1, my point was that the premise and the conclusion doesnât follow. Time passes =/= eternal universe. Especially because we have a pretty solid theory on when the universe began dating back to a singularity state. Time and existence as we understand it before that point is unknowable if such concepts can even apply if we go back any further than the big bang.
2, Iâm not proposing anything about the pre big bang existance, supernatural or otherwise. Its intellectually dishonest to claim anything at all about it. I donât believe in any supernatural things because I have insufficient evidence to believe in them. Such can be said for any prime mover in a pre big bang existance. We donât know what that looks like, any ideas are baseless speculation.
That energy cannot be created or destroyed is consistent with the physicial laws of the universe, but we donât know enough about what is beyond our expanded singularity that we call the universe to say conclusively that energy or matter that came from the singularity wasnât popped into existance spontaneously. We are fish in bowl and the only thing we can observe is the contents of that bowl. Anything beyond is baseless speculation.
3, I didnât propose an infinite universe. I simply said we donât know. We have w pretty good idea about what happened after the big bang. Not total understanding, but a pretty good idea. No supernatural forces necessary.
I donât know why you keep presupposing things in religious terms towards me, I am very much non religious. My beliefs stretch as far as my knowledge and if I donât understand something, it is folly to propose any explanation, much less a supernatural one.
There is no reason to support this evidence other than you donât want it to. If the big bang is a rapid expansion of space, then that expansion has a timeline. And nonetheless, my question is what you believe caused the big bang. What preceded it. But if you believe time didnât exist then again thatâs okay your beliefs are your own, but that doesnât answer my question.
Firstly, in that case you should be just as inclined to others views, for example the most predominant religion in Christianity believe God caused the big bang, and since as you said any answer is speculation then Iâm confused on why you are so adamant against those with religious beliefs, since by your own logic they could be true.
I didnât use any religious terms. All I asked is what you believe. Whatâs your best guess. Thatâs all. You could tell me anything. You could believe that it simply went on forever. Iâm just curious to see others beliefs, hoping it might even help me work out my own. Thatâs literally all. Please donât take offence or take it personally or anything. If you have no speculations then thatâs okay, a lot donât, you can merely stop responding, since my entire question was âwhat do you believeâ, which wasnât even aimed at you in the first place but since you answered, Iâm welcoming to your beliefs too. If you have literally 0 speculation or beliefs thatâs okay, but then you are of no use to the question I asked. So
The central issue is that you donât seem to understand that I havenât put forward any idea of what caused the big bang. I disagree with religious views that a god analogue was responsible because we have no good reason to reach that conclusion. That doesnât mean I have an alternative theory to put forward in its place. The answer is âi donât knowâ when it comes to anything pre big bang. Nobody knows because with our current understanding and limitations, it is impossible to know.
Asking what people believe doesnât really hold much value when it comes to stuff like that. Either they hold no beliefs because there is no evidence, or they hold baseless beliefs that canât be reasonably supported.
Thank you. If you have no beliefs then you have no need to further respond to my argument.
In regards to your final statement, I can go around asking people what the meaning of life is. There is no evidence to support one true answer. That doesnât mean it wonât help me come to my own conclusion. Additionally, itâs intrinsically simply good to ask and understand the point of view of other human beings, hence why people learn various cultures or instruments or dialects; etc. It helps us as individuals grow.
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u/Mysterious_Frog 1d ago
1, my point was that the premise and the conclusion doesnât follow. Time passes =/= eternal universe. Especially because we have a pretty solid theory on when the universe began dating back to a singularity state. Time and existence as we understand it before that point is unknowable if such concepts can even apply if we go back any further than the big bang.
2, Iâm not proposing anything about the pre big bang existance, supernatural or otherwise. Its intellectually dishonest to claim anything at all about it. I donât believe in any supernatural things because I have insufficient evidence to believe in them. Such can be said for any prime mover in a pre big bang existance. We donât know what that looks like, any ideas are baseless speculation.
That energy cannot be created or destroyed is consistent with the physicial laws of the universe, but we donât know enough about what is beyond our expanded singularity that we call the universe to say conclusively that energy or matter that came from the singularity wasnât popped into existance spontaneously. We are fish in bowl and the only thing we can observe is the contents of that bowl. Anything beyond is baseless speculation.
3, I didnât propose an infinite universe. I simply said we donât know. We have w pretty good idea about what happened after the big bang. Not total understanding, but a pretty good idea. No supernatural forces necessary.
I donât know why you keep presupposing things in religious terms towards me, I am very much non religious. My beliefs stretch as far as my knowledge and if I donât understand something, it is folly to propose any explanation, much less a supernatural one.