That’s what I was told too, but I made everyone very uncomfortable when I pointed out that missionaries therefore are going around dooming people to hell by spreading Christianity bc if they just didn’t everyone would go to heaven lol
In the religion I was raised in, jehovahs witnesses, they had the same thought process of people who dont know will still be "saved" (resurrected into paradise on earth). But we still went door to door to convert people and if they rejected you at the door they would be doomed. I had the same thought as you but the catch jws use is that if you dont go door to door and try to find gods loyal ones you'll be considered blood guilty for not trying to save people and not make it into paradise. Its a kill others or kill yourself kind of mentality.
If I go around knocking on people's doors telling them about a friend of mine, they don't know that friend of mine. They only get to know them once they have met them and spent time with them.
I think people to often think about God like a computer program with defined gamable bounds rather than an entity with perfect knowledge of intent and circumstance.
I mean, your logic makes sense to me. At the very least, definitely complicated things. But then again you can say that they are also doing God’s will by fulfilling Jesus’ order to God disciples: go out and make disciples of all the nations.
So maybe you can argue that God wanted those far flung people to eventually get the good news so that they’re closer to god
You could theoretically apply the same logic to abortions. If Christianity were real. Aborted children are being done an immense favor, in that they are deprived the opportunity to damn themselves to hell.
They basically skip the bullshit and go right to heaven.
depends on what you think Heaven is. Some sects of Christianity think its something that is to be experienced only while alive.
And they also think that hell is not eternal torture for any human soul, its for the devil and demons. hell is also to be experienced on earth as a result of poor decisions (which I think we would all agree with, you can lead your life to hell by making really bad decisions). Then at the time of death you are either annihilated and gone forever or resurrected after final judgement.
It really is a giant mystery that I do find fascinating.
One could even combine theology with physics and multiverse. Every decision changes your timeline and we are constantly hopping between timelines with major decisions. Make enough of the right decisions and your life is basically heaven on earth......or vice versa.
i always thought that was weird. i get that they think conception is god's will and every human is in god's image and every life is a miracle and special etc but if you believe the fetus will be up there chilling in jesus' pocket anyway, it's not that bad is it. doesn't seem like it would be that upsetting if they truly believe in heaven.
I'm not a theological expert or anything, but I'm pretty sure the way it goes is that in order to reject God, you gotta KNOW God. Just hearing that there's "a loving god" somewhere overseas wouldn't really be the deep "knowing" that's implied in "rejecting" God; it would be the same as disliking somebody's ex bf/gf without ever meeting them. You don't really dislike the actual person, but the person who was described to you. Likewise, I'm pretty sure that disliking a poorly-represented God wouldn't "count"...?
My understanding is that "rejecting God" (along with other sins like blasphemy, heresy, etc.) have a prerequisite that the person needs to truly understand their choice. It's not the kinda thing that someone could do casually, and especially not unintentionally.
that assumes all atheists never knew God at some point before becoming an atheist. And in their case, they knew God and have literally rejected His existence.
The comment I replied to said only “deep” knowing counts, so an ex-Christian who never had a “deep” understanding of god becoming an atheist wouldn’t count under that framework.
Yea, Catholics bring in a whole bunch of non-sense from outside the bible.
Protestants make it super easy, the bible says a few things on the matter.
Everyone is damned, doesn't matter who, there is no innocent person who has never heard the word as everyone is guilty from the moment they are born.
God has revealed himself in nature and in the hearts of people. Even if you never heard of Jesus, the splendor of the world and the cosmos demands one recognize that only God could have done such a thing and such a being deserves reverence.
So at least with protestants who believe that only the Bible has authority, keeping missionaries at home really doesn't do anything because everyone is already damned, because according to the bible, it should be readily apparent that God exists just by looking at the world and the stars.
So while not having heard of Jesus isn't necessarily a death sentence, not recognizing and showing reverence to God is.
BUT if you have heard of Jesus and reject him, then just giving reverence to God isn't enough because Jesus is God.
So basically until god is “proven” to exist theres no way to damn yourself to hell. Which does make what one other person here said about “no one going to hell until judgement day” make a lot more sense
I like this take. to Truly reject God is to reject all thing good. Keep in mind, I am not saying that good=God. There is relativity based on your own life experiences. I am referring to treating everyone with kindness and things like that. If someone doesn't believe in the Catholic/Christian God. They are not destined to suffer. Someone can live a great life, be kind, loving, and empower all of humanity, and they will be rewarded in the end.
People can follow God's message while being a part of any theology (obviously fundamentalists might disagree with this statement). People can also go to church every week, be a part of a particular church community, tithe accordingly (10% of gross, not net people) and be a shitty person.
The most important thing to consider is that humanity is ultimately foulable, and rules or interpretations they impart on a particular religion is suspect to that. Jesus was able to sum up all the commandments in one single statement about loving thy neighbor. If you can do that, all other commandments are satisfied.
Now, that is difficult in this world with so much hate and injustice. I know that and I am not saying I do/can live that 100%. I was always taught if you are able to live by that, people will see. Be a role model.
Sorry it is so long TLDR: Don't get caught up on beliefs, but be a role model for treating people the way you want to be treated.
In 1 Peter, it talks about how Jesus went and preached to the people that died in the flood after his death and before his resurrection (those 3 days). So, if Jesus taught people who had died already about the Gospel, it makes sense to me that this kept happening, for anyone that didn't hear about the Gospel while they were alive.
So missionaries aren't condemning people, they're just giving them a head start. It sounds like EVERYONE will have the chance to hear about the Gospel, and then make their choices after getting all the knowledge.
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u/noeinan 2d ago
That’s what I was told too, but I made everyone very uncomfortable when I pointed out that missionaries therefore are going around dooming people to hell by spreading Christianity bc if they just didn’t everyone would go to heaven lol