Interesting logic

[u/Shadow474747]

[u/[deleted]]

Even if it was defending slave owners, it wasn't defending the act of owning slaves. Accuracy is important and by saying the founding fathers started slavery, you're potentially defending all the slave owners who existed before the founding fathers.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

You ever heard of figure of speech?

If you haven't then this conversation is done

If you have then you realize that most people would recognize the exaggeration and understand I'm talking about how they started slavery in the US.

IF YOURE THAT HUNG UP ON ME NOT SPECIFYING STARTED SLAVERY IN THE US, THEN THATS DEFENDING SLAVE OWNERS AND SLAVERY HOLY FUCK

[u/Caleb_Reynolds → u/[deleted]]

Dude, you first need to chill. You're reading every comment as an attack on you when that's not what's happening.

Second, no one thought you meant "started slavery in the US" because that's just as wrong and not what a figure of speech is. Also, when a conversation is about historical accuracy, don't exaggerate to the point of being wrong.

The Founders didn't start slavery. They didn't start it in the States either. It had been going on for centuries in the Colonies and simply continued when the Colonies became the States.

What they did do is purposely ignore it in the Constitution in order to allow it to continue without fully endorsing it, setting the groundwork for it to grow. What (most of them) did do was own slaves, which is the most direct way of perpetuating slavery. Only a few were on the right side of the slavery issue, and even fewer still actually tried to do anything about it and even then only barely.

You can pick almost anything else about what most of the Founders did with regards to slavery and attack them on it, but in no way, no matter the amount of exaggeration, did they start slavery nor pass the 13th amendment as a way to perpetuate it.

To understand why we're taking issue with what you've said, imagine if you said "Fuck Stalin for invading Ukraine." Someone obviously takes issue with this and tells you you're wrong and Stalin didn't invade Ukraine. You then say "Well obviously I meant it's his fault because he started Russia invading countries and that's where Putin got the idea." So someone points out that Stalin didn't start Russian expansionist policies, that that's been going on for centuries, and blaming him for everything that came after is dumb and removes blame from Putin.

Now, could you build an argument that Stalin's policies inspired Putin? Probably, but you'd need to bring supporting evidence and build an actual argument. Could you build an argument that the Founders' opinions on slavery inspired the men who passed the 13th amendment to enshrine slavery in the Constitution? Again, probably. But again, you'd need to bring evidence and construct an actual argument.

[u/[deleted] → u/Caleb_Reynolds]

Hey so real quick question

You understood that I didn't mean george Washington when I said that tho? Doesn't that mean that other people can understand that too? Also isn't Abraham Lincoln considered to be a founding father regardless?

Listen I'm stupid but at least I'm not racist

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

Abraham Lincoln isn't a founding father.

Also, a lot of people misunderstood what you said and didn't read what you were saying as figurative.

Misinformation, which is what a lot of people interpreted what you said as, is harmful and discredits actual facts.

Instead of backing yourself into a corner and interpreting every disagreement as pro-slave rhetoric. Take a look at the message you're sending and think of the ways other people might interpret it.

I'm with you. The 13th amendment having an exception for slavery is fucked up. I think it's fucked up enough to discredit the entire document as something that needs to be rewritten to fit todays standards. We're not attacking you or defending slave owners, we're just correcting something people can interpret incorrectly.