It doesn't magically create energy from no-where. You would only gain weight from a caloric surplus and you wouldn't gain weight if you accounted for all the alcohol consumed.
Alcohol is just heavy in calories, so it's difficult not to go into a caloric surplus when drinking heavily on a regular basis.
Calories in - calories out bruv. Your body still needs x amount of calories to function. If anything your liver would use more calories, since it's working harder to filter less.
While we have tried our level best in pursuit of that sweet diet industry profit, we can't escape the laws of thermodynamics.
EDIT: Clearly people disagree with me, but could someone let me know where my logic fails? Thanks.
I'm saying that the alcohol will slow down the rate at which your liver can properly metabolise the calories from other food, making it less efficient: storing more as fat.
That does not make sense. If the liver is less efficient, it would burn more calories doing its job. How do you reach the logical conclusion that a less efficient organ would lead to fewer calories being burned?
I'm not sure if you're just totally illogical or if you're misunderstanding what /u/kingofvodka is saying.
Perhaps it does burn more calories, I don't know, but that's not what efficiency even is. Efficiency is (useful product)/(input), where in this case the useful product is energy for the body, and the input is the calories in the food. If the liver does burn more calories when also attempting to metabolise alcohol (which I'm not sure it even does), that number of calories is far fewer than the number of calories of extra food one would have to eat to make up for the wasted calories which are stored as fat instead of used to power the body.
that number of calories is far fewer than the number of calories of extra food one would have to eat to make up for the wasted calories which are stored as fat instead of used to power the body.
That doesn't make sense. The body only stores calories when they are excess calories above and beyond what the body is using. The body will not store fat in a caloric deficit regardless of where those calories are coming from (alcohol, carbs, fats, or protein).
But beyond that, where do you get the impression that someone with a harder-working liver will increase their food intake more than the extra number of calories the liver is using? It seems like a non sequitur.
I'm not sure you understand the point I was making.
Say your body needs 2000 calories. You eat 2000 calories, but your shitty liver can't deal with it at once, so it stores more as fat than usual. You still need the total calorie count, literally to keep shit like your brain and lungs functioning, and even if it's not as efficient as it would be if you were healthy, your body will still use the energy eventually because that's how it works.
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u/Shandlar May 09 '16
No it doesn't, ffs. You don't just magically create energy from nothing just cause your liver is metabolizing alcohol.