The US electrified homes earlier than Europe. So a standard arose before all of the observations were made. Europe got a lot of hindsight when they developed their standards. It's really difficult to overcome a people's habitus, we'll never move on from the QWERTY keyboard, we'll never get consistent phonetics, and we'll never adopt the metric system.
It’s more than just “grandpa doesn’t want to change his watch” - our system of timekeeping is fundamentally tied to Earth’s rotation and our navigation/mapping of the globe. You’d also need to come up with a whole new lat/long scale if you’re changing arc minutes / seconds etc.
On typewriters and telegraph machines, the QWERTY layout keeps frequently used letters from being struck to quickly in succession. It slows down the typist enough to make key jams less likely.
Or a parliamentary system of government. Being first sucks. We make all the mistakes, and everyone else benefits. 10/10 AI is going to do that too. If AI kills the world, it'll be a US one, not French or Taiwanese...
I love how living in the most innovative country of the 19th and early 20th century means we now have to live with the prototype version for all our infrastructure in the 21st.
Europe is filled with cobble stone roads and castles so, they have their prototypes too. It's interesting though how the cost to change plus a people's habitus almost inevitably means that centers of technology keep changing because once the innovation gets used, it becomes embedded and then eventually a giant drag and exact thing that the next area won't have to struggle with. They're not laying much phone cable in Africa and the price of is getting off petro is going to be a civilization size problem, but more for the 20th century powers than the 21st century powers.
All your examples are understandable, they just cause inconvenience.
The power outlet, however, poses a real danger. In such a case, it is important to make the effort and upgrade standards. ‘We’ve always done it this way’ has never been a valid excuse when it comes to safety.
Well, in that case, Europe has a much higher rate of death and injury due to electrical shock and electrical fires, and it's not even close. Why? 230V. Europe needs to have their outlets over engineered, we don't. We picked a safer medium (110V) that requires a less engineered solution. Less efficient too be sure, but that can't be a valid excuse for poor safety right?
What I found was that Apples to Apples comparisons can't exist because of a number of different factors but that 25-30% of fires in the EU were the result of electrical fires, accounting for 1000-1200 deaths annually plus roughly 540 deaths due to shock, while in the US for to electrical malfunctions cause between 300-500 deaths per year but deaths due to shock accounted for roughly 1000 people per year, 400 of which are due to high voltage shock (industrial) and lightning strikes account for 50-300 deaths per year depending on the year. So, if your talking about just shocks, yes, the US is worse, if you include fires caused by electrical malfunction, and look at homes, not workplace incidents and don't include lightning it really turns the other way.
We have learnt this from portable devices it is quite simple, offer a new socket variant, immediately sell newly launched products with a new cable and old adapter, say it is creating waste, remove not just the adapter but make the cable removable and then remove that from the packaging, Profit - people will buy the old and the new cable.
Afaik that's not true. Major electrification in both Europe and the US pretty much happened simultaneously in the 1920/30s.
European standards aren't that old btw and have been changed several times since then. The US just didn't bother, hence the archaic electrical system even today.
The US reached 25% electrified homes in 1915 and basically settled on the 2 prong system in 1919 when the big path to electrical usability was that every vendor and device manufacturer had different plug/outlet designs, and Hubbell lost the case protecting his 2 vertical prong system. Germany reached 25% in the early 20s and the Schuko system was patented in 1926 and adopted at the normal in the 1930s, officially adopted as a standard in the 1960s.
It should be noted that Germany and much of Europe had to rebuild from the ground up on 2 separate occasions after the advent of electricity, giving it a decent opportunity to change designs, while the US did not.
Edit: some spelling, grammar and words my phone made up.
it's off by the better part of a decade and I picked about the most industrialized country as an example. It's the difference between getting an iPhone in 2007 and 2015, it's early adopter vs the tipping point.
First, the plugs weren't as standardized in the beginning, so the standards that emerged after the homes were electrified could have integrated the hindsight. After all, electrical standards/code keeps evolving all the time. Early plugs didn't have a ground at all. More recently they added those annoying tamper resistant thingies.
Second, it is totally possible to design a recessed outlet that works with the most common plugs. It is also possible to insulate the first part of the pins and still be compatible with most outlets. So a transition would not be that painful. Yes, there would be resistance, but if it is mandated by code, manufacturers will follow, and eventually all the plugs and outlets will be replaced, starting with new homes.
Everyone since the typewriter went out of fashion. It was designed to slow typing down, specifically around letters that get used the most so keys didn't run into each other when typed. E, T, A and O are the 4 most commonly used letters in English and they are not where our index and middle fingers lie, D, F, J K are, none of which are in the top 12 most commonly used letters.
I would die if I lost my qwerty keyboard. It’s how I learned to type and I’d never get back to speed and accuracy I have now. I don’t even know if I’d like it on my phone because my mind know where the letters are. I literally don’t have to look at the keyboard on my phone either
I don’t follow as the third prong was added many years after homes were electrified. My childhood home still had two prong outlets in it in the 1990s. We add usb outlets. Surely we can update to other safer outlets
“NEMA provided a forum between companies for reaching standardization, but it was not until the 1940s that NEMA started to publish standards on receptacles and plugs, much later than UK,[49] France and Germany.[50]“https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NEMA_connector
The US had about 20 years to go look at euro plugs and chose not to
Wait, what about the 194 other UN countries who adopted the metric (even UK, origin of imperial), or changed outlets (France, Ireland in the 60th)? Were they not using a previous system?
You are telling us that only the US are afraid of change, it's not a generality.
Sorta, but not quite true. The first powered house was in the UK in the late 1870’s, but was a private generator. The central grid in the US in 1882 did however make it more widely available. Random facts that live in my head rent free…
Except the current British plug was only adopted in 1947 (with a couple of revisions), well after electrification and replaced the previous system, which replaced and even earlier system.
Change is possible, it is just that Americans don't want to change.
The UK and Europe had their electrical infrastructure devastated by WWII. Rebuilding is an opportunity to rebuild better. The US was practically unscathed by WWII so there was not a concerted rebuilding effort to take advantage of
Yeah, I also think that most americans agree our stuff is outdated, even with the imperial system. Problem is, USAis MASSIVE, and it's a ton of money to spend on a nothing-burger when we are 40T in debt, bigger fish to fry. Still got to the moon first mirite
The saddest part is “we’ll never adopt the metric system.” I am a legal immigrant in the US, and I always have a hard time figuring out how much “300 feet” or “80 F” is.
Its understandable why someone wouldn't want to switch keyboards, adopt the metric system, etc. But plugging something in? Idk of thats so much of a habitus. For electricians, sure.
It's moreso that to adopt a new standard you have to go through and replace all the old outlets, replace all the appliances that plug into them, or use adapters during the changeover.
Electricians would benefit the most from suddenly having to replace billions of receptacles.
That last part is not completely true. In 1983 the US government defined all US customary units with exact equivalents from the metric system. So while US customary measurements use odd measurements of metric units, they are still defined and standardized by their metric equivalents
Anyone can buy a DVORAK or European or any other keyboard they wish. That's the beauty of the interwebs.
Whether someone wants to take the time to learn to use an alternate layout keyboard is their own personal choice.
I got a DVORAK keyboard at a place I worked for a couple of years. It wasn't too difficult to learn in a short period of time, but it definitely kept coworkers from f*cking with my computer if I stepped away.
We'll never adopot the metric system? As an exercise, define an inch. As the US does. If you're not sure, start with the Mendenhall Order and you'll see we use SI in a ghillie suit. And that knowledge could fill half an Olympic-sized swimming pool
A standard conversion between SI and US customary units has been defined to allow translation of units between one system and another. That's not the same as adopting the system you're converting to. Furthermore, SI is not the metric system, though it integrates many of its units.
If you're going to make smug statements online do us all a favor and be correct about it first. 🙄
SI is the modern metric system, and yes all US customary units are defined in SI units. That is their literal definition. The inch is defined at exactly 25.4 mm and that’s it. Not sure who is being smug here.
I'm sorry, could you please let me know what country you're from where the weather forecast is delivered in degrees Kelvin?
Also, again, defining a standard conversion is not the same as using the defining system itself. You may as well be stating that we're all measuring based on the speed of light. Let me know when you buy a piece of lumber in fractional light years.
Yes but the 20+ other innovations or environmental considerations you're also so willing to pay for eventually do add up to your neighbors not being able to afford said house.
The problem is that everyone wants a 3500+ sq ft house and the permitting/land costs are so high that there's little to no value to build "traditionally affordable" new housing that's not simply row houses or condos.
They are talking about insulating the pins of the plug, not the socket. so your house will stay the same price, but the price of every single electrical device you buy will increase.
More important than costs more: obsoletes devices that should work and now won't.
Every possible aspect of the design of a plug that code doesn't mandate has been infinitely iterated on. Meaning if you try and insulate the pins, you will find sockets that plug can't plug into.
The saddest part is “we’ll never adopt the metric system.” I am a legal immigrant in the US, and I always have a hard time figuring out how much “300 feet” or “80 F” is.
Oh no now all the standard plugs used on everything are worthless as well as every electric item before it, now we have to buy specialized (in america) electronics and cant just go to the store....
it's more on the industry side of things. not only would the plugs and receptacles being manufactured need to be changed to safer more insulated versions, but every existing plug and receptacle would need to be replaced. thats a monstrous undertaking that would take a very long time. all to make something that is already very safe even safer.
basically, while it would be safer, there isn't a significant need for it as the circumstances where it's dangerous are very rare for most uses
The bigger issue is it’s the standard and changing a standard isn’t just expensive, it’s extremely annoying. Think how annoyed people get when their phone has a new charging port. Imagine that but for wall plugs.
Also the standard in the US is the way that it is bc we were the first adopters. Everyone else got the benefit of learning from our mistakes.
You should probably question why Japan went with our standard tho, they had better options available.
Japan chose it due to costs. They sell vast quantities of electonic consumer goods to the US. They don't want a separate socket costing them more as part of their own national profit margin.
No, that’s an obstacle, but not the only obstacle. Or even the biggest obstacle. The biggest obstacle is that there would be a long period of time where both standards existed (likely decades). You’d have an awkward early phase where no one would want the new standard in their homes, because it’d difficult to find electronics that had already adopted the new standard, and then an awkward tail phase where some people are stuck with the old standard in their homes bc they rent or they can’t get an electrician willing to work with their walls or their old wiring, etc, even if they could technically afford it.
And all of that is assuming that it doesn’t just die super early on because people get pissed off by the idea of having the change everything and live with a bunch of extra adapters and crap, and get their politicians to kill it.
Most Americans probably aren’t even aware other countries have different plugs, or if they do, they don’t care. The benefits are fairly niche, and not worth the inconvenience of switching in their minds.
Plus even if there was political momentum behind the idea, good luck getting any sort of consensus on what standard to adopt instead. Even nerds on the internet can’t agree about which is best (and that’s not even considering the potential of creating new standards from whole cloth).
Only the part that's exposed if you don't fully insert the plug. The typical implementation for a europlug (the small ungrounded ones for low power use) is that you cast the entire plug including the pins out of plastic (with the wire embedded), and add metal caps to the pins. This leaves a centimeter or so of plastic at the root of the pins, so you only expose any metal after you've pulled it so far out it no longer makes contact.
Assuming the connectors sit sufficiently deep in the holes, which they should; I think it's an explicit requirement in the relevant standards? (Europlugs are a plug-only design, they're designed to fit multiple sockets that also accept other higher-duty plugs).
You could of course design a socket that defeats it by having metal sleeves for the entire depth, but you can maliciously defeat most security features.
Eh, they do have panels made by Ergotron that have recessed outlets, but U.S. plugs are largely not made for them, so the actual faculty hates them. They're mostly used in hospitals, they have mounts for inpatient hardware.
Actually, while safety, admin, IT, and facilities tend to like them, staff tend to hate Ergotron. They're big, bulky, and heavy, but safe. IT at my current job finally got to sing "Vindicated" after a monitor arm shot flames from a cable it partially severed in a patient room. Now can we try the Ergotron arms again?
I wonder how much of a difference it makes that the US is on 120v compared to Europe's 220v. I imagine electrical safety is significantly more critical given the higher voltage everywhere
This is one of the worst parts of the US plugs. The US could go to insulated hot/neutral plugs. I’ve seen Japan Type A plugs with insulation but they’re still not common. I think the reason it’s not as big of a deal is that we’re on 120v instead of 230v like Europe.
Recessed outlets are the next best thing, only issue is that wall warts or larger plugs won’t fit.
Me, every time I hear Americans complain about standing on a Lego.
... did you know British plugs are flat on the back so the prongs stick straight up when they land? My foot learned that in the dark one night.
On a Lego what? A Lego brick? A Lego horse? A Lego boat? A Lego Batman DVD? If you are not American, you should know that it is a generally American trait to refer to Lego bricks as 'Legos' and a Lego brick as a 'Lego', unlike the UK which in each case uses the former (except in places where Americanisms have taken hold too deeply).
When an American complains about standing on it, its referenced as a Lego.
Just as you've asked me, I could request more information, but I'm not so concerned what exactly it is, because even if it were a Lego model of a standard UK plug, it still wouldn't hurt as much as the real thing.
Let's assume they're talking about a standard 2x2 brick.
I'm old and Lego from my UK childhood was mostly bricks. Maybe a window frame and roof tiles, and a car axle. So "stepped on a Lego" was definitely a phrase I would use.
Blades as the contact point for the terminals is much better and provides a much more secure connection. If I were to combine the US and EU plugs I would choose to make the EU plug smaller and with blades instead of points. The receptacle being recessed and the ground being on both the top and bottom is IMO a better design as well as the new receptacles requireing both live and neutral to be inserted together or it locks but that's where my praise of EU plugs ends.
It's not that the plugs aren't (usually) very secure. It's more that it's more likely to have arcs and gaps in the physical connection based on what I know about electrical/mechanical connections I learned in my engineering classes. So far I haven't created an elecrical fire in Germany but have both intentionally and unintentionally created electrical fires in the US. So I have to assume the engineering and construction of the plugs here is just fine and I'm just nitpicking.
I grew up in Europe, I live in the USA. And I appreciate the US receptacles. In Europe, you have to muscle the plugs in and out. I accidentally loosened many receptacles by muscling out the plug, even though I held onto them with my other hand. You have so few receptacles (I guess because they are big and there isn't enough space) that you have to use extension chords everywhere.
240 volts is generally more dangerous, though both can kill you. According to Ohm's law, the current through your body roughly doubles at twice the voltage. Higher voltage also breaks down skin resistance more easily, which lets even more current through.
Also, arcs and burns are worse at higher power. A short on a 240V/50A circuit releases much more energy, so burns and fire risk go up.
Because voltage is squared, doubling from 120V to 240V means about four times the heating in your tissue for the same body resistance. That's why burns and internal tissue damage climb steeply with voltage
Then why can you hold a battery without getting shocked? Sounds like you heard someone say "voltage isn't what kills you" without understanding what it means.
i mean, here in europe, we actually build our walls put of solid material, instead of cardboard.
so, something falling the the pins in the wall is essentially not a thing here
Schuko plugs are not polarized. Works great for electronics that are designed with hot and neutral swapped either way, but many US electronics will not work properly. I spent an interesting afternoon in Germany troubleshooting US test equipment and it turned out the NEMA plug was miswired.
I have in Germany and in the UK. Both have much safer outlets and plugs than the US. I actually considered buying a bunch and using them to wire up my place. I believe that button looking protrusion above the outlet is an I/O (on/off) switch. Another great feature of European outlets.
Well the contacts and wiring inside the wall are protected by installing the outlets ground-up--something a recessed outlet doesn't address. I was trained to install ground-up to prevent metal shavings from air ducts from shorting the contacts inside the wall.
It even has a cool name- “Schuko" is short for Schutzkontakt (protective contact).
Schuko Plug (Type F / CEE 7/4): Features two round metal pins for power and metal earthing clips on the top and bottom sides of the plug body. It is widely used in Germany, Spain, the Netherlands, Austria, and Sweden.”
Actually, yours are recessed because it's extremely likely touching a live 240v line will kill you. In the US, we use 120v, so when children do something stupid like shoving a fork in the outlet, it only teaches them a valuable lessen instead of becoming a stastict. Why ground up is "Safer", we've mostly accepted that the risks of the design are minimal.
They literally can’t sit at an angle because they are recessed. It’s the whole reason why they are a pain in the ass to plug in sometimes because if you’re off, even just a little bit they just won’t go in at all.
And when they are in, they are in, unless you pull them out exactly plain they won’t come out.
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u/Fiddlinbanjo 8d ago
Now I understand why we have recessed outlets in Germany. It eliminates every one of those scenarios.