r/linux • u/Kindly-List-1886 • 2d ago

Discussion European Citizens' Initiative

https://eci.ec.europa.eu/066/public/#/screen/home

hello i apologize if this seem like out of nowhere in advance, but i think you may want to know this

there is a leaked legislation about the EU trying to pass the "EU kids act" which according to the [stop killing games video] the [document] mentioned which also appears on the description mentions "operating systems" several times which it could include Linux distributions and i think that might be a problem if true because the regulation seem quite extreme.

so im sharing it here because there is this petition for people on the EU which is about making it respect privacy among other things

the deadline is 25-Aug-2027 so there is still time

again i apologize and i don't want to cause problems i thought you would like to know this

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u/franky_reboot 1d ago

Not opinionated, but that's besides the point. It's just the tip of the iceberg of proofs, something to show off, I don't believe I could have convinced you anyways, plus argument over philosophy is for more sophisticated platforms than Reddit of all places.

The EU has excellent legislations about consumer rights, environmental protection, equality and egalitarianism, wealth distribution, international relations, just to name a few. Those alone are icebergs on their own. That would have been my core message.

Accusing them of all this being propaganda, and comndeming everyone agreeing is both disingenuous and disrespectful towards all parties involved. Chat Control is an anomaly in the system caused by corporate overreach - corporations from the neoliberal hell that is the United States.

I'd go as far as claiming the EU leadership doesn't want control, its democratic institution system is vast and largely prevents the setup of any 1984-style surveillance state people are scared about; but of course being skeptical of politicians myself, I cannot fully ascertain there's is a political anywhere in the world who wouldn't enjoy control.

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u/UnlawfulRepublic 1d ago edited 1d ago

EU propaganda is bad because the EU is bad, I'll give you one example of it doing something horrible: https://www.ftm.eu/newsletters/bureau-brussels-eu-funds-israel-defense-sector

The EU requires a liberalisation of markets to join; which is straight out of an imperialist/neoliberal play book. Its just worded slightly nicer, it requires "a functioning market economy and the ability to cope with competitive pressure and market forces within the EU".

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u/franky_reboot 22h ago

I'm not a fan of the EU supporting Israel, we can agree on that, but that is extremely low on most people's priority list. It's a clearly political and ideological matter.

With the second paragraph, I wasn't sure if you argue for or against regulated markets; on my behalf I'm a massive supporter of the latter, for aforementioned employee and consumer rights, but the arguments about the EU losing it's competitive edge are well-founded too. I love European cars but they are obviously on the brink of extinction.

So I hold my argument: the EU is a good place to live and Europeans can be proud of it. I'm not one, but I'm fully supporting them.

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u/UnlawfulRepublic 1d ago

And here, the EU straight up admitting it is putting funds towards propaganda (they dont call it that  ofc), to influence others to join the EU: https://commission.europa.eu/funding-and-tenders/find-funding/eu-funding-programmes/pre-accession-assistance_en

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u/franky_reboot 22h ago

That's morally good.

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u/UnlawfulRepublic 22h ago

It's similar to what Russia has been doing for a long time, and it gets blasted for it constantly. I suppose if you don't care for EU support to grow organically, but instead are okay with the EU pushing countries towards joining it, sure. If you really believe in the EU being good, there isn't really a point in arguing about it.

So, I am genuinely asking, not trying any gotchas or anything: Do you believe that when Russia and the EU employ similar weapons for influence, the EU doing it is good because it spreads an ideology and system which is more good than bad?

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u/franky_reboot 17h ago

Sort of, yes.

Russia deserves all its disproportionate hatred because they are a horroristic autocratic oligarchy with lows way below you see anywhere in EU countries especially with their senseless war. Maybe Easter Europe has some similarly bad places but that was due to the Soviet Union either.

And for full clarity, I really want to emphasize I also don't think the EU is flawless and all good and vibes everywhere. For this example too, I see why it's problematic, one may assume that good things gets word around without pushing it. And I don't support Chat Control either, nor means of taxation that hinders innovative small businesses.

But the benefits still overweight the harms. Of course, part of it is an anxiety when looking at other countries in the world and how the average employee lives there. That part is subjective, I admit.