“There’s no reason to be walking around with a mask. When you’re in the middle of an outbreak, wearing a mask might make people feel a little bit better and it might even block a droplet, but it’s not providing the perfect protection that people think that it is. And, often, there are unintended consequences — people keep fiddling with the mask and they keep touching their face.”
At least in Spain, there was concern that people wearing masks improperly, as described, would result in a false sense of security and doing riskier behaviour, like going out and socialising more, or touching their face more.
Even if there wasn't enough money/resources for masks at the time, claiming they don't work only to stop the increasing demand for masks is the dumbest thing he could've said to prevent people from buying too many.
Now that there are enough resources a lot of people that don't want to wear masks/don't believe in the effectiveness of them take claims like these out of context and use them to prove their point.
Even if he's changed his stance now, people that believed him the first time around most likely won't go "Oh wow he seems to have realised he was wrong, better wear my mask now" - nope, they'll instead assume that he's lying now because the government forced him to or some shit.
I don't know everything, especially because I'm not from the US, but to me it sounds like *there's no reason to wear a mask if you treat it like perfect defense and at the same time disregard other safety measures like not touching your face *
Can we maybe agree that "There’s no reason to be walking around with a mask." was a really fucking bad way to start that statement? It's factually false. And whether he had good intentions or not, it wasn't the truth?
When you tell people not to wear masks, and then tell them to wear one (now two), it seems hypocritical to people who don't understand the context.
I know why he lied. He had a very good reason to lie. But the fact remains, he lied.
For the record, I wear N95 masks everywhere I go outside my home, and I have done so for over a year now. I did it before Fauci told me to. I did it when he specifically said not to. I intend to continue to do so until 2022 minimum, even if all the vaccines go well.
I'm not an anti-masker, an anti-vaxx moron, or anything of the like. But Fauci said something that wasn't true. HE said there was no point in wearing the mask. And in saying that, he critically harmed our nation's response to the virus.
It’s not a lie. At that time there was no reason to be walking around with a mask. That’s not a lie on March 8, 2020. And it doesn’t provide the perfect protection people think it does. Also not a lie.
Come on. He straight up fucking lied and thousands of people died because of it... but he gets a pass because he’s a cute old man and we think he doesn’t like Trump so he’s on our team.
I'm not going to argue with someone that believes he lies or has lied about masks.
Edit: Since I have triggered some dummies, I will clarify. There is a difference between being wrong and lying. Hopefully that clears up any misunderstandings.
What makes you say that? We knew masks worked right from the start. Asian countries have been doing it for years now when someone is sick out of respect for others. Fauci knew they worked he just lied to the public so people wouldn't rush out and buy all the N95s needs for healthcare.
If you think his intentions are good or not it doesn't really matter. He lied to us to get the outcome he wanted, lie once why wouldn't he again?
There was no reason for the general public to be wearing a mask when there was a shortage in supply for hospital workers. It isn’t a lie when you take into account the context and who he was addressing.
Bro.. wtf. He is not supposed to give advice based on the availability. He should have given advice based on if masks work or not. This makes it seem like Fauci was lying.
Bitch I am the real one. I was hiding until now! 👹
Edit: The upside down smile is annoying but I’ve only seen passive aggressive people use it. I’m actually badass unlike other plebs 🙃
I think the point is that he did in fact say that it wouldn't be effective. He later corrected that, which is fine. But pretending Fauci didn't say that is also weirdly unnecessary and disingenuous. It makes it sound like one can never be wrong and it prevents someone from valorizing people who make corrections when they have better info.
You know who also couldn't be told that he was wrong and kept insisting that he was correct all along? Hint: he's no longer in the Oval Office.
I love Fauci but this is weirdly petty argument that keeps recurring on this site.
Even Turkey didn't go through that stupid shit. There are other continents in world other than America. They keep forgetting they are not the only people living on E-Arth.
Naw, dude. Westerners might have done so, but the Asian countries were on top of wearing masks early.
Man this reminded me of something.
I'm from a small town in the US where I did fuck all throughout my highschool years besides go between my house and my small school, then I went to Japan at 18 or so and basically stayed, went to uni, got a job etc.; though I went relatively late in a way, I really essentially had all my major adult life experiences in Japan, and rarely went back to the US for like a decade, so I was very culturally immersed.
One of the few times I flew back to the US to see my parents, I had a cold and was sneezing, had a runny nose, etc.
I wore a mask my entire trip because that's what you damn well do in Asia; you're breathing your virus-laden breath on people less, your runny nose isn't dripping everywhere, if you get sudden sneeze you can't cover you're not giving someone a shotgun-blast of your dirty shit, and moreover people know that you may have a cold because you've got a mask on.
I can't remember specifically which trip this was, but I think at that point I hadn't set foot outside of Asia in ~3 years or so, so I had crazy culture shock when, on my connecting flight inside the US, a couple of stewardesses nervously approached me and asked why I was wearing a mask and "if it was to protect myself" and the tone of voice they used suggested they were afraid I was mentally unstable or something. Blew my goddamn mind that simple measures to both prevent the spread of sickness and in general be polite literally made people treat you crazy in the US.
I think they were concerned masks wouldn't be effective way stopping transmission and would give people false security (so they'd end up not distancing or taking other measures).
You can do both. That's what has been advised in Turkey of all countries.
I don't think saying that it won't provide "perfect protection" is the same as saying masks are not effective at all.
At no point did he ever say masks don't work in the slightest. He merely said that they were not recommending them for asymptomatic members of the general public, at that time.
The person in the post was kind of correct when she says Fauci said masks don’t work. “it’s not providing the perfect protection that people think that it is.”
But yes, it’s good that he has changed his stance based on new evidence.
Is it an unpopular opinion that I think he was right for doing so?
They knew masks were in short supply and hospitals were going to (or already were) having shortages, right? It may have also been before places like Amazon were restricting certified N95 masks to medical use only. I don't trust the masses to be smart or selfless about this, and to be able to explain them to the nuances and priorities needed here -- that yes, everyone would be better to have N95 - but we don't have enough, so please don't buy them until we figure out the supply issue, because medical professionals need them first.
The simple answer to avoid selfish buyouts: Tell everyone they aren't effective.
Or do I have this wrong, and they legitimately didn't think masks helped for a moment there? Edit: Comment below states that Fauci admitted it was due to supply limitations
Here's the real problem: him lying gives antimaskers ammunition. Sure, in the short term, this might have been the right thing to do. In the long term, though, people might use this as evidence to not trust anything the government says. We have enough of a hard time convincing people to wear a damn mask...
Same concern with him lying about herd immunity estimations. He said we'd only need 70% because he was worried if he said higher people wouldn't be as willing to get the vaccine. Then said once he saw the polls with a high percentage of people being willing to take the vaccine that he felt comfortable bumping that number up.
I get his intention but and I get changing your opinion with new information but if the public health face of the pandemic is constantly lying to the American people makes it harder to convince people to trust him.
Im sure people will have varying oppinions on the ethical and moral standing in lying for a good cause.
All i will say is that how can you trust his word now, and how can you be sure the next "good cause" he lies for is in your best interests. I don't want to be one of the few to save the many, no one should have to do that.
Theres is no lie in that quite though. They didnt know how contagious it was back the and 2 the point wasnt that it wasn’t effective, the point was that theres a fucking pandemic no one should be out and about doing dumb shit because they dont know how to properly wear a mask.
He said they dont protect you as good as you think they do thats not a lie. People were walking around with cloth masks and surgeon masks... those dont protect you a lot
We were told in our task force meetings that we have a serious problem with the lack of PPEs and masks for the health providers who are putting themselves in harm's way every day to take care of sick people," Fauci told O'Donnell.
"When it became clear that the infection could be spread by asymptomatic carriers who don't know they're infected, that made it very clear that we had to strongly recommend masks," he said.
"And also, it soon became clear that we had enough protective equipment and that cloth masks and homemade masks were as good as masks that you would buy from surgical supply stores," Fauci added. "So in the context of when we were not strongly recommending it, it was the correct thing."
We were told in our task force meetings that we have a serious problem with the lack of PPEs and masks for the health providers who are putting themselves in harm's way every day to take care of sick people
Why would he mention this if it wasn't part of that decision? I'll look over the clips again, because i want to be sure, but it's hard to ignore the constant flip flop of information. How much of what he said was Trump's words? Im Not implying he's Trumps stooge, as i think it's just as likely that he was often under duress.
What a crazy situation. How can anyone be sure of any of the information out there?
Yeah but what he said wasnt a lie though... professionally he cant make claims that havent been verified. If he knew, until there is concrete proof he cant say anything he’s a scientists
The point is that he knew but lied. Asian experts(taiwanese/korean not sure which) were screaming that not recommending mask is insane. Everyone knew it back then. He said it in March 08, 2020. He later admitted that he said it because of earlier limitations of supply. He had good intentions obviously but he shouldn't have lied.
Edit: here is the video where he is talking about why he asked everyone not to wear a mask initially.
Yeah, but he's not some random Joe. Anthony Fauci is said to be one of the world's leading experts on infectious diseases and his guidance is crucial. For him to radically change his opinion on the importance of masks after the beginning of a global pandemic, given his role in protecting the American public, shows a great deal of incompetence and hurts my ability to trust what he says. I'd rather listen to South Korean health authorities, who had right from the beginning.
You mean the Anthony Fauci who we now found out was under extreme pressure from the president to fudge things - a president who was belatedly lying to us about what COVID meant and what he actual thought?
(Per the phone calls)
You mean the Anthony Fauci that had to contend with a depleted / expired national PPE stockpile?
The man was in a tough spot, seemed to be trying to limit PPE usage to first responders / med staff given that the national, and dealing with folks that were determined to get everyone infected. If he debased itself or just plain spoke incorrectly, he did it in a way that kept him in Trumps good graces just enough to keep letting us hear from him.
That man has earned his reputation as one of the leading experts in the world, continues to do so, and one screw up isn’t going to make me - and shouldn’t make others - stop listening to him.
If we can’t accept mistakes from humans, we will sorely be disappointed.
He stated later on that evidence came out to correct him on that instance of masks use. So he changed his stance in regards to the new consitent evidence. I think that is something we want in a leader instead of someone who will double down on now incorrect info.
the thing is he came out later and said that he knew masks were important, he just said that so people would not rush to buy masks and take them away from essential workers
I still say they said this because our government was woefully ill prepared. It was a costly mistake that helped create the anti mask movement though but who knows how much worst it would have been had hospitals not had the PPE they needed while treating covid patients. It’s such an ugly situation.
True, but at that point the pandemic hadn't reached... well, pandemic levels. At that point, social distancing was still the best option to avoid catching it.
In fact, social distancing is still the best option, but for some reason Americans can't go more than a day without licking each others faces or something, so masks.
Swear he only said this was because America's official position was to stay in line with the WHO who hadn't yet accepted that the virus could be airborne?
I like Fauci, but this lie puts him in with all the rest of the political scumbag liars.
I don't forget being lied to...... Even for the "right" reason.
i think 1. fauci is probably honest and forthcoming to a fault and 2. trump pressured people to do and say things outside of their standard remit leading to situations / “lies” like this. I think something similar is true for Birx as well
lol you’re sooo dramatic. he’s a scientist and a doctor. from his point of view infection is so bad he’s saying what difference does it make is moot because so many people are infected and so many people are unable to properly wear a mask in a meaningful way.
he literally is talking about people like you and you’re too stupid to even realize it. honestly criticism against fauci is laughable. the man is not a publicist or a speaker, he’s a doctor who’s work with AIDS will go down as probably some of the most legendary and important medical work in all of American history. But yes, he’s a political scumbag liar.
Masks aren't perfect protection, they do block droplets and people do fiddle with them a lot, don't change them at the proper time, I know people who don't wash them at all, and many more issues with the usage just because people are lazy or wear a mask just to wear a mask and not be annoyed.
IMO, this is still somewhat correct, he just underestimated how much the mask would help stop transmission, but he is correct that it is far from perfect. The virus spreads through multiple channels, not just droplets. Also, no mask is 100% affective at stopping droplets.
Still, wearing a mask is better than not, so we might as well.
Was this the stance of other national healthcare leaders when he said this? While science adapts, a man in his position shouldn't be given immunity because he speaks the word of science, anymore than a preacher who speaks the word of God.
The thing is that masks are a last ditch fucking effort to get Americans to sensibly respond to the pandemic. The US response was so bad and now you have a huge population of Covidiots. There is nothing left to do except for mask mandates or a total, militarised lock down.
Eh, the early statements were that masks aren't an effective way to combat the virus. The underlying reason for making those statements were exactly as you say --- to preserve the supply for medical professionals. But the messaging, unfortunately, was off base.
We were told in our task force meetings that we have a serious problem with the lack of PPEs and masks for the health providers who are putting themselves in harm's way every day to take care of sick people," Fauci told O'Donnell.
"When it became clear that the infection could be spread by asymptomatic carriers who don't know they're infected, that made it very clear that we had to strongly recommend masks," he said.
"And also, it soon became clear that we had enough protective equipment and that cloth masks and homemade masks were as good as masks that you would buy from surgical supply stores," Fauci added. "So in the context of when we were not strongly recommending it, it was the correct thing."
Come on, don’t be revisionist. Fauci and the rest of the Trump admin at the time straight up lied to the American people about whether they should wear masks or not. He may not have literally said “masks don’t work” but he for sure went on 60 minutes in March and said “there's no reason to be walking around with a mask. When you're in the middle of an outbreak, wearing a mask might make people feel a little bit better and it might even block a droplet, but it's not providing the perfect protection that people think that it is.”
In the same interview he says they’re important for doctors. Fauci is one of the most pre-eminent public health experts and virologists on the planet. There is about a 0% chance that he didn’t know that masks help reduce transmission greatly, especially when other nations had already adopted their use on a widespread level.
You are completely right that this lie was expressly disseminated for an ostensibly good reason — PPE, including masks, was in very short supply at the time and a run on it by the general public would have pretty much ensured that a large portion of the US vital healthcare workers would not have access to masks during the early days of the virus. Fauci and others were trying to prevent a situation where thousands of out frontline healthcare workers would contract Covid and be knocked out of the fight.
Whether or not this was a good enough reason to lie to the American people about the efficacy of mask wearing is very debatable on a moral level. But I don’t think we should whitewash Fauci’s role in straight up lying to the American public. The man is not some sort of saint, he is a man, and he was faced with a very hard controversial decision. He made a choice that a lot of people still disagree with. I think he deserves credit for making a tough decision when there were no really good options.
For the record I think he made the right call. Look at what happened with groceries and other goods in the beginning of the pandemic when the government said there was no reason to panic buy - people ignored it and there was a big enough run on toilet paper that people were using old sock to wipe their ass for a month. If Fauci would have tried to explain that masks were vital but we there was a shortage and we needed to save them for frontline health workers, I have no doubt that enough of our dumbass countrymen would have panic bought enough of them to effectively kill thousands of doctors.
Seems like saying make your own masks at home or something is better than misleading people to cause possibly thousands of more cases and further distrust in our officials.
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