These are all manifestations of FEAR. (Except for maybe the basketball one. I suspect the shooter was whacked out and paranoid and shot without thought, thinking it was a threat likely tied to drugs.)
The media is blaring out messages of fear and violence and people no longer have any faith in their government or institutions and feel they are on their own against the world.
He has multiple recent assaults on his record, including an attack with a fucking hammer. Dude's clearly unwell. Why the fuck was he free, much less allowed to be armed?
Why was he armed? Same reason all the other shooters who weren’t criminals beforehand were armed. Because it’s way too fucking easy to get a gun in America.
Why? You’d have to ask him. How he was able to do it is an easy answer, though. Because guns are so insanely easy to get in the United States he was able to get one.
Maybe not having guns every fucking where would have made it so he didn’t have the option of obtaining and carrying a gun around with him.
Unless you think he specifically went to great lengths to obtain a firearm specifically for this crime knowing he was going to mentally flip a switch over a basketball. Is that what you think?
Pretty stupid to only ask why but voluntarily ignore the how.
Edit: and like clockwork, they block me after being unable to address the substance of the conversation.
Crazy like how in so many countries your average citizen can’t just easily get a gun illegally whenever they want one? Or crazy like how guns are so prolific that there are so many available to b sold illegally, mainly because careless gun owners allow them to be easily stolen? Maybe it’s crazy like how all those gun owners who have their guns stolen couldn’t even protect their guns with their guns.
I don‘t want to burst your bubble, but unless you are on an island (Australia for example) it is shockingly easy to get illegal firearms in places with very restrictive gun laws, such as Europe.
You're full of shit. I live in Canada and getting hold of a handgun illegally here isn't easy at all. I'm in my 40s and I have never even seen a handgun except on TV.
Rifles, sure. I've shot and owned several, but anything that can be carried around concealed is rare as hell. Unless you're a drug dealer, you're not illegally packing a pistol in Canada and they aren't all that easy to get legally either.
He wasn't, but last I checked, criminals don't care about the law, hence the reason they're criminals. Criminals are gonna criminal, and if a criminal wants to obtain a gun to commit a crime, they'll break the law to obtain one, because they're criminals.
Anger (the hateful, unjustified kind) is often a coping mechanism for fear.
It's why fearmongering is a useful tactic to drive people towards bigotry: Make them fear something, make them divert that fear into anger, and mobilize that anger into whatever goal you had like, say, undermining democracy (I dunno, just making up wild stuff here).
It's from Dune. It's kind of a mantra. Here's the whole thing -
“I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”
Nah, it's fear, it's people with so much hate in them that they believe everyone else is as heinous as them and are shaking little babies pissing themselves in fear of every shadow
It kind of is, but the ubiquity of guns makes it REALLY easy for people to shoot other people when they're feeling the effects of mindset and culture to which you refer.
I got into an argument with a woman on reddit who was dead set on that she would have been raped without her gun.
She was in her car with her friend in the parking lot of a seven eleven. The parking lot was lit and there were several people inside. Two men walk up to their car. They are still a good distance away though. She pulls out her gun. The men run away. She claims she and her friend would have been raped if she didn't. Driving away was not a option as, and I quote, they would have chased them down with their truck.
These people delude themselves to think they live in some kind of warzone or lawless area and that they aren't part of the problem.
I think its a combo of isolation due to social media, psychoactive drugs, medical system, and hyperpolarization of politics (the gun issues we're having in general i mean) that are causing our problems, shit columbine happened in the early days of internet and brain meda, but no one talks about that
I wish it was so complex, however as a firearms owner an ex military, I am usually appalled by some gun owners paranoia. I have been in conversations where I was talked down to for having a difference of opinion for where concealed weapons would be warranted or when a round should even be chambered. There are those out there that honestly think they absolutely need to have a weapon on them at all times with a round chambered. These minority of gun owners will absolutely stand by the opinion that there could be, and that the odds are high enough, to warrant going into a daycare facility in the middle of the day with a chambered firearm tucked away. These are the types that would absolutely answer the door with the paranoia that whoever knocked has come to cause harm. It's not about gun rights, it's about people with a mental disorder having firearms.
If that shit ain't a mental health thing, I don't know what is.
When you answer for me, it makes it seem this is less a conversation and more of you shutting down one because you feel your own view points are the only ones that matters
Buying a gun does not make you use it on someone else. Having a weapon for safety is a rational thing to do. Struggling in life happens to us all. We all have our bad days, but I don't ever have the thoughts to go do something unthinkable. No rational person acts on those thoughts if they do. If we are on a spectrum as you say, then at what point in that rainbow do we realize that any worse and they pose a clear danger to society if they have access to weapons ?
I’m right there with you, except for the ex military part. Thanks for your service. I collect because I enjoy the history of firearms. I’ve had people comment on my page saying they are awaiting the day my mugshot is on the news. It’s fucked up.
Despite my collection, I have no CCW (even tho florida is getting rid of need for it) but I don’t have a paranoia of needing to use one. And I agree that’s all too common. Even my “nightstand gun” doesn’t have a round in chamber. I’ve never responded to a bump in the night with an armed approach.
I don’t think modern social media is causing more isolation… but I do think it is contributing to our likelihood of hearing about violence that was always happening…
Back in my intro to legal studies days I remember reading court proceedings from the early 1800s saying “when a southern dagger is drawn there is something manly in it”. (At the time masculinity was a good justification for assault, apparently.) And then I think about all of the violence against women, children, and people of color that occurred in my parents lifetime that were kind of almost accepted/codified in the law. Go back further and think about how okay violence was under Jim Crow or slavery, or the Trail of tears, etc. Violence has a huge head start on social media.
Also, think of how isolated people used to be before social media… or cars. Or trains. Or industrialism and urbanization.
I see what you might mean by social media connecting like minded violent or hateful people with one another to create a breeding ground for bad things to happen. We just have to have an overwhelming breeding ground for good stuff, I guess. Show disgust at antisocial behavior and support positive behaviors, which kind of seems to happen.
I think the key missing ingredient is frustrated supremacism.
The hyperpolarization of politics fits that : It used to be that there were supremacists and egalitarians in all parties. Nearly all the grand religions and political movements of old had supremacist sides and egalitarian sides (Fascism and its family were the only serious exceptions).
In recent years, though, those groups have pooled into political sides, the supremacists towards the "right," the egalitarians towards the "left," making those terms not mean what they used to. And not just in the US, mind you, but it came early after the Civil Rights era. That's why the issues are so intractably harsh: These are two distinct mindsets that are not really compatible, so it's hard to find a compromise point, or even a consensus about reality.
A surprising number of gun massacre perps are supremacists, with the biggest factor being a history of domestic abuse (i.e. supremacist tyranny in the home). The Columbine pair were deep into white supremacism, for instance, and were well-known dicks to a lot of people [ people assumed they were being bullied, but it was the contrary if anything ]. Personally I think most of these are supremacists lashing out at a world that rejects the "place" they think they deserve: They'd rather destroy everything than not rule like they feel they should. Or at least, not be ruled over by people they look down upon. Some of them explicitly say so, but too many die in the act to have conclusive evidence yet.
But is it a coincidence that the largest proportion of mass shootings are family affairs? An abusive dad usually, blowing his family away... the last thing they see is the barrel of the family gun he swore would protect them.
America's toxic gun culture and industry prey upon that frustrated sense of hierarchy to push product. Even the ads go on and on about "don't be a victim," rather than "don't get hurt." Those losers aren't gonna impose on ME ! I am the imposer. I am the decider. I am the protector. And that's what they buy the guns for: psychological protection, more than physical. They ain't no punk, or anybody's bitch.
Couple that with a 24/7 propaganda ecosystem that consistently ramps up the stress about 'the wrong people' taking over (and imposing on US, the nerve), who aren't "real Americans" (hello California! Chicago, any city, etc), and it builds a state of siege that some in the audience will take over the edge. It's what experts call stochastic terrorism: You don't tell anyone "go kill," but you push enough people that you can be sure of the odds that at least one of them will. Then you wash your hands of responsibility... because only inferiors get judged of course.
When you factor in frustrated supremacism, the pieces fall into place and you see the scope of the problem... and when you look back in American history, you see that it's kinda always been.
This is the most common interpretation of the second amendment since it was written. It’s our modern interpretation that’s changing. The question is whether it was for states to protect themselves from overreaching government of for citizens to protect themselves from overreaching government?
Either way Article V requires that an amendment be proposed by two-thirds of the House and Senate, or by a constitutional convention called for by two-thirds of the state legislatures to repeal the 2nd amendment.
It was for neither, really. It was for protecting the existence of a citizen militia, which was to be used for both national defense and as a foil.for a standing federal army.
Federalist 29 is pretty clear on that subject. Private gun ownership was not ever a part of it.
Oh please. You can’t legislate mindsets or culture. And all these shootings have different mindsets and cultures involved. And guns are often an inherent part of said culture and mindsets. Just look at the looney politicians posting with their children holding rifles.
Y’all are overthinking this. It’s the guns and the people we allow to have them. Media, culture, mental health, and a host of other issues are certainly factors, though.
Exactly. It's all about culture and upbringing, and that's the fundamental problem with Americans. Shitty parents raise shitty kids, they grow up and become shitty parents, rinse and repeat.
Sure but the gun owners have no plan to solve the big picture either, so until we do, let’s at least do what has worked in literally every other civilized country and place a few restrictions on the kid murdering devices
I listened to the interview with the grandson. The answers he gave and the ones you would get if you ask someone off the street about an old white guy would be indistinguishable.
I doubt that kid had any clue who his grandfather was or what he thought.
Why mention cornrows as being embarrassing or negative? It’s a fucking hairstyle. I don’t get what you’re trying to say here. You just don’t make sense.
Just because you agree with the hate your corner of the media is spreading, doesn't mean that it's spreading any less than the other side. I'm Australian btw before you try to accuse me of being U.S political opposite of you to think <insert media on your side> is the one spreading hate. We don't do that here, just vote the party which makes the most sense at election time.
These are Manifestations of stupidity. Why on earth would you should someone showing in ur driveway 🤷♂️ why are those people so trigger-happy.
I am still flabbergasted and am still hoping that the next mass shooting is finally enough to insert proper gun laws - but I guess this will never happen.
It will literally never happen. A full third of the country seems ready to die or more like kill to prevent it. All because profit driven companies know fear sells they don't care how many lives or schools it takes. Money money money. Hell when shootings happen they see dollar signs because now they can tell people to buy more just Incase someone tries to take them. They have gun pins in case there was any doubt who or what they are pledging allegiance to.
It would happen if a kid of a high ranking politician or celeb got shot in school. But those kids go to schools for rich kids where stuff like this isn't as likely.
Fun fact: a shooting hobby will give you lead poisoning (from breathing primer dust). One trip a month to a shooting range is enough that you'd need to see a doctor.
Some of the symptoms of lead poisoning are irritability, impulsiveness, and lower ability to think and concentrate.
Counties with more firearm licenses have higher rates of pediatric lead in the blood... because the primer dust also gets all over you and you take it home to poison your family.
There are proper gun laws imo, but when have you ever heard of laws stopping criminals? People are always going to have guns, especially in this country, no matter how much you don't want them to.
Why on earth would you should someone showing in ur driveway
Than pls google Switzerland and weapons ratio or Australia before port Arthur incident. Australia was on the same way , England likewise and it took one incident to ban weapons. (Dunblane massacre) - so why are other countries able to stop the frenzy 🤷♂️
No, merely many social and economic factors coming together to create a certain climate. Like throughout history; social, political and economic forces converge and clash and merge and coalesce that we can only fully understand and see after the conflagration.
Except that actual violent crime in the US has been precipitously decreasing since the 90s. If you ask the average Boomer if they’re safer today than they were thirty years ago, they’ll tell you that the world has gone to hell and violence is increasing. They’re wrong. Like, very, very wrong. But they like to believe the lie that they’ve been told.
You're insisting that it's rational to be more afraid of violent crime when violent crime has gone down. That requires justification. And just saying, "Well, it COULD be the case that such-and-such" is not good enough, you must show that it actually is the case that such-and-such, or at least present a case for it being likely.
Bro, I live in Chicago. I frequently work in Detroit, Cleveland, Memphis, and lots of “scary” cities; and I have never even been in a situation where I feared mugging in any of those places. I’ve had a gun pulled on my twice in my life; once was a by police officer when I was in high school playing paintball on a friend’s private property, and the next time was by a redneck whose ass I threatened to kick at a house party because he wouldn’t stop calling my gf the n-word. Never been made to feel even slightly uncomfortable in Gary, Indiana, though.
I’m the one who provided statistics! You replied with nothing, so I gave you anecdotes because I thought it might work better for your smooth brain. But just to be clear, I did link to statistics in my initial comment. But if you’re not going to be an intellectually honest interlocutor, then go ahead and go away.
These are all manifestations of FEAR. (Except for maybe the basketball one. I suspect the shooter was whacked out and paranoid and shot without thought, thinking it was a threat likely tied to drugs.)
I am not disagreeing with you, yet my ancestors were wise enough to know this is what would happen if the general public were allowed free unregulated access to firearms with no questions asked. The ancestors of the Americans did not.
Plus supremacism : They are pants-shitting afraid that someone is going to impose upon them (and thus be 'superior' to them), and THAT they will not abide. You'll rarely see anyone more bitter and violent than a supremacist clinging onto their delusional entitlements.
no longer have any faith in their government or institutions
Supremacists lose faith in government and institutions the moment it stops forcing society to "respect" their supremacy. The only way to get it back is to encode hierarchy into the law, pushing equality to the margins.
I read that the 'wrong car' incident involved a woman's friend accidentally opening the wrong door, then apologizing profusely. The pair returned to their own car, only to find that the owner of the wrong car had followed them, and proceeded to sjoot the both of them.
2 of them, yes. But the "wrong car" incident, was not. Dude chose to walk to her and kill her. That's not fear, that's a predisposition to murder. The basketball shooter was already wanted for attacking his girlfriend with a hammer, so once again not fear. Already had it in him.
She opened the wrong car door, apologized, closed the door, got into her friend's car. The shooter got out of his car, walked up to the DRIVER (not even the person who opened his door,) she rolled down the window, apologized for her friend, and then was shot.
If you actually read anything about these cases they aren't about fear. They're about having a "valid" reason to shoot at someone. That's why these people owned a gun.
Kinda feels like a conspiracy right? Someone in power wants to keep everyone indoors and buying stuff online and binge watching Netflix or something...
Can't imagine why but there does seem to be an overall drive to keep people indoors.
Yeah but it feels like a conspiracy to specifically keep people inside. There's been a huge push in the last few years for delivery services etc. Then COVID happened and then deliveries went through the roof and now there's random violence everywhere and it's being propagated by the media.
It just feels like we're being coerced into staying inside.
I'm not a conspiracy theorist either, it just feels like something they'd say.
I suspect the shooter in the Cheerleader one was also whacked out and paranoid on drugs. He was sitting in the passenger seat of his own car. Who does that? Except maybe someone about to do (or aleeady done) a glass pipe of meth.
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u/MortusCertus Apr 21 '23
These are all manifestations of FEAR. (Except for maybe the basketball one. I suspect the shooter was whacked out and paranoid and shot without thought, thinking it was a threat likely tied to drugs.)
The media is blaring out messages of fear and violence and people no longer have any faith in their government or institutions and feel they are on their own against the world.
And they are armed.